What happens if we DON'T recommend nursing as a career? - page 4

by HazeK

5,932 Views | 61 Comments

Please recommend nursing to the smartest, kindest people you know! I'll be retiring in about 20 years and would like some skilled, caring nurses left working to take care of me and my children and my children's children! ... Read More


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    Originally posted by sonnie:
    I see nursedude and his cohorts are at it again. Instead of whinning and ******** about what is wrong with nursing today what steps are you taking to make it better?? What's that I hear?? NOTHING????? Any idiot can complain and I hope you all leave nursing because I don't want to work with you or beside you. You can not be trusted. Yes, nursing has problems, yes we could all stand to earn more and no one likes to work overtime if you don't have to. What I have found is that those who complain about these things the most are the ones who call in sick at the last minute, and the most likely to complain if they are asked to stay. Please remember the patients do not choose when they will be sick, nor can they heal themsevles by 5pm so we can all go home happy. I'm sure they would if it was possible. Many patients have told me of the increased rudeness in nurses and nurses aides. Yes we work hard and sometimes shorthanded but that is not the patient's fault nor should they be made to feel that way!!! Talk to your management team, show them how improving customer care [patient care]can improve profits, put it in their terms $$$$$ they will listen or they too will be out of work. JUST DON'T WHINE!!!! THAT IS THE MOST UNPROFESSIONAL THING THAT CAN BE DONE!!! Many other college educated people are making less than most RN's are their jobs any less important?? On another board I made the comment that if you wanted to earn more money than you were worth to become a professional ball player. That comment still stands. We as a society need to quit paying millions to our entertainers and shift that money to our teachers, nurses, MDs, and other people who save lives each day. So next time you go to a basketball game and pay 80 - 100 dollars a seat ask yourself what am I really getting? Nobody seems to complain about ticket prices but every one complains about medical costs. Go figure!!!!!!!!!!

    [This message has been edited by sonnie (edited October 02, 2000).]

    Gee Sonnie....And you claim that "me and my cohorts whine"?



  2. 0
    I agree with mojority of the comments posted. You should love your job, but you should also be paid well for your job. I did not go to school for 4 and a half years to be paid squat. Period. I have a good degree and a damn good education, I should be paid accordingly. However, having said all of this, isn't it hard to bargain for more money when we are one of the only professions that recognize Associate and Bachelor degree programs as the same. I mean absoultley NO disrespect to ADN-RN's, this is just my opinion. In order to get the respect and money we all deserve, I feel it is neccessary to seperate CNA's, LPN's, ADN's, BSN's, annd ARNP's. Unless, we as nurses start to accept the fact that there ARE differences in ALL of us, we will never get anywhere. My education is different than that of an ADN. I went to school for 2 more years. . . and yes, clinically, I am just as capable as an ADN (I worked as a SNT throughout nursing school). Those extra years of school allowed me to be taught things in more depth and also learn management skills. So I must argue that I should earn more an hour. Respectfully, ARNP's go to school for 2 more years than I do, they learn more. . . thus are paid more. Get my point? Again, I truley mean No disrespect to any ADN, and I do believe that they do and excellent job, but. . .
    Anyways, my point is that we as nurses need to take charge and demand more money for what we do, at ALL levels. Remember, there is power in numbers. . . and nurses make up an overwhelming majority of the hospital staff. So with that, quite whinning and start demanding. We deserve it, and if we stand TOGETHER, we can get it.
  3. 0
    Originally posted by JenBSN:
    I agree with mojority of the comments posted. You should love your job, but you should also be paid well for your job. I did not go to school for 4 and a half years to be paid squat. Period. I have a good degree and a damn good education, I should be paid accordingly. However, having said all of this, isn't it hard to bargain for more money when we are one of the only professions that recognize Associate and Bachelor degree programs as the same. I mean absoultley NO disrespect to ADN-RN's, this is just my opinion. In order to get the respect and money we all deserve, I feel it is neccessary to seperate CNA's, LPN's, ADN's, BSN's, annd ARNP's. Unless, we as nurses start to accept the fact that there ARE differences in ALL of us, we will never get anywhere. My education is different than that of an ADN. I went to school for 2 more years. . . and yes, clinically, I am just as capable as an ADN (I worked as a SNT throughout nursing school). Those extra years of school allowed me to be taught things in more depth and also learn management skills. So I must argue that I should earn more an hour. Respectfully, ARNP's go to school for 2 more years than I do, they learn more. . . thus are paid more. Get my point? Again, I truley mean No disrespect to any ADN, and I do believe that they do and excellent job, but. . .
    Anyways, my point is that we as nurses need to take charge and demand more money for what we do, at ALL levels. Remember, there is power in numbers. . . and nurses make up an overwhelming majority of the hospital staff. So with that, quite whinning and start demanding. We deserve it, and if we stand TOGETHER, we can get it.
    JenBSN,
    How can you say that your education is better or more advanced when you take the same licencing tests with the same questions as ADNs? I have worked with and trained ADNs, BSNs, and Diploma nurses. BSN graduates generally to concerned about the social aspects of patient care while the ADN, and Diploma nurses are busy actually taking care of the patient. Skill wise BSN grads are lost, it normally takes them 3-6 months of extra orientation to be effective on the floor. This I attribute to the lack of clinical experience combined with the demographics of who actually goes to what type of school. Most of what you are saying is a parroting of organizations who strive to beat down nurses by turning them against one another. Historically BSNs have had the lowest of the NCLEX scores. (NCLEX WEB SITE)As long as we all take the same boards and ADNs and Diploma nurses pass more frequently and with higher scores than our BSN collegues then I will consider us all equal and base the competency of each nurse on his/her actions.
    sonnie
  4. 0
    This has all been interesting reading. Nursedude I love you, your a hoot and I always enjoy what you write, however are you willing to work to try to make changes? To JenBSN, must be awfully proud of that BSN aren't you? I see you were indoctrinated well in your course, I would like to remind you that I passed the NCLEX too, and I did not have to have a 4 year degree to do it. Comments like yours do not advance any causes that nurses have, all they do is put wedges between nurses, I would put your BSN up against the diploma nurse any day. They had more clinical time then you ever dreamed of. I am an ADN nurse and I truly take offense at what you said. ADN nurses are good but... but what? Why is it necessary to feel like you must degrade another nurse that works as hard as you do, that does the same patient care that you do, that puts in the same overtime that you do etc...? Yet you DESERVE more pay because you have a higher degree. What do you do for the patient that is ever so much better that you should be paid any better? Some management classes? Does that make you better able to deliver appropriate patient care or only make you more suspectible to the company line? I have never posted anything that could be is rude in nature, but what you said was offensive and uncalled for. You should be paid better simply because of degree, but the ADN who does the same job doesn't deserve what you do because of their lack of the BSN. It would make me laugh if I did not think you seriously believed it!
  5. 0
    nursedude
    did I hit a nerve????
  6. 0
    sonnie,

    nope, no nerve struck. I just find it ironic that you make a post about "me and my cohorts" bitc***g and whining and in the very same post you do the same dam* thing? -Typical nurse style don't you think?

    rncountry,
    as I have replied to you before in another thread I am doing something about "it". First, I quit working as a nurse- I refuse to allow some hosp administrators/ insurance executives to take advantage of my skills so that they can make big profit$. Also, I started my own patient advocacy business. In addition to those two things I am very vocal with most everyone I come in contact with. I try to tell people what is really going on in healthcare, what is going on in hospitals, how their family doctors are paid not only with capitated dollars but also in bonus money when they utilize healthcare services less etc, etc, etc...


    Quite frankly, I think it's too late for nursing. There really isn't much anyone can do about it. Nursing is no longer percieved as a profession- at least by the folks who run healthcare. Instead, nursing is percieved by them (hosp admins/ins execs) as overhead, a strain on profit and revenue... To me, that is the writing on the wall- it's plain as day.


    As far as "doing something about it" goes- I really don't think anyone on this board is doing anything about "it" by posting here. All anyone does here is basically vent and share thoughts, experience and opinions and some folks come here to accuse others of bitc***g and whining and then in the same breath they turn around and do the same. I think of this posting board as the "nurses station" where we come together and talk, document, put charts etc. And then there is real life -"the unit". That part is not on these boards- that is where the difference is made. That is why I refuse to do nursing anymore- It's bullsh** When people ask me "Why did you leave nursing?" I tell them exactly why... That is where I believe I make the biggest difference...
  7. 0
    nursedude, do you have stats oor other information that you utilize in your business, if so I would be interested in what you have. I don't believe it is too late, I fully believe that can't never did anything. If enough nurses want to effect change I believe it will occur. If it is too late, than why do you still come to this board? Why not fully turn your back on nursing and the health care field, that would truly be the easiest route, would it not? Yet you come here, your posts contain a passion for the injustices we all suffer, pay and other things, you care enough about the patient to open an advocacy business, so if it is too late than why bother? Think business for a minute. If you were to become more involved what do you think that could do for your business? Networking with other health care professionals, nursing or otherwise may result in an increase in your business. You said in another post that business was not going so well. What do you have to show potential customers? That you were an active nurse and understands what is going on? Or do you have information that backs up what you are saying, are you in contact with other more experienced advocacy groups that can point customers to you? Can you point to groups you may be affilated with and let your potential customers realize how well informed you are? If you truly believe that nurse cannot affect change, that it is too late for nursing than how do you expect your business to grow? If you are unwilling to believe that change can be affected than what do you say as a businessman to your customers? I know it sucks and this is why is sucks, but don't expect it to change? Who is going to pay for that? Nursedude, I wish you the best of luck with your business, I truly do, it takes guts and drive to even try, knowing it may fail. I applaud you for taking those steps, what I don't understand is how you can have an advocacy business and not want to be involved in a bigger way, if for nothing else than the increase in business it is likely to bring you. I do enjoy your postings because you say what many think, but few are willing to voice, and I am sure you do a good job for the customers that you have. If you are not doing the amount of business that you want though, it is not because nobody wants to hear it, but because you are not willing to reach out to others that may be willing to help you be successful. Don't make everyone your enemy, there are others out there that feel the way you do and would be good to help you grow your business. If enough people are willing to make the million nurse march happen and you participated in it, do you not think that would help be an effective form of advertisement? Not only would you have what information etc... that you utilize now, but you would have the ability to say I have more knowledge,more information that I have brought back to offer you, my customer, I am committed to the cause of advocating for YOU.
    Just some thoughts, I may be off base, but I would love to see a posting from you bragging about how much money you are making to be a patient advocate. Because nurses do deserve to be paid what they are worth, nurses do deserve to have respect, both of which you would gain with a successful business. I do not actively nurse, but I will always be a nurse. Sounds like you will too. Much luck with your business, you are a strong advocate, and from what I have read I would go to you if I had a problem, what I am saying is take it to the next level. A year from now I hope to hear you are wildly successful, making what you deserve to make.
  8. 0
    rncountry,

    My business is a partnership. Myself, another RN and a lawyer. The business is 1 1/2 years old. We initially planned to become incorporated but have found that we will most likely dissolve the business. Why?

    The reason why is the same reason why healthcare is going down the tubes... People either don't care or they don't want to pay for it...The people that really do need help really can't afford it and unfortunately we can't operate a business without revenue.

    I have one last idea for "the business" and if it doesn't look like it'll work we are going to give it the axe.

    As far as my feeling about it being too late for nursing- Sorry but I'm not changing on my position on that.
  9. 0
    NURSING IS WORTH SAVING! You can start by going to the MNM site.
    I've had the priviledge of helping with birth, death, and crisis in life. Most nurses are kind interesting people. Along with family the nurses in my life have enriched it. I cherish the hugs I've received, many this century.
    I truly believe if we use the passion for people and educate the public we can improve the horrible staffing and lack of respect for our work the "sick care non-system" has created for profit.
    If we can take care of our patients as we know how many (maybe even NurseDude) will come back.
    The facilities need to learn a staff nurse is the most indispensable asset. Why should registry and travelers make more? How about retention bonuses with the sign ons? (I've worked registry and know it is not fair for me to make more than staff who must act as resource for me! When the charge RN makes less than registry it is bad for the facility as well as retention. Registry choose their schedule and don't have to do mandatory overtime!
    OK let's do it!

    ------------------


    [This message has been edited by spacenurse (edited October 04, 2000).]
  10. 0
    Hi posters. I do agree with nursedude's comment regarding nursing services being part of general revenue. Another poster, perhaps not under this topic, alluded to the fact that nursing services are part of room and board. I found this out prior to leaving the hospital scene. With one or two exceptions for me, it's been my experience that your nursing education is not factored into this equation, although I feel I also should be compensated for my BSN and certifications (I come from a proud diploma background). That's why I also agree with nursedude's comment regarding his services being used by the administration and insurers-I've been applying the term exploitation. However, I do think there is hope for nursing. For my part and within my time constraints, I have made various communications with my local, state, and federal legislators as well as others. I have also had the occasion to attend some meetings in my state capitol. I think that nursing will end up being redefined in some way, and we're seeing some of that now with the different techs that are being used in bedside care. The aging population still demands and will demand some type of nursing service. The ball is in our corner in terms of how we allow ourselves to be defined or how we define ourselves. The ball is also in the corner of the government, insurers, AHA, AMA, and the like on how supportive they will be of our efforts. I feel the public will ultimately hold these groups accountable if quality nursing care continues to slide. I applaud those of us who willing to work on setting up some type of group activism whether large scale or small scale.


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