Why the high drop out rate of nursing students?

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Here is my question for educators.

I'm wondering how to decrease the drop out rate in nursing schools but I first need to know what the students reasons are for dropping out.

My thought is that some students apply because they want to be a nurse but like most of the general public don't know exactly what a nurse does besides follow MD orders, administer medications and make patients comfortable. They are surprised when they find out how much more is involved including the extra heavy load of coursework/study time and figured it was more then they bargained for and leave. Am I way off base here or is there a percentage of student's that fit this category?

What are the more common reasons for student leaving school?

What is the drop out rate at your school?

Thanks, Karen

:clown:

Your very mean and insensitive with your verbbage. 75% should be a C, a D should be alot lower than 78%.

At my school I got a 78% and 79 was a C ( passing.) Your wrong employers think a scale is 90-100% A

80-89 B 70-79C 60-69 D and 59 lower an F. Your right on the pre-meditation, I knew before starting that I needed a 79% to pass. I didnt know what the gamble was.

I took an 7 thousand dollar chance and lost. You even noted that a 78% means I pass, no according to the rules I failed. A- D means you failed. You need a 79% to barely pass at my school. A- B is 87% Be sensitive to what I am saying. Your half way agreeing with me. More instructors need teaching credidentials and nurturing screening. :redbeathe

I'm sorry if you think I'm insensitive, I just have no patience for people who blame the system for their own shortcomings.

You seem to be laboring under the false assumption that a 'C' is defined as 70-79%. It is not. The actual meaning of letter grades are as follows:

A- Excellent, High level of achievement, greatly exceeds expectations.

B- Above average level of achievement, exceeds expectations

C- Average level of achievement, meets expectations

D- Marginal achievement, does not meet expectations

F- Fail, unacceptable level of achievement

So, yes, I think a D is justified, as your score represents a marginal level of achievement and does not meet your program's requirements/expectations. Really, these grades are not necessarily based on the same numerical values as, say, high school. Nursing schools have higher standards due to the increased responsibility of their graduates and the greatly decreased room for error relative to other fields. Imagine if you made correct medical calculations or followed correct procedure 78% of the time. You would be considered a danger to your patients, and unfit to be a nurse. If you honestly feel that there is nothing wrong with a 78%, then perhaps nursing is not for you.

And, no, I am not agreeing with you at all. I used 78% as an arbitrary number which varies with individual school requirements.

Sorry, talbrecht, but this rationalization is so far out in left field that I just have to reply. Precise and accurate math skills are fundamental to safe practice as a nurse (RN or LPN).

I agree that precise and accurate math skills ARE important to safe practice. However, I don't think the rationalization presented was "so far out in left field." There ARE nurses out there who aren't very accurate and precise in their math skills. They have come up with ways to protect their licenses and patients... such as using calculators, checking with colleagues, checking with pharmacy, etc - which you should still do even if you ARE great at math, just to double check yourself. And there are many nursing jobs out there that don't often require mathematical figurings. Finally, how many nurses do you know who are quick to admit "I'm terrible at math!" or "I hated math in school!" or "I barely passed the math requirement in nursing school"? I know I've met MANY. I'm not saying that means it's okay to let students with poor math skills pass. I'm just saying that it's not totally insane for a student to wonder why so much weight is put on a few small math tests when the nursing curriculum spends barely any time on it and they may even hear nurses saying flat out "I never had to do that kind of calculation outside of school."

Personally, I would think that if a skill is THAT important (and it is, I think), then there should be LOTS of practice and testing to ensure students have it down cold. I've heard of programs with one ten question multiple choice math test that students must get 100% on. That's fine as long as the expectations have been made clear ahead of time and several practice tests have been made available. Without clear practice examples, someone might fail because they misunderstood a few questions even though their math skills are great. And someone else who's not always so accurate and precise at math might be good at educated guesses on multiple choice tests, get 100% and not really have their math skills down. If you have students do several math questions for each lecture for several weeks and THEN have a high stakes test, it would make more sense to me. Or maybe have a pre-nursing basic drug calculations math test (along with a comprehensive practice guide and lots of practice questions so students can prep) that must be passed before enrolling in nursing school. And either have more than 10 multiple choice questions or make the test open answer to really ensure that the students have the skills down cold.

But some schools give 15 minutes of a 2 hr lecture on drug calculations, offer only a few practice problems and little assistance with solving the problems, pile on all of the other nursing school assignments such that overall barely any time or emphasis has been put on drug calculations and then spring a high stakes drug calculations test on the students where there are only a few questions and a slight slip up might mean being failed from the entire program!

Not all programs are this way, I'm sure! I'm sure that some instructors (especially the ones who post here!) and schools make it very clear what is expected of students ahead of time. And I'm sure also that there are those students who have been warned again and again and given clear expectations who still claim that they weren't given a fair chance when they fail.

I think the real question involving math is, how much math competency can you expect from incoming students? Quite a bit, I'd say. After all, most programs require a C in anatomy, physiology, and micro as a bare minimum. Why not math competency, as well [i mean passing a skills assesment test, not completion of a college math class] ?. If you have a good grasp of algebra [which should be a requirement for admission to nursing school] then you don't need a huge amount of instruction on drug calculations. Perhaps those who have difficulty with math are in need of remedial studies. In any case, I honestly feel that decent math skills should be a given, and it is not a nursing school's responsibility to teach a student basic algebra.

Specializes in psych, addictions, hospice, education.

Back in the olden days when I got my RN, I had to take a math competency test to get into my science pre-reqs. Not just nursing school but school for the pre-reqs. I had taken math in high school and had done well, but I did not pass that competency test so I had to take a general algebra course before I could take my science pre-reqs. Aren't those required anymore?

Specializes in Gerontological, cardiac, med-surg, peds.
Not all programs are this way, I'm sure! I'm sure that some instructors (especially the ones who post here!) and schools make it very clear what is expected of students ahead of time. And I'm sure also that there are those students who have been warned again and again and given clear expectations who still claim that they weren't given a fair chance when they fail.

Most programs I've seen do offer math remediation, if the student requests it. At my college of nursing, for instance, there is a Supplemental Instruction class which a student can attend, and this covers nursing math. There is also a full-time remediation counselor. We offer a practice math test which is very similar to the actual test, and given to the students several weeks in advance of the real one. We also use the Calculate with Confidence text, which is an excellent resource with plenty of practice questions.

Specializes in Gerontological, cardiac, med-surg, peds.
Back in the olden days when I got my RN, I had to take a math competency test to get into my science pre-reqs. Not just nursing school but school for the pre-reqs. I had taken math in high school and had done well, but I did not pass that competency test so I had to take a general algebra course before I could take my science pre-reqs. Aren't those required anymore?

Many schools still do. It depends on the program. And, more and more schools of nursing are moving towards requiring certain scores on pre-entrance examinations such as the NLN or HOBET before a student is considered for admission to the program.

:yawn:

I think the real question involving math is, how much math competency can you expect from incoming students? Quite a bit, I'd say. After all, most programs require a C in anatomy, physiology, and micro as a bare minimum. Why not math competency, as well [i mean passing a skills assesment test, not completion of a college math class] ?. If you have a good grasp of algebra [which should be a requirement for admission to nursing school] then you don't need a huge amount of instruction on drug calculations. Perhaps those who have difficulty with math are in need of remedial studies. In any case, I honestly feel that decent math skills should be a given, and it is not a nursing school's responsibility to teach a student basic algebra.

:wink2:My school has mandatory enterance exams that include math, how can you say that this would justify not properly teaching medication math. It is so important yet they act like five minutes on it is justified. There should be an entire class on math if that is the case, if you claim it is so necessary on a daily base for a nurse. I worked sided by side jointly on patients in the ER and critical units, they never once used math calculations. It is already figured.

Specializes in psych, addictions, hospice, education.

To repeat a few other posters....math is NOT always figured--it depends on where you work...

Where I went to school we had one hour class on math for meds and quizzes for a few weeks before the big test. It was up to us to work on calculations and the book "Math for Meds" was helpful. How about you get such a book and work on calculations for another test? It's not productive to keep going on about the past.

Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

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