Nursing Issue - Medication Aides - page 6

Hi. I am new to the post. Very shortly a bill will be presented to our legislation on Medication Aides for my state. I am looking for some feedback regarding these aides. I know other programs... Read More

  1. by   Marie_LPN, RN
    Quote from caye
    CMA's have a certification that is on the line. That is if they want to work as a CMA and not on the floor as a CNA. There butt IS on the line.
    Caye
    Along with the nurse's. :stone
  2. by   caye
    Along with yours, the ADON, DON, Administrator, Executive Director, etc.
    Their butt is also on the line for whatever mistakes you make.
    Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA.
    However, as ADON I left the position because I got tired of being on call and having nurses call with stupid questions and they just wanted to write that the ADON was notified thinking that that got them off the hook. (It doesn't)
    I mean really stupid things like telling me the admission was there and what do they do? They knew what to do when I asked them.
    Everyone above you, well lets just say their butts are on the line too.
    Caye


    Quote from Marie_LPN
    Along with the nurse's. :stone
  3. by   Marie_LPN, RN
    Quote from caye
    Along with yours, the ADON, DON, Administrator, Executive Director, etc.
    Their butt is also on the line for whatever mistakes you make.
    Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA.
    However, as ADON I left the position because I got tired of being on call and having nurses call with stupid questions and they just wanted to write that the ADON was notified thinking that that got them off the hook. (It doesn't)
    I mean really stupid things like telling me the admission was there and what do they do? They knew what to do when I asked them.
    Everyone above you, well lets just say their butts are on the line too.
    Caye
    And everyone "above" me choses to do this. I'm saying i choose NOT to risk it. I worked hard to get were i am, and i'm not taking chances of delegating medication resposibilities, therefore, will not work in a place that does this.
  4. by   caye
    You don't have to worry, in Texas at least, CMA's do not work in OR's or anywhere in a hospital setting.
    Caye




    Quote from Marie_LPN
    And everyone "above" me choses to do this. I'm saying i choose NOT to risk it.
  5. by   caroladybelle
    Quote from caye
    Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA.
    Thus is the problem. The limited amount of education/training that the CMAs receive does not remotely "qualify" them for safe administration of meds. And have to "supervise" 2-5 CMAs with the vital conditions/medications/treatments of all of their patients is much harder than having a reasonable patient load and administering meds yourself as an RN.
  6. by   Marie_LPN, RN
    Quote from caye
    You don't have to worry, in Texas at least, CMA's do not work in OR's or anywhere in a hospital setting.
    Caye
    Wasn't worried in the first place.

    I'm done here.
    Last edit by Marie_LPN, RN on Apr 6, '05
  7. by   caye
    I did not say ALL CMA's were qualified. I said many CMA's are. It is the same as in all jobs in our profession. There are many nurses that are not qualified as well. Where do you work? Are you in LTC?
    Caye



    Quote from caroladybelle
    Thus is the problem. The limited amount of education/training that the CMAs receive does not remotely "qualify" them for safe administration of meds. And have to "supervise" 2-5 CMAs with the vital conditions/medications/treatments of all of their patients is much harder than having a reasonable patient load and administering meds yourself as an RN.
  8. by   txspadequeenRN
    I am a LTC nurse in Texas. I work the weekends only and my primary job is to function as a Med-aide . They allow me to do this because I am the fill in nurse when needed and I am also the on call nurse. One of my other jobs is to supervise student med aides during their 10 [U]hour clinical. Now, one of the things that amazes me is that these students have no clue what any pill is for, much less side effects. When I say "Ok now that is a Toprol tab, what is that for and what do you have to do before you give that pill". Most of the answers are "I dont know or something completly off the wall. I would not have so much of a problem with med aides if I knew they were trained right and had more clinical. The requirment here is 10 hours, what can you learn in 10 hours. When you hit the floor to pass meds you need at deep knowledge of at least the common drugs given in LTC. This just does not happen while they are a student and as a result our patients are at risk.
  9. by   txspadequeenRN
    OH MY!!!!







    Quote from Penguinurse
    I work as a hospice field manager, and deal with a few assisted living facilities that use med techs. As an RN, I can tell you it's truly frustrating to have nonlicensed staff giving meds to my terminal patients! I have one ALF that won't allow our patients to receive Roxanol (liquid morphine) unless their local pharmacy draws up individual syringes of the med. This means that instead of a bottle with an eye dropper for dosing, the techs have about a hundred individual syringes, each with 0.25ml of morphine in them! When I ordered a regular bottle of Roxanol from our mail-order pharmacy, you'd have thought I'd tried to kill someone - apparently, at this ALF, the med techs can't count liquid meds. The facility RN told me that in the past, the techs had been off count by bottles - yes, BOTTLES, not ml's - of Roxanol. :uhoh21:
  10. by   txspadequeenRN
    The only person that should be fooling with blood sugars and insulins is the nurse... Period. And the doctors orders are way out of their scope of practice. I know you are just presenting the facts and Im not fussing at you. SO dont take me wrong.





    Quote from lizz
    Here's some interesting info on the training and other requirements which, apparently, vary widely from state to state. Check out this link. It gives a run down on each state's requirements.

    http://www.alfa.org/membersonly/arti...e_Spec_Rpt.pdf

    4 states require 8 hours training
    3 states require 16 hours
    3 states require 20 hours
    5 states require 40 hours
    3 states require 60 hours
    6 states do not list a specific number of hours (huh?)

    6 states require that medication aides become CNA's first.

    Other interesting info:

    12 states restrict medication aides exclusively to assisted living centers
    10 states restrict them to assisted living and skilled nursing centers
    8 states restrict them to assisted living, adult day care and residential care.

    What meds can be administered by medication aides?

    With few exceptions, most states allow medication aides to administer orals, suppositories, topical creams, eye and ear drops, nasal sprays and inhalants.

    Insulin:

    6 states allow medication aides to draw up and administer insulin shots. 6 states allow them to hand out pre-filled insulin shots, 7 states allow them to administer pre-filled shots. 7 states don't allow insulin injections at all.

    Blood Sugar:

    18 states allow medication aides to test blood sugar, 10 states don't.

    PRN Drugs:

    22 states allow PRN meds to be administered. 2 states allow PRN meds to be administered after a nurse delivers the first dose. 5 states don't allow PRN meds.

    Doctor's Orders:

    17 states don't allow medication aides to take doc's orders. 5 states do allow medication aides to administer doc orders that are signed and faxed (nurse consultation is sometimes required). 2 states allow medication aides to take doc orders verbally. 4 states allow med aides to take doc orders but the orders must be signed/faxed.

    :uhoh21:
  11. by   boulergirl
    Well, I made a big decision today. At the staff meeting this afternoon our boss asked each of us to decide if we want to be a med tech or not. Very few hands went up. (Well, I wonder why. ) I chose NOT to raise my hand because I no longer want the responsibility. So as of today's date next month, I will no longer be a med tech and will probably have my hours reduced because there will be too many nurse's aides on the floor (it's just as well--I need an incentive to look for a day job closer to home).

    Those who chose to be med techs will get a pay raise, but along with it comes a ton of responsibility. The med techs will be thoroughly acquainted with the pressures our boss lives with daily as a nurse. Do I want that much liability and stress with no formal nursing education? No thanks!
    Last edit by boulergirl on Apr 8, '05
  12. by   LPN1974
    Quote from boulergirl
    Well, I made a big decision today. At the staff meeting this afternoon our boss asked each of us to decide if we want to be a med tech or not. Very few hands went up. (Well, I wonder why. ) I chose NOT to raise my hand because I no longer want the responsibility. So as of today's date next month, I will no longer be a med tech and will probably have my hours reduced because there will be too many nurse's aides on the floor (it's just as well--I need an incentive to look for a day job closer to home).

    Those who chose to be med techs will get a pay raise, but along with it comes a ton of responsibility. The med techs will be thoroughly acquainted with the pressures our boss lives with daily as a nurse. Do I want that much liability and stress with no formal nursing education? No thanks!
    I do NOT blame you, boulergirl. You made a big decision.
    These NHs are saving money off med techs. I'm sure they don't pay you all that much more than a CNA position pays.
    If CNAs would refuse to take these positions, maybe the government would be forced to come up with grant money to help people like you or others go on to LPN or RN school.
    That's what they need to be doing to help relieve the nursing shortage...help people become nurses instead of passing those nursing duties on down the line.
  13. by   Marie_LPN, RN
    If CNAs would refuse to take these positions, maybe the government would be forced to come up with grant money to help people like you or others go on to LPN or RN school.


    Unfortunately there are a few CNAs that might think that passing meds might be a way of getting more respect for what they do. Reason why i say this is that i've seen a few of the CMAs say this on other boards (were said today, actually).

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