Is Health Care a Right? - page 5

Just want to see your opinion (friendly discussion, no flaming, please). Is health care a right that should be enjoyed equally here in the U.S.? If so, how would this be financed without breaking... Read More

  1. by   Furball
    Originally posted by researchrabbit
    I don't agree. A pregnant prisoner in the county jail began having problems at 8 months and asked for help. None given. They let her deliver a dead baby 16 hours later on her cell floor.
    That is horrifying!!!:stone
  2. by   chrn
    My daughter is losing her medical insurance. She has worked for a county agency (Child and Family services, no less...). They will allow them to pay full premiums to keep it- About $750/month. She will have a baby in May, so going without is not an option. Her husband is losing his job this spring. They have both worked these jobs for many years. These are not uneducated, "drifter", take-advantage people. They are average American citizens, working hard and steady. My dad worked all his life in factories -small job shops (not General Motors). All him and mom have is Medicare. They both have terrible dental problems now. No pension, no money, no insurance. These are all American citizens who have worked and payed taxes their whole lives.
    YES, I do believe healthcare is a right of American citizens. The money is there, it is a matter of PRIORITIES. Because the elected officials that represent us don't care about every one of us being dangerously close to catastrophe. Lots of money being spent on war, war on drugs, pushing agendas around the world.
    Thats my .02.
  3. by   OC_An Khe
    After reading this thread, it seems everyone is focusing on individual health care. Whether this is a right or entitlement has not been fully debated in this country and it needs to be.
    However Public Health is a responsibility of government at all levels and this has been slowing decreasing for decades due to lack of funding.
    Proper sanitation, clean water, health education, communicable disease prevention/ surveilance have all deteriorated. The infrastructure is no longer there. These problems have been considered solved and few pay attention to them.
    The question of health care is really one of whose responsibilty it is. Some can only be acomplished if a governmental body takes the resposibility while others require individual responsibility.
    Its the distinction between these that has to be resolved.
    Last edit by OC_An Khe on Jan 16, '03
  4. by   Q.
    Originally posted by researchrabbit
    I don't agree. A pregnant prisoner in the county jail began having problems at 8 months and asked for help. None given. They let her deliver a dead baby 16 hours later on her cell floor.
    This may sound harsh, but I've said it numerous times before. Unfortunately, I believe that baby is better off, in a better place. :stone
  5. by   Q.
    Originally posted by ocankhe
    The question of health care is really one of whose responsibilty it is. Some can only be acomplished if a governmental body takes the resposibility while others require individual responsibility.
    Its the distinction between these that has to be resolved.
    Excellent point.
  6. by   Sally_ICURN
    Originally posted by mark_LD_RN
    what exactly do you see wrong with then plan ?

    Read the links that I posted.
    and where is is written that it is wrong to make money off a corporation,that is where people loose site of things. hospitals especially fpr profit ones are set up for that to make money,...

    I've said this before in another forum and I'll say it again here, I think it's wrong when money that's exchanging hands/pockets is at the expense of human life or the quality thereof. I don't think that healthcare should be "for-profit." Why should anyone profit from my grandfather's fatal stroke or your child's spina bifida?
    is the problem you have with the plan just because of the messenger?
    Yes, it is in part. I think I made it pretty clear that I don't trust the integrity of any politician who has such close personal financial ties to a corporation that benefits(ed) from people's misfortunes or felonious business practices. Special interest money is what finances campaigns and in politics, a connection between personal involvement in special interest groups and the decision making power of the person with the connection is unethical and very questionable. That's why this type of situation is usually very controversial and labeled a conflict of interest. Those special interest groups expect something for their buck. So I'm skeptical...so what? We all should question the bull that our government gives us as the end all truth.

    ~Sally
  7. by   fergus51
    Originally posted by Sally_ICURN
    I love a good book!

    I have a question and I'm sure this has been discussed before on this board somewhere, but aren't the nurses in Canada considered government employees? So are the benefits (including retirement)/pay/etc. pretty standardized?

    ~Sally
    No, we aren't government employees directly. We are members of a provincial union and employees of whatever health region we work in (which really is a part of government). That said, our contract is negotiated by our union with a part of the government, and here in my province the last contract was legislated by the government. So, benefits and pay are standard in each province, but vary accross the country.
  8. by   fergus51
    Originally posted by Susy K
    This may sound harsh, but I've said it numerous times before. Unfortunately, I believe that baby is better off, in a better place. :stone
    Speaking as a product of an ex con and a teenager, that baby would have been better off being adopted and raised by a family who could love it. I wouldn't let a dog give birth alone.
  9. by   Sally_ICURN
    Thanks for that reply fergus51! It's interesting that the entire country is unionized. I want to learn more about how it works. That book might be a good place to start?

    ~Sally
  10. by   researchrabbit
    Originally posted by Susy K
    This may sound harsh, but I've said it numerous times before. Unfortunately, I believe that baby is better off, in a better place. :stone
    Unfortunately, in this state, our exiting governor said that year that if someone is "suicidal OR homicidal" that person should be jailed...if he had had his way, all our suicidal folks would have been put in jail and given little or no health care.

    We have a real problem here with inmates not getting even minimal care (note -- these are county jails, not federal or state prisons). Some of my MH patients were incarcerated for minor crimes by the county (one stole $50 worth of makeup and was jailed for 3 months under the "get tough" judge). Even though her medication was taken to the jail BY ME and all they had to do was give it at night...she got it 2 times out of 3.

    And Suzy, many people believe that most or all dead people are in a better place. That doesn't mean we should kill everyone. I don't think that baby deserved a death sentence because mom was in jail. People should pay their debts to society, but I don't know of a single crime that requires a parent to pay with their child's life.
  11. by   maureeno
    the reason we form governments is because individuals can't take care of everything by themselves. Post #55 sets out the importance of public health.
    Another aspect of this is highlighted by the example of rising rates of testicular cancer [up 67% between 1973 and 1999] and maternal exposure to persistent organic pollutants. Government has the responsibilty to protect the population from contaminants. Instead it leans more to protection of corporate profits.
  12. by   Q.
    Originally posted by researchrabbit
    And Suzy, many people believe that most or all dead people are in a better place. That doesn't mean we should kill everyone. I don't think that baby deserved a death sentence because mom was in jail. People should pay their debts to society, but I don't know of a single crime that requires a parent to pay with their child's life.
    No, parents shouldn't have to pay with their child's life - however, the circumstances surrounding into how she got there - in jail, pregnant, etc should all be considered a "payment" if you will. Like I said, it sounds harsh, but I'd much rather that poor child die seconds after delivery than raised in foster care, or by a single mom who's also a prison inmate and most likely will continue to put her child in harm's way.

    I don't wish to be flamed for this at all. But I guess I adore children too much to have them at all costs. My belief may be unpopular, but that baby is far better off in my opinion. Divine intervention, perhaps? I've had infants born in the toilet, covered in thick meconium and not brought to the hospital for 2 hours after delivery. They survived. This one didn't. Perhaps for a damn good reason.
  13. by   fergus51
    Originally posted by Sally_ICURN
    Thanks for that reply fergus51! It's interesting that the entire country is unionized. I want to learn more about how it works. That book might be a good place to start?

    ~Sally
    The book doesn't deal with nursing in particular, but you can always go to our union website www.bcnu.org which is for BC nurses and has links to other provinces unions I think. There are private facilities that hire nurses in every province, but they are mostly community based or elective surgery type places. Some are still covered under BCNU, but some are not. It's a confusing place!

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