Why the high drop out rate of nursing students?

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Published

Here is my question for educators.

I'm wondering how to decrease the drop out rate in nursing schools but I first need to know what the students reasons are for dropping out.

My thought is that some students apply because they want to be a nurse but like most of the general public don't know exactly what a nurse does besides follow MD orders, administer medications and make patients comfortable. They are surprised when they find out how much more is involved including the extra heavy load of coursework/study time and figured it was more then they bargained for and leave. Am I way off base here or is there a percentage of student's that fit this category?

What are the more common reasons for student leaving school?

What is the drop out rate at your school?

Thanks, Karen

Specializes in OR, OB, EM, Flight, ICU, PACU.......
:nono:

i'm against any

weeding-out

of nursing students.

once a student

is accetped

in nursing school,

the nurturing process

should begin---

if nursing schools don't nurture the students towards success, then how and where do students learn the beginnings of the nurturing process to administer to their patients? :smokin:

i not advocating

passing students

who obviously

don't make the grades.

but ambiguous test questions

and

unqualified/unfair educators

promote high student dropout rates

in nursing school

and

it's unfair to the students!!! :banghead:]

:twocents:i agree with your first point, especially. a student that fails is the instructor's failure, as much or more than the student's. we can't afford to let any of them go if we want to ,someday solve the nursing shortage.

:twocents:as to your second point, been there, done that, got the t-shirt!:angryfire

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Specializes in Ante-Intra-Postpartum, Post Gyne.

I have several theories on that:

The girls that shared a lab bench with me were several years younger; one said she was going into nursing because of the $ and the other said, "I don't like people; but I am going to go into OR because at least the people will be asleep"

Another I think contributes to programs that do not go by a merit system but use lotto and only require a 2.0...I had a 3.6 overall GPA and a 4.8 pre-req GPA and nursing school is HARD, I have finally accepted that I can not always get an A and that an occasional B is pretty good for nursing school....

Since I have been in nursing school my social life has been pretty grim, friends have stopped calling because they know I will tell them NO when it comes to going out and doing something fun. I study at least 80 hours a week; I am taking a summer class right now which is my last upper GE and it feels like a CAKE WALK compared to the last two years working on my BSN. No one spoon feeds us anything, if I took a polygraph test and they asked me if I was a self taught nurse, I could say yes and pass...:chuckle

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No one spoon feeds us anything, if I took a polygraph test and they asked me if I was a self taught nurse, I could say yes and pass...:chuckle

Big difference between being "spoon-fed" and having to "self-teach" material. There is a middle ground that I think schools should strive for.

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MY STORY

I was 47 years old, had a BA in Political Science with a 3.75 GPA from a great university, some grad work, parent of a special needs child, experience in a special needs school as teacher and assistant. Began an ADN program at local communinty college. Knew right away that there were WAY too many students enrolled and they must be expecting a certain percentage to flunk. Lots did, but many remained, too many. Then it became nasty. Long story short, I flunked out my last semester r/t a community project with a writing component. I failed the writing component or the "subjective" portion of the project. BTW, I am author of several published articles, essays and my senior thesis as undergrad, a 50 page tome on middle eastern political theory, received a 3.94 on a 4.0 scale. FISHY don't you think! But I did not quit nursing. Got LPN, now Excelsior RN, soon grad school in Nursing Education. I love my work in LTC, make less than half of what I made in law office and commercial real estate sales, but I AM A NURSE!!!

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Specializes in Cardiac/Telemetry, Hospice, Home Health.
I agree...to a point.

Ambiguous test questions are exactly what you will see on your state board exam...that's why we attempt to indoctrinate you-all into "nursing school" style tests. It's not to try to trip you up. It's to begin to accustom you to the NCLEX style of questioning. Students seem to really resent this...especially that first semester. If we did not do this, imagine the passing rates on the NCLEX! It is all a process! If you-all can just go with it, you will find out that there is a plan! Instructors have your best interests at heart! It just amazes me that students might really think that we are purposely trying to torture them needlessly! What would our motivation be? Come on!:no:

I believe with the computer-based style of NCLEX testing, a 50% pass rate of a certain difficulty level is passing. Give me ambigious NCLEX questions, give me NCLEX scoring. Or give me death! :bowingpur

Thank Gawd I am not a student anymore. Then again, I will be going back soon for my BSN.

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I can't speak for every school...but at my school, it's a wonder they don't have more students dropping out. My school program has been nothing short of a disappointment.

The faculty are not teaching us nursing. They lecture, but questions are treated as a "nuisence" and an "interruption". We have two days of lecture and an exam. Exams are not covered in class so all of us can benefit from each other's mistakes.

Pharmacology is a self-taught course...so personally, other than the book, I don't think that we should have to pay for it. I didn't sign up for a distance-learning nursing program, I signed up for a CAMPUS based nursing program.

Complaints? Like talking to a brick wall. It doesn't matter if you have the signature of every single nursing student protesting something...it falls on deaf ears.

We had a question on one exam where 100% of the students missed it. Every one.. Do you think that question got thrown out? Nope...b/c the professor insisted that she went over the subject matter in class...but my recording of the lecture states otherwise...but if you tell her she's wrong...she'll just ban recordings. Not the first time it happened either.

Think one question doesn't make any difference? It does....ONE question caused me to get a B instead of an A this semester...you think I can argue that? Nope.

This is what I call the "God complex"...and it has no place in education. There is a distinct difference between people being in charge vs thinking they are incapable of making a mistake.

I can't even tell you what drugs are common in a hospital because no one has ever told us. I can tell you the adverse affects of probalby over 100 drugs by now, but probably can't tell you what any of them are SUPPOSED to be prescribed for...b/c they don't teach us that....so how am I supposed to double-check behind a doctor to protect myself legally?

Clinicals, are a joke.

We go into the facility, we are assigned to an LPN (in a RN program), and our instructor disappears for the rest of the shift. No one watches anything I am doing. I was sent in to do a head to toe post partum assessment on a patient with a c-section...(24 hours post-op).

They sent me in KNOWING I had never done one before nor had we covered this in class at all. I never saw anyone go in and check behind me. This woman could have easily had something seriously wrong with her and I wouldn't have known the difference.

The staff at the hospitals that we are paired with never seem to know anything about what we can and cannot do as nursing students. Some of them don't even want to be paired with a student that day--and you quickly figure that out after you get snapped at a few times.

If you go to the instructors with an issue, I get, "You'll be fine" or "You worry too much". They don't seem to care that I CARE about my progress.

I can't speak for all schools...just mine. If I could finish my coursework at another school I would by now.

I am doing an externship this summer because I feel I'll be in trouble post-graduate if I don't.

I can tell you are very frustrated, now lets look from the others perspective. I was once a student, however as always I was responsible for my learning. Did not depend on an instructor to point me in the direction I need to proiceed. Now from the other perspective. Assessment should have been taught in your first semester. Suprised if this did not occur. The other issue, what reading had you done prior to your clinical on the L-D unit? Again, this is information you need prior to practice. If you completed your assessment, did you ask your instructor to review your findings? If you had a question regarding your assessment, did you aks for assitance? As far as assignments are concerned, if they (the hospital) does not have enough RN staff, then you may be assigned to a LVN/LPN. It is difficult to assign two students to one nurse. Cannot force this on those nurses. Again, have you informed your nurse on what you can do yourself. What communication have you had with the nurses? Of course some assume that you are capable of administering medication only to find out later that you may not. How do you think they feel about that? Communication is a multi lane highway, every one should be communicating, not depending on one person to perform this job.

Learning in nursing school is difficult, however, in a two year program it is difficult to give all the information needed to practice. Hence, that is why reading is fundamental. I had the same and was determined that I would gain the knowledge to practice. (I love to read).

I understand the frustration, however, you need to see from both sides of the street. Walk in both shoes, communicate with instructor regarding frustration.

Good Luck with the studies:typing

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:twocents:I agree with your first point, especially. A student that fails is the Instructor's failure, as much or more than the Student's. We can't afford to let any of them go if we want to ,someday solve the nursing shortage.

:twocents:As to your second point, Been there, done that, got the T-shirt!:angryfire

:jester:I truely believe the jokes on us! Nursing Schools are not regulated and graded on Instructors actually TEACHING! They claim to take end of semester surveys but the fact is they dont care what the students FEEL.

The instructors have been TOLD by the Golden pass holders to WEED OUT students. The college has to pay more for instructors should they have more students 1/10 ratio for clinicals. Plus instructors are hard to find and most Nursing Instructors who are offered little pay are also required to have PHD's yeah sure they did that to be a teacher? They have a nursing degree because they want to be a nurse. If by chance they are a teacher they are an ADJUNCT which means it is a second job because they need more money. So what ya get is a Professor who is too busy to even be there, stressed out about bills or they wouldnt need the job and never really learned to teach or wanted to be a teacher. So yeah they really dont care if you learn it is a second JOB they get their money and go on there way. It has nothing to do with learning. They tell them trip them up, weed them out, it is less work that they will be required to do. Meanwhile they got the money from the class bc hello they dont give refunds! My program makes you buy all sorts of special things the moment you join in the program. Over priced uniforms from this vendor, books for the entire program, ATI books 500 bucks, special criminal hx screening (very expensive) only through their special connection. Shall I go on?

I have spent tons of money and already done my entire BS program before I did clinicals. Now that I only have that left and all my purchases done, I most likely will not pass next week short 10 points. I forgot to tell you that I have been working on this for 6 yrs! Oh one more special important thing. ..... I will have to drop out of the program if I dont pass, you are not allowed to not pass a course once in the program. NO REPEATS.

I have 78% and need 79% to pass.

I dont know what to do?

I have been in the medical field 24 years, Cardiovascular Technologist, Xray Tech and Medical Biller. I know medicine, I have practiced for 24 years and now I could possibly not be papered?

Any advise? :banghead::sniff:Thanks!

PS I am not working currently, quit my job to do this fulltime plus drive

4 hours a day to school RT. Is this all in vain>?

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As an educator I am saddened but not surprised that so many students seem to think we are out to get them. To be honest, some faculty are mean and evil with a mission to "keep the riff raff out of nursing". I have heard it, seen it, watched it, and felt lousy for it. Unfortunately, it is what it is, hard and you have nasty people to cope with. Much like the job. I think nursing as a group are rallying against those people, in my school we are exerting peer pressure as management seems to be incapable of exerting managerial pressure. Anyways, I feel bad for some of you. Others, I don't feel so bad about, the tone of your posts is such that I wonder if your perception of the situation are based in realtiy. I can't tell you how many students I have met that wanted to be nurses, and were so dysfunctional that I really worried they would be successful. I personally tend to try to be very objective and professional with these people and make every attempt not to pick on them. but I hope they don't pass. I encourage them to explore other career options often. Most self select to either drop out or fail out of nursing. Don't think I enjoy seeing that, I don't. On the other hand, we have enough crazy nurses, many of them go on to school to become educators. A nasty viscious cycle. Another issue I think we don't talk about enough is the oppression nurses experience and how we cope with that oppression. I highly reccomend reading Nursing agains't the odds by Sugganne Gordon. It is an awesome extrapolation of social theory to the nursing oppression and the best description of the crazyness that takes place every day in our profession.

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I am also an educator and hear the student complaints about their instructors and how "we're" out to get them. The one advantage to being an educator is that we understand "both" sides of the situation. We have been students and now are educators and I can say with confidence neither side is easy. I always try to encourage and motivate my students to do their best, but the bottom line is nursing school is very difficult and not everyone will be successful. It is a very difficult situation to be in as an educator. We need to nurture our students and offer encouragement, while preparing them for the NCLEX and the world of nursing.

My students understand that I'm not easy, but that I'm always fair. If a student has a question, I answer it to the best of my ability and I always take time to discuss their exams and offer rationales for the correct answer. This is the only way for a nursing student to develop critical thinking. I have seen instructors refuse to discuss exam questions because they don't want the "confrontation". I, on the other hand, welcome it as I love a challenge.

I have spent many years in nursing school over the years. I have been an LPN, ASN, BSN, and now MSN and none of it has been easy. I have had my favorite instructors and those who I could have done without, but I stayed focus, took the good with the bad, and worked extremely hard to accomplish my goals. When I didn't receive the grade I wanted, I looked at what I could have done differently and in every case, I could have studied more, asked more questions, or met with my instructor for advice. I'm certainly not saying that this is the case with everybody. I just think that we all need to take a look at the role we play. I constantly evaluate and improve upon my teaching methods. Like everything, it's a work in progress.

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I am also an educator and hear the student complaints about their instructors and how "we're" out to get them. The one advantage to being an educator is that we understand "both" sides of the situation. We have been students and now are educators and I can say with confidence neither side is easy. I always try to encourage and motivate my students to do their best, but the bottom line is nursing school is very difficult and not everyone will be successful. It is a very difficult situation to be in as an educator. We need to nurture our students and offer encouragement, while preparing them for the NCLEX and the world of nursing.

My students understand that I'm not easy, but that I'm always fair. If a student has a question, I answer it to the best of my ability and I always take time to discuss their exams and offer rationales for the correct answer. This is the only way for a nursing student to develop critical thinking. I have seen instructors refuse to discuss exam questions because they don't want the "confrontation". I, on the other hand, welcome it as I love a challenge.

I have spent many years in nursing school over the years. I have been an LPN, ASN, BSN, and now MSN and none of it has been easy. I have had my favorite instructors and those who I could have done without, but I stayed focus, took the good with the bad, and worked extremely hard to accomplish my goals. When I didn't receive the grade I wanted, I looked at what I could have done differently and in every case, I could have studied more, asked more questions, or met with my instructor for advice. I'm certainly not saying that this is the case with everybody. I just think that we all need to take a look at the role we play. I constantly evaluate and improve upon my teaching methods. Like everything, it's a work in progress.

Thanks for the insight, my biggest complaint of my professor is that when I asked for help she offered none and to escape actually teaching me more she told me that I should 1. Be tested for a Learning Disability and 2. Check with my advisor for help. I have had some excellant teachers and those ALWAYS have me ending up with EXCELLANT grades just like now.

The professor who teaches from powerpoint and then asked non revilant questions on her test to trip you up produces many students who do not pass. When the entire class does not pass the test, that says something about the teacher. Learning is a two way street. I feel ripped off this semester for not passing my class by 2%.

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Hello everyone:

I am currently matriculating in an RN program and I was completely baffled at the teaching/instructing and testing style. In my opinion, the high drop out and failure rate at my school is directly correlated to the educational model being used to instruct and grade the students. Students are entering this program with high GPAs and over the course of 3 semesters or so, it plummets. I would think that this begs the question, "Is something wrong with all of the instructors that these students have had previously whom they received As and Bs from in many different degree programs?" or "Is there something wrong with this type of instruction?" What I see are experienced nurses working as instructors. It is my belief that if these nurses were trained as adult educators and had courses in curriculum writing and test preparation along with courses on how to be an effective instructor, the drop out and failure rate would be less.

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Some people may have personal reasons to leave nursing school, so you'll never be able to tell.

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