Healthcare is NOT a basic human right. - page 39

by Asystole RN 50,998 Views | 622 Comments

If one were to read the Constitution one would realize that the Constitution does not grant anyone freedoms, liberties, or rights. The Constitution only protects freedoms, liberties, and rights from transgressions on part of the... Read More


  1. 0
    "A free clinic? Twice a week! Well there's no problem at all with access!!
    Every free clinic around here you'd have to wait all day HOPING you'll be seen. Which is really easy to do if you're trying to keep a roof over your head with your job that pays just enough to get by, as long as you keep it. Or your child gets sick on Thursday night. Free clinic isn't open until next Tuesday night. Think we're going to be wasting ER resources for a simple case of otitis media? And then how do you pay that bill?
    I can't afford a surprise ED visit, and I've got a decent job and insurance that will pay some of it.

    As I said before I live in a small town, the two day a week free clinic is more than enough to satisfy the demand here. Most of the time they don't even run a full day, because they don't have that many pts. As for larger cities, sure there is a much higher demand, but their is also much more access. From multiple full time free clinics, to urgent care centers, to multiple hospitals, many more physicians, etc. You're going to have to excuse me for not buying into the whole "poor people dying in the streets because they have absolutely no where to go."

    As for the whole "
    It never ceases to amaze me how easy people who have never been poor think that it is to be poor." First, you do not know me. How do you know if I grew up poor and rose up out of poverty? Sure, I never went hungry, but in all honesty with the millions of Americans on food stamps, WIC, food banks, school lunches, etc. who really does? I didn't have all the designer clothes, the cool shoes, and later the cool car, the latest cell phone, etc. What I did have in my later years in high school I provided for myself because I worked 7 days a week part-time. At this time I was also buying my own school lunches , insurance, gas, etc. all while playing sports and being an honor roll student. It really infuriated me seeing some of my friends parents buy everything for them - sports cars, cool clothes, ipods, etc. It also infuriated me seeing their parents foot the bill for them when they went to college, when I worked my way through college and paid it myself. Not that my parent's didn't want to, but rather couldn't help me out as much as I helped myself.

    You'll have to excuse me for not being overly sympathetic the "poor". "Poor" being a widely misused term in this country. The majority of the so-called "poor" in the US have no idea what it is like to actually be poor. They are not starving in the streets, rather, their food card is so abundant, they can sell portions of their allotment for 50 cents on the dollar in exchange for cash and still have a balance left over. Their rent is often either paid for or subsidized. Most enjoy the luxuries of cable tv, internet, and air conditioning as well. Let's not forget the latest smart phone either. Or the designer clothes, or manicured nails, and salon styled hair. And of course, Medicaid. The standard of living for the poor continues to increase. Meanwhile the average joe out there is seeing at least 1/3 of his payroll stolen in payroll taxes alone.Then along comes sales, property, highway, state, local, county, and excise taxes to gnaw away at the left-overs. His standard of living, despite working harder, continues to decline. Anyone else see something WRONG with this picture? It's very simple basic economics, you cannot subsidize one persons standard of living while lowering another's and expect it to all balance out. It just doesn't work.

    Oh and P.S. it's not that I hate poor people or anything of the such, which I'm sure alot of the libs on this thread are going to say. Strange though I never see them volunteering at the food bank, the local churches, the charitable events, etc, despite claiming to care so much about people... I guess they only really care when it directly benefits them, or someone else puts in the time, money and effort...
    Last edit by realmaninuniform on Oct 4, '12 : Reason: typo
  2. 1
    Quote from BlueDevil,DNP
    Thank you, Dogoodthengo, for taking the time to improve my understanding of the French health care system. I was under the misimpression that it was considered socialized medicine. While I do not think socialized medicine is a pejorative, I wish we could adopt their system.

    I saw a woman today begging me for help. She has insurance. She also has a very large, widely differentiated tumor on her cervical lymph node, (nonlymphoma) adjacent to, and being fed by, her carotid artery. It grew from 4.5 to 11cm in less than 8 weeks. It will kill her very shortly. They only surgeon around who is skilled enough to to the surgery does not take Blue Cross/Blue Shield. The surgeons who do take BCBS have refused to do the surgery because of it's complexity. She and her husband cannot afford to pay out of network. Therefore, she will just die. All I can do for her is prescribe for pain and nausea. Too bad, so sad for her. AND SHE IS INSURED! It is an outrage.

    She is 47. Will never see 48. At this rate she won't see Christmas. And some of you think this is moral and just. Sleep well. heh.
    BlueDevil, maybe this has already been considered, but I have read of people who needed expensive highly skilled surgeries eg. for brain tumors, who had no money to pay. Friends set up a web site explaining the person's plight and requesting donations, and raised the money necessary through PUBLIC DONATIONS. It can be done. I understand your patient needs the money now, but perhaps the right person could make this happen very quickly. If one was desperate for funds and didn't have a friend who could design a web site, perhaps it would be possible to find someone who would accept a payment plan for the web site.

    I have also read of organizations (charities) who raise money for people in these kind of situations through web campaigns. Web campaigns can be very effective in raising money for medical causes.
    realmaninuniform likes this.
  3. 1
    Quote from FMF Corpsman
    Well BlueDevil, it is Mercifully a very rapidly growing tumor. Sometimes that is the very best we can hope for. That, and a good pain control practitioner.
    I'm not in the habit of replying to my own post, but I thought perhaps this one was a bit different because it appears a little callous on my part and I thought maybe it could use an explanation. I am perhaps a little more rough around the edges than the average Nurse, but that comes from being ex-military, combat duty and being a good bit older, or as some on the board refer to it as "more seasoned," than a number of the other bloggers here. It is my experience that sometimes death is not the worst thing that can happen to us. Having experienced it myself, twice, it isn't something I personally fear any longer and when it comes time for me to go, I will welcome the chance to leave the chains of the burdens of life behind willingly and go eagerly on to my just reward. I am a Cancer survivor and know that sometimes those battles are best fought with a full arsenal or left alone while I make my peace with my maker and fight the pain with the best I can get.
    toekneejo likes this.
  4. 0
    Quote from Susie2310
    BlueDevil, maybe this has already been considered, but I have read of people who needed expensive highly skilled surgeries eg. for brain tumors, who had no money to pay. Friends set up a web site explaining the person's plight and requesting donations, and raised the money necessary through PUBLIC DONATIONS. It can be done. I understand your patient needs the money now, but perhaps the right person could make this happen very quickly. If one was desperate for funds and didn't have a friend who could design a web site, perhaps it would be possible to find someone who would accept a payment plan for the web site.

    I have also read of organizations (charities) who raise money for people in these kind of situations through web campaigns. Web campaigns can be very effective in raising money for medical causes.
    Forget the name of the Website, but the one used to raise nearly one million dollars for the NYS school bus matron that was bullied by her young students seems to do well.
  5. 0
    Quote from BlueDevil,DNP
    Thank you, Dogoodthengo, for taking the time to improve my understanding of the French health care system. I was under the misimpression that it was considered socialized medicine. While I do not think socialized medicine is a pejorative, I wish we could adopt their system.

    I saw a woman today begging me for help. She has insurance. She also has a very large, widely differentiated tumor on her cervical lymph node, (nonlymphoma) adjacent to, and being fed by, her carotid artery. It grew from 4.5 to 11cm in less than 8 weeks. It will kill her very shortly. They only surgeon around who is skilled enough to to the surgery does not take Blue Cross/Blue Shield. The surgeons who do take BCBS have refused to do the surgery because of it's complexity. She and her husband cannot afford to pay out of network. Therefore, she will just die. All I can do for her is prescribe for pain and nausea. Too bad, so sad for her. AND SHE IS INSURED! It is an outrage.

    She is 47. Will never see 48. At this rate she won't see Christmas. And some of you think this is moral and just. Sleep well. heh.
    As one who has been to France many times and has a "love affiar" with the language and culture can honestly say everyone thinks the grass is greener on the otherside of the fence.

    France's healthcare system is great, don't get me wrong, especially for pre-natal, maternity and well baby/child health but you're not going to find state of the art equipment and or physicans practicing cutting edge treatments and such on every corner as with most of the USA. If one lives in Paris, or any other of the large French cities then you're pretty well set, but once you get out into the smaller towns and or villages things can and often do change.

    As the article I posted upthread states, if a maternity hospital/unit closes in one's small French town you may have to travel tens, if not a score or more miles to the next.

    Regarding the situation you describe about your patient, that just makes me sick!

    Disgusting and repulsive as that poor woman's situation may be, it happens every day in this here country.
  6. 0
    Some would argue that the responsible thing to do would have been for her husband (or her) to have maintained the insurance that they had rather than take a position that didn't offer any coverage. Not me per se, but I can a hear a couple of acquaintances making that arguement!! How very sad for this young family =(

    Quote from JMBnurse
    Back in 2005, I was working on an Oncology floor in an area hospital. One afternoon we admitted a 34 yr old mother of two elementary school aged children to our floor. Jennifer (not her real name) had been to a walk-in clinic earlier that day and the doctor there had called our Oncologist and sent Jennifer to the hospital.

    Jennifer had been diagnosed with breast cancer in her 20's and had been treated at the time and the treatment worked. She had a strong family history of breast cancer, both her mother and aunt were survivors. When Jennifer was diagnosed, she and her husband had insurance through their jobs. Jennifer was supposed to go back to her Oncologist every 6 mos. or so after her treatment for follow up exams to make sure the cancer did not return. Jennifer's husband had graduated from college in the meantime and had a new job as a preacher for a small local church. They had no insurance after her cancer treatment and were not eligible for Medicaid. Because of Jennifer's medical history, they could not get any other insurance coverage. She did not go for the follow-ups.

    Jennifer had gone to the walk in clinic that day because she had a cough that just wouldn't go away. She had avoided seeking any help before this because it was too expensive to pay out of pocket and she didn't want to take money for this away from her family's already tight budget. She knew they would never have been able to afford the expensive tests needed to monitor her. She put her family's needs first.

    After Jennifer was admitted to our floor, she was sent for a multitude of scans. They showed that she was full of metastasis everywhere. Because of her age, it was decided to aggressively treat the cancer and she was sent home for outpatient chemo treatment. This was in May. In July, she was admitted back to our floor and we barely recognized her. She was swollen from head to toe and had lost all of her hair. She was weak, tired and in pain, everywhere. She had opportunistic infections of every kind. We hooked her up to a PCA pump and kept her comfortable. She lost consciousness and died on our floor a few days later.

    Her young husband was devastated and now faced raising two young children alone. Those two children must grow up without their mother. I saw the fear on the faces of Jennifer's two sisters as they watched her suffer and die so quickly, surely fearful that this could happen to them, too.

    The nurses on my floor cried over the loss of Jennifer for days. Some of the nurses kept in touch with her husband and I believe he remarried a few yrs. later.

    I wish this story was a rare one, but it is not in this country. Because of the type of cancer she had, the same fate ultimately may have awaited Jennifer, but I believe she would have had more time with her children if she been covered by insurance and had been able to receive the appropriate follow-up care she needed.
  7. 1
    I have been reading these posts since the first page, it bothers me that two arguments continue to rear there ugly heads. The first being that of indivual sad experiences. As nurses I cannot believe that any nurse would be in favor of a person suffering for any reason. Yet, the proponents for ACA keep acting like that is what the opponents are saying. Most of the opponents , are aware there is a problem. They just aren't willing to support a problem that will not fix the healthcare and has the huge potential to be damaging to the country as a whole unit. The second is that I have not seen one post from the proponents addressing the other concern to the opponents, which is how do we create an environment to where the "poor" are inspired to work harder, sacrifice more to be where we are. I grew up a very poor girl. I'd share my story but I choose not to whine and get trapped in the "poor me" scenerio.
    realmaninuniform likes this.
  8. 4
    Quote from toekneejo
    which is how do we create an environment to where the "poor" are inspired to work harder, sacrifice more to be where we are.
    Perhaps we start by realizing that many of the "poor" are already working harder and sacrificing more than a lot of us.
    RNfaster, Fiona59, FMF Corpsman, and 1 other like this.
  9. 1
    Quote from wooh
    Perhaps we start by realizing that many of the "poor" are already working harder and sacrificing more than a lot of us.
    . I might be willing to support this but I would need more stats.... How many households are without cable? How many households are without electronics (games, computers, phones, music, etc)? How many households in this "group" are not using their resources for addictive activities (nicotine, alcohol, gambling, etc)? How many are refusing a job due to it being "too hard" or "beneath" them? Please don't think that I am wanting to argue - on the contrary I am trying to see the validity of the other side.
    Last edit by toekneejo on Oct 5, '12 : Reason: Clarification
    realmaninuniform likes this.
  10. 0
    In addition, sorry I just thiught about this. For the above "group" I and most are willing to assist in charitable ways. But why is the ACA seen as the only answer? One does not cut off his nose to spite his face


Top