Getting a job - from the employers perspective

LCinTraining · Oct 11, 2012

Not calling you out in particular - just making a point and using your post to demonstrate so no offense intended personally. Ok!If you were a DON you would understand that this hiring blitz I'm currently in the midst of is an additional task in amongst all the other crap pouring onto my desk by the minute. While I'm sorting thru 50-100 resumes I'm NOT doing the rest of my duties. While I'm spending time on the phone trying to call people to setup appointments, I'm NOT doing the rest of my duties. While I'm spending time interviewing, I'm NOT doing the rest of my duties. My point to anyone looking for a position that is posted a distance away from your current location...add it to the cover letter that you realize you are a distance away but a) intend to move to the area b) acknowledge you are aware of the distance and feel the commute is workable for you. Because of this thread & all your comments I did take the time to call 3 candidates that I had previously put in my due not call pile. I kid you not, ALL 3 HAD NO CLUE where the facility was even located and one voiced her shock that I was 2 states away. I did go back and look at my ad and it clearly states the street, city and state address. This turned out to be a complete waste of time but it is educational for all of you - acknowledge that distance in a cover letter so you are not automatically disqualified. I'm sure I'm not the only hiring manager who would otherwise see it as a waste of their time. Had 5 interviews scheduled today. 1 great candidate, 1 so-so candidate, 1 called early to politely reschedule, 2 no-call no-shows!

That's just insane. I'm sorry you had that experience. I have never placed that type of information on a cover letter, honestly. It has actually never come up. I've gotten every position I've ever applied for except two. Perhaps they were because of distance, but I think not, considering many people in my town worked there. I think it had more to do with my lack of experience at the time. Really though, the job I truly wanted I was hired for, with no mention of my commute by me or them. I am coming up in a year there and am still in love, in spite of how exhausting it can be at times lol.Hopefully you get some good candidates that are committed regardless of distance.

kcmylorn · Oct 14, 2012

What about the older experienced nurse with only an diploma and 30 years of acute care experience that hasn't been able to get a full time steady position in 4 years and have some how managed to scrimp by on one temp position after another( the key word here is temporary) because first and for the sake of argument: The excuses I have heard is: we have the poor economy and every on is laying off, "BSN required" or "BSN prefurrrrred( as in cat fur)"or "recent" acute care experience- recent being defined as what ever the(b) witch behind the desk says it is. I wonder after listing all these temporary positions on a resume, what does that look like????????????? But I don't think too many hiring managers give a rats behind- they just assume."this many jobs in 4 years!!!" not I don't give them any credit for any brains.

What I think the real problem is: my age. I don't have the Farrah fawcet teeth from the American Dental Association, I'm not a size 000 and my name isn't something out of the current baby book name trends ending with an "ie" or a cutesy 'y' o ra 'tabatha' and the IQ to match, or am mommy's little pet princess. Oh and I'm not good at dumbing things down nor do I have the 'duh' mentality.

If this sounds bitter and angry, Welll!!!!!!!!!!!!!!DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was finally able to begin finishing my BSN, only because I am unemployed and qualified for state aid. It is 1/2 way through the semester and I have a 4.0 average. and as crazy as it sounds- I am getting my BSN only to get the HE** out of nursing. A Bachelors degree is a bachelors degree. I am going to do something so totally unrelated to the world of nusing, a world i hope to shut the door on and leave long behind. Why the BSN- because I had 89 credits toward it over 25 years ago. I hope to never have to use that sacred BSN. Not after the financial and emotional ruin nursing has oput me in because of dumb managers who the dumber a person is, the higher they advance. There's another reason I don't have a full time job- I seem to threaten their poor fragile egos, I am told to "Do me a favor, don't tell people what you know" This was said to me verbatium at the last temp position by my last nursing supervisor with only 1/3 the experience as I. The idiot got mad at me and who told me to send a male 38 yr patient out the door with out being seen for " the skin peeling" off his hands" she called it a "rash", "He doesn't need to be see!", "He is wasting the doctors time!". And me being the stubbron old nurse I am, interviewed this guy because of the way he looked/pale/ashen before I let him out the door and found, The patient was a cancer patient having a chemotherapy reaction to Sutent( I was an oncology nurse for 18 years)- his BP was 220/100 and he had a kidney removed for renal cell ca, 3 weeks prior. Madam BSN, RN for the ED, wanted him out the door. Do I sound fed up???? I am the one who can't get a full time job??? but survive on temporary positions. I have many more stories to expose. Nursing can "let's dumb it down". Another favorite of mine is the trendy 20 somethings with the ie on the end of their names at a nursing agency- keeps sending me a tele stepdown nurse to LTC shifts. after I stopped doing shifts for the agency because I found a temp position on my own, I look at "my profile" on their website- there is no mention of any acute care experience at all. No wonder I couldn't get a contract position in any hospital- that is career murdering, not to mention the financial devastation it has done.

A BSN with 5 years experience who let the unit secretary triage a 11 month baby who fell off the bed and was screaming with abdominal pain when he had to poop, triaged the kid into the doctor's office and when I asked her what she was doing her response was "it's ok, I got him an appointment for today" no xray capability in the office at all. The kid should have been taken to the ED. That incident, the ward secretary and the BSN that let her do it, I reported to the state depart of Health for unsafe and unlicensed practice of nursing. The office was issued a deficiency with every 6 month checks for their following of corrective action. I could go on and on.

CapeCodMermaid, RN · Oct 14, 2012

I'd hire a diploma nurse any day. One of my last hires "only" has a diploma. She's the only new grad who could hit the floor running.

New_Man_Nurse · Oct 15, 2012

I am the DON in a LTC facility. I currently have ads on careerbuilder for a full time CNA position as well as a full time LPN/RN position. Both positions are clearly advertised as 3-11 positions. I spent my day going thru what seemed like a hundred resumes for my 2 open positions. While thinking of all the "job needed" threads here, I decided that I must share my absolute frustration in hopes that someone will learn something from this.
- One resume with NO NAME. Seriously people. This isn't 2nd grade. If you can't put your name on your paper...YOU'RE OUT!
- 3 resumes (all submitted within 72 hours) without a WORKING phone number on them....you're out!
- 10...as in TEN, seemed to be surprised that I only have a 3-11 position open. "Don't you have a day shift"? "Don't you have something in management"? Umm, No, which is why I didn't advertise for that.
- At least 10 that haven't held the same job (any job) for more than 3 consecutive months over the last 3-5 years. (Why go thru this hell just to start again in a couple months).
- Several for a CNA position that live at least an hour or more away. (There are numerous facilities between home and here. Surely that drive..in a snowstorm..is not going to worth the $9/hr I plan to offer).
After several hours of weeding thru resumes and trying to call people, I have a whooping 4 interviews tomorrow. Hoping the interview process is better than the screening process! Also slightly worried that amongst all the crap I missed the hidden gem!
-

Clearly there is something wrong. This is good feedback, no name, no phone number, no flexibility for shifts, worried about the reason a CNA wants to drive for work prejudging the reason a starving CNA needs a job. No job history (in a recession). Missing the Gem!

First of all Career builder is not the place to be finding the person for the position to be hiring. Career builder has ruined the ability of serious job searchers to get to the decision maker and make contact. Communication is dead in this country. I worked for Microsoft before becoming a RN, and I know a little about these so called job engines.

As long as employers think that this is the way to find serious candidates for hire, sitting around reading emails then we are all in trouble and we are. Not only do I have a high GPA (incredibly) but I am a tremendous RN. Seriously in today's world of ridiculous patient ratio's, managements refusal to hire new grads, and the over reliance on technology no wonder even the job seeker is tired.

If you don't like your own hiring process then seriously why not change it? There is an overabundance of qualified grads and seasoned nurses available. Career builder is nothing but a career destroyer. It is crap. So is the way management goes about the process of finding qualified and desperate job seekers. Most of the managers I meet are not qualified to carry out any computer related task, yet they think they know what they are doing. Through away your computer and your chair cushion and go find an enthusiastic qualified RN and offer them a fair deal. Don't stab them in the back when they tell you that 30 patients are too many to provide a safe level of care for.

I'm just saying seriously get the job done there are people around you every day that have nothing but qualified friends dying to have a place to practice, and will work like dogs for you. If I were you I'd be frustrated too.

CP2013 · Oct 15, 2012

OP. maybe if some of these frustrated DON and hiring mangers spent some time on the All Nurses resume forum, you could help candidates perfect their resumes to your liking.

I went on there and posted my resume. Got no response. And here I am applying to hundreds of jobs and can't get a call back. And probably because my resume hasn't been critiqued by anyone who understands what DON/hiring managers etc are thinking and what they are looking for.

Just a thought.

CapeCodMermaid, RN · Oct 15, 2012

I haven't seen "an overabundance of qualified new grads and seasoned nurses." Out if 10 interviews, I'm lucky to find one qualified applicant.We advertise in the local papers and on Monster. YOU may think every applicant is qualified, but seeing that we care for the frailest population, my standards are quite high.

kcmylorn · Oct 15, 2012

cape cod- like CP2013 posted, what do you define as 'qualified' what are you looking for in a nurse to hire to do LTC?

And like New Man posted- maybe it's not the candidates but the hiring managers that are not "qualified" I have to say, what I have come accross in nursing managers and nursing supervisors over the past 8 years, I think New Man is right. I find managers hwo don't know their "nursing material" It's like they were asleep or playing hookie from nursing school which goes alsong with what Professor Pat Benner( From Novice to Expert) said in her lasted book and current lectures to major Universities. Nursing is not concepualizing the material. I have nursing managers hauling me into the office and asking me the to defend my self on material THEY should know EXAMPLE: One nurse manager on my last acute care unit a cardiac stepdown questioned me why, when a dialysis patient, in isolation for MRSA, with and infected right great toe, no history of diabetes was having a hypoglycemic episode, I gave her ginger ale with sugar instead of the old stand by of orange juice hint: this lady was on telemetry. Answer: orange juice is high in POTASSIUM, what is the one thing you don't give a dialysi patient, what kinds of diets are dialysis patients on- LOW potassium diets why, their kidneys are shot and they cant excrete potassium, High potassium cause what kinds of arrythmias?? And this nurse manager is going for her MASTER"s in what- stupid and why is she a MANAGER of a stepdown cardiac unit?? and it was one of her newer nurses that reported me to her- It's called dumb and dumber. How did these 2 RN's pass nursing boards with out knowing this.? This is a critical care unit!!! They still have their jobs, I'm on unemployment- go figure( the outcome for the patient: I reported it to the nephrologist how came in an re wrote her dialysis orders, then another RN who has also been on that floor for years pipes up: Oh, KC, she's been doing that for 2 WEEKS!!!, That patient was septic and I had to send her down to the MICU that evening

My conclusion after what I have seen this past 4 years: The incometent nurse are employed and the competent ones are unemployed. Those nurses who struggled with the nursing science are employed why because when the doo doo hits the fan, they don't make good witnesses in a law suite- it's the DUH mentality. That's the qualifications of the new nursing work force. The DUMB it down. There is a lack of grasping of the nursing science.

allnurses Guide · Oct 15, 2012

Clearly there is something wrong. This is good feedback, no name, no phone number, no flexibility for shifts, worried about the reason a CNA wants to drive for work prejudging the reason a starving CNA needs a job. No job history (in a recession). Missing the Gem!
First of all Career builder is not the place to be finding the person for the position to be hiring. Career builder has ruined the ability of serious job searchers to get to the decision maker and make contact. Communication is dead in this country. I worked for Microsoft before becoming a RN, and I know a little about these so called job engines.
As long as employers think that this is the way to find serious candidates for hire, sitting around reading emails then we are all in trouble and we are. Not only do I have a high GPA (incredibly) but I am a tremendous RN. Seriously in today's world of ridiculous patient ratio's, managements refusal to hire new grads, and the over reliance on technology no wonder even the job seeker is tired.
If you don't like your own hiring process then seriously why not change it? There is an overabundance of qualified grads and seasoned nurses available. Career builder is nothing but a career destroyer. It is crap. So is the way management goes about the process of finding qualified and desperate job seekers. Most of the managers I meet are not qualified to carry out any computer related task, yet they think they know what they are doing. Through away your computer and your chair cushion and go find an enthusiastic qualified RN and offer them a fair deal. Don't stab them in the back when they tell you that 30 patients are too many to provide a safe level of care for.
I'm just saying seriously get the job done there are people around you every day that have nothing but qualified friends dying to have a place to practice, and will work like dogs for you. If I were you I'd be frustrated too.

I got my job through CareerBuilder as well as another poster here (she as DON). Since they both indicated they've had success with them in the past, I wouldn't want anyone to miss an opportunity based on your absolute statement about them.

CP2013 · Oct 15, 2012

cape cod- like CP2013 posted, what do you define as 'qualified' what are you looking for in a nurse to hire to do LTC?
And like New Man posted- maybe it's not the candidates but the hiring managers that are not "qualified" I have to say, what I have come accross in nursing managers and nursing supervisors over the past 8 years, I think New Man is right. I find managers hwo don't know their "nursing material" It's like they were asleep or playing hookie from nursing school which goes alsong with what Professor Pat Benner( From Novice to Expert) said in her lasted book and current lectures to major Universities. Nursing is not concepualizing the material. I have nursing managers hauling me into the office and asking me the to defend my self on material THEY should know EXAMPLE: One nurse manager on my last acute care unit a cardiac stepdown questioned me why, when a dialysis patient, in isolation for MRSA, with and infected right great toe, no history of diabetes was having a hypoglycemic episode, I gave her ginger ale with sugar instead of the old stand by of orange juice hint: this lady was on telemetry. Answer: orange juice is high in POTASSIUM, what is the one thing you don't give a dialysi patient, what kinds of diets are dialysis patients on- LOW potassium diets why, their kidneys are shot and they cant excrete potassium, High potassium cause what kinds of arrythmias?? And this nurse manager is going for her MASTER"s in what- stupid and why is she a MANAGER of a stepdown cardiac unit?? and it was one of her newer nurses that reported me to her- It's called dumb and dumber. How did these 2 RN's pass nursing boards with out knowing this.? This is a critical care unit!!! They still have their jobs, I'm on unemployment- go figure( the outcome for the patient: I reported it to the nephrologist how came in an re wrote her dialysis orders, then another RN who has also been on that floor for years pipes up: Oh, KC, she's been doing that for 2 WEEKS!!!, That patient was septic and I had to send her down to the MICU that evening
My conclusion after what I have seen this past 4 years: The incometent nurse are employed and the competent ones are unemployed. Those nurses who struggled with the nursing science are employed why because when the doo doo hits the fan, they don't make good witnesses in a law suite- it's the DUH mentality. That's the qualifications of the new nursing work force. The DUMB it down. There is a lack of grasping of the nursing science.

KC...

Sometimes it's not what you say it's how you say it. I completely get where you are coming from and have absolutely been where you are (not as a nurse). I find that the ones that are kept on staff, tend to do what's right quietly. They don't make a big fuss and they try to avoid anyone.

For instance, I had a coworker who refused to wear gloves. Even on contact rooms. She wore the gown but no gloves. We worked nights. And she was dubbed "bath queen" by the day shift. She would bath all of her patients at night. She would go from MRSA room to Cdiff room to standard room. No gloves.

She remains at the facility and I do not. I spoke up when my patient became her patient and all of a sudden my CLEAN patient became a CDiff patient. He died from vagal stimulation. I kid you not, I know she killed that man unnecessarily.

So from now on, I report what I see to charge, if he/she won't listen I go to the unit manager. I will not stop advocating for my patients but I do it in a more quiet and poised manner. Perhaps a philosophy you could adopt?

I know being unemployed and seeing some of these ridiculous people working can be a challenge. Try not to let it make you bitter. Tweak your resume. Volunteer with facilities to get your name out there in a positive light. Try helping at a local school so you get some hands on experience with kids. Help with sports physicals. Help with vaccination clinics.

I know you are intelligent and a true patient advocate who knows what to do when a patient goes south. Do not let this hurdle bitter you. Do not let this get you down. Use it as motivation to do better, work harder, and be there for your patients. Don't your patients deserve competent care? What kind of nurse do you think your patients want? What kind of nurse would your family member want in their time of illness?

Good luck in your pursuits!

kcmylorn · Oct 15, 2012

In continuing with the same vein as New Man suggests: I have another experience I would like to share. I went for an interview back in 2010 while still working perdeim at the cardiac speciality facility, for a med/surg/tele float position at a large University hospital in Newark, Nj. I am interviewed by the "manager of ICU" at this point I have had 8 years of critical care experience- icu,ccu,endoscopy, tele and cardic post open heart stepdown' who asks me what I would give in a code situation for a patient with V T. I answered this paragone/walking book of clinical expertise of critical care knowledge, Amiodarone. She proceeds to argue and fight and very aggressively stated I was wrong, that it's lidocaine that used. I left the interview scratching my head wondering if I mis heard all those cardiac fellows I was working around, on how lidocaine is now falling out of favor and amiodarone is the drug of choice. Well on Oct 1,2 2012 I took my ACLS course and guess which drug is the drug of choice according to the American Heart Association in it's algorithms for VT---------AMIODARONE!! no lidocaine. May be that nurse manager should write to the AHA and tell them how bright she is and and fight and get argumentative with them.

It is just like the old military saying goes: Those who can do, do. Those who can't lead!! If one can not conceptualize your nursing science-- go into managemnt and real show off you dumb skills.

Like I said-- many stories to tell and I will expose them!!!

The advertising in all the papers, Monster and other job boards is just to keep of the depart of labor off their backs. With the unemployment rate so high, it doesn't speak well of healthcare to turn candidates away and not hire. This bit about"gualified" candidates is rubbish. CEO's and administrators and owners just want to keep money in their own poscketsw especially now when the unemployment stats have been questioned in this election. The New mediare law is a good thing. The CMS/Medicare aka governement aka taxpayer money will no longer pay for the patient who has to return to the hospital with in days after being discharged because the hospital didn't do its job, because the hopsital refuses to hire enough nursing staff to do it's job. The hospital CEO and their fincancial Czars wants to hold on to their million dollar paycheck and continues to scrimp on competent care and the staffing numbers to deliver that competent so some old CEO and financial Czars can get richer. If the patient returns to the prior hospital to Oct 1, 2012, days within discharge there is another claim submitted for insurance money for the samepatient, and the way I understood that was the closer to the day of discharge, the greater the reimbursement that hospital rceived. CMS hired a slew of investigators back in 2010-2011 and alot of doctors and nurses and nursing homes were busted for medicare fraud. The hospitals are just the latest on this crack down. These CEO and their accomplises have been bilking the system for years and were going to continue to do so, they want to keep stuffing their pockets with cash from the medicare fund so there would be nothing left for Joe public, CEO's and their finacnical czars and adminstrators and owners don't need medicare in their old age with million dollar paydays year in and year out.

Nascar nurse, ASN, RN · Oct 15, 2012

I have to wonder if the chip on the shoulder shines through in the interviews.

CP2013 · Oct 15, 2012

I have to wonder if the chip on the shoulder shines through in the interviews.

My thoughts exactly. If you are older, say 50+ that may be the issue, but also it may be more accepted as an older nurses wisdom. But I get the distinct feeling the poster is young, has that chip on her shoulder, and has burned many bridges. Nursing is a diverse field. But it's a small world when it comes to black listing individuals.