Husband shoots wife and self in Icu in CA

live4today, RN · Dec 14, 2003

Oh man! How terribly sad for that family to endure the loss of those two over what?????? What a waste!

queen_jv · Dec 14, 2003

thats really sad to hear... I agree with you...:imbar

Havin' A Party!, ASN, RN · Dec 14, 2003

I'm fairly new to health care. From the start, I've been amazed how little physical security exists at different facilities (hospitals and LTC). Just about anybody can get in with minimal effort and do whatever.

I've opened my mouth a couple of times about this and have gotten blank stares like I was some kind of doomsday advocate. Amazing.

SmilingBluEyes · Dec 14, 2003

OH MY LORD....

i have NO words. I am speechless and sick.

Home Health Columnist / Guide · Dec 14, 2003

News report:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/20031212-1656-ca-hospitalshooting.html

crankyasanoldma · Dec 14, 2003

That truly IS a sad story, but I don't see any fault on the part of the hospital here. The article says they have a family members only rule, ID badges required, cameras, and 2 security officers. What else can they do?

The husband clearly planned what he was going to do. Perhaps the wife was involved, too.

Maybe someone else could have seen that coming (family, friends, etc), but I don't see how the ER can be blamed.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Dec 14, 2003

Very sad.

I disagree with you about the lawsuit. I don't see how suiing the hospital for a man who wanted to end his and his wife's suffering would make anyone in the next bed feel any safer or stop future occurances.

renerian, BSN, RN · Dec 15, 2003

I am guessing the patient was suffering horribly. While I do not agree with his methods I do believe that in the event I am suffering I will most likely try to not suffer and may try to end the suffering but not like that.......shiver.

I agree with the earlier post, the family is most likely devastated.

When I worked at the hospital a friend brought a gun in the ICU and shot the patient. Was a bloody mess.

renerian:eek:

Gldngrl · Dec 15, 2003

Despite the man's intentions, they could have been easily thwarted by a nurse or physician, any hospital employee entering the area and another tragedy could have occurred...the man could have shot them instead (out of surprise, shock, reflex, etc.). Should hospitals have security measures like airports? Perhaps they should, I wouldn't compare a hospital to a library or a theatre as the newsarticle did. Hospitals deal with human illness, tragedy, and emotions that can lead to unstable, dangerous situations. My husband is a prosecutor and when he walks into the courtroom, he and everyone is searched and no one walks in with even a beeper or cell phone as there are strict security measures and armed sherriffs. I work in an inner city hospital with a high crime rate where victims come in to be treated for injuries and the alleged defendants burst into the units as well, where visitors and patients are verbally and physically abusive to staff, and maybe the panic button will work immediately or it may take several minutes. I'm very concerned when employers fail to address and adequately deal with workplace violence...maybe airport security measures would be going too far, but it frightens me that someone can bring an unavoidably unsafe object with deliberate intentions into the hospital. MMB

-jt · Dec 15, 2003

The urban hospital I work at has "open visiting". No one is stopped at the front door - unless youre in uniform. They know you work there and see you every day but YOU are the one security asks to show ID. Everybody else is allowed to walk right past. No passes given out - cost cutting, you know - the patient information staff at the front desk was downsized. Problem solved by eliminating visitor passes altogether. So now we have 20 people at the bedsides in ICU. No control. No unit security. Its a disaster waiting to happen. Even smack in the middle of the neighborhood known as Little Mid East, right across from the Twin Towers, city on red alert for months, national guard walking our streets with rifles and still no increase in security at my hospital. No reintroduction of visitor passes or limits. However, the hospital in the suburban-like community where I live, makes everybody wait on line to sign in, show ID to match the signature, get a pass, wear an ID, leave their drivers license at the desk to be picked up when the pass is returned..... and then they make you walk thru a metal detector manned by 2 security guards before you can get to the elevator. If you come to visit someone and 2 passes are already out on that person, you just have to wait in the lobby till one of his visitors leaves. The hospital I work in should be so smart.

mattsmom81 · Dec 15, 2003

Originally posted by -jt
The urban hospital I work at has "open visiting". No one is stopped at the front door - unless youre in uniform. They know you work there and see you every day but YOU are the one security asks to show ID. Everybody else is allowed to walk right past. No passes given out - cost cutting, you know - the patient information staff at the front desk was downsized. Problem solved by eliminating visitor passes altogether. So now we have 20 people at the bedsides in ICU. No control. No unit security. Its a disaster waiting to happen. Even smack in the middle of the neighborhood known as Little Mid East, right across from the Twin Towers, city on red alert for months, national guard walking our streets with rifles and still no increase in security at my hospital. No reintroduction of visitor passes or limits. However, the hospital in the suburban-like community where I live, makes everybody wait on line to sign in, show ID to match the signature, get a pass, wear an ID, leave their drivers license at the desk to be picked up when the pass is returned..... and then they make you walk thru a metal detector manned by 2 security guards before you can get to the elevator. If you come to visit someone and 2 passes are already out on that person, you just have to wait in the lobby till one of his visitors leaves. The hospital I work in should be so smart.

I work in a ICU like yours re: open visiting and agree it is a disaster waiting to happen, as well as a problem for us to do our job. Your local hospital in the suburbs has the right idea, IMO. While I have not had a gun pointed at me directly on duty, it has happened to coworkers. The hospital downplays it. Nurses receive threats of violence (also downplayed) on a regular basis and I believe a stronger stance from the hospital would deter much of this. To their credit, my local police officers have been wonderful about responding to our calls, even sticking around on their own time out of concern. Love those officers.:kiss