All NY State ADN's and Students - page 2

first, let me say that i am not trying to drum up a debate between adn vs. bsn, etc. we have other threads for that. i just wanted to make everyone aware of what is going on and being proposed in... Read More

  1. by   LadyT618
    Quote from SmilingBluEyes
    Read even more carefully and you see where they want to relegate ADN/Diploma grads who do not earn their BSN within 10 years to LPN or inactive RN status!

    this is a form of grandfathering, WITH a stipulation many are not seeing.
    That stipulation only applies to people who get their ADNs AFTER this plan goes into effect. Not for people who get it before. Think of it this way....the plan will NOT be retroactive; and in this case, that's a good thing.
  2. by   rasmu
    Quote from CNM2B
    The New York State Board for Nursing (SBFN) recently agreed to recommend to the state Board of Regents that registered nurses with diploma or associate degrees be required to attain bachelor's degrees in nursing within 10 years of their licensure.

    The requirement would apply only to RNs and nursing students who enter practice after the measure is enacted - all currently practicing RNs and nursing students would be exempted.
    Unfortunately, I am a resident of New York state, and so this might affect me.
    If you read some of my other posts, you will see that I am 39 years old and that because of the amount of student loan debt which I already carry, a B.S.N. degree may not be financially feasible for me.

    The bottom line is, I may have to take my ADN degree and move out of NY state.
    Last edit by rasmu on May 24, '04
  3. by   JWilsonLPN
    So does this mean that if I am enrolled in the Regents College progam, this will not effect me?. I am an LPN preparinging to start in the Excelsior program soon. Maybe I ought to go back to Ohio!!!!!!:uhoh21:
  4. by   ayndim
    Hasn't this been threatened everywhere for years? Along with phasing out LPN's. With the current shortage of nurses I would be very surprised if this passes.

    Here in Phoenix, the state has ordered the cc's and uni's to pump out more nurses. Two (I believe there are 5 in this area with nursing programs) cc's and one uni have classes throught the summer so you can finish in less than 18 months after pre-reqs. There is also an accelerated one that you take you classes online and go to the hospital for clinicals. And a couple of new sites have opened up for nursing schools. The cc's actually run a couple right out of the hospitals now, in addition to on campus classes.

    In my opinion if the states want BSN nurses they are going to have to fund the Rn to BSN bridge programs. If it is free and run at the hospitals many nurses would probably take advantage of it.
  5. by   will7678
    Even if this gets passed it is going to be a while. Notice how it said no date has been set to even start discussing it yet at the board of regents level. When my brother in law was starting school (he just finished this spring) it was an issue then as well. So as you can see this isn't exactly moving very fast. Since it will not affect anyone that is a student when (if) it is passed everyone that is on this board probably will not be affected. I am on a wait list and expect to get into a my nurisng program in the spring and I will be shocked if this is passed before then as I am sure that it will take a while to set a date to discuss it then there will be long breaks for thanksgiving and christmas and finally about this time next year they may have gotten around to it. So we are safe with our associates degrees. However for the future of nursing in NY. Yeah for a while I think it will cause more of a shortage, which will drive salaries up which in a few years time(about the 4 it takes to get a BSN) will get us back to where we are now since more people will choose nursing if the salaries go up even higher in NY. It may even attract some nurses from out of state to come for higher wages. Also since anyone with their associates already does not have to ever get a BSN, this would attract nurses with two year degrees and four year degrees.
  6. by   Ross1
    While continued education is certainly a good thing, I certainly cannot imagine how NYSNA could take up this proposal at a time when the nursing shortage is so severe and expected to reach a crisis level within the next 10-15 years. There simply aren't enough BSN, ADN, or Diploma programs to meet the current need for nursing students and a proposal like would likely increase the nursing shortage.

    I'm a New Yorker and a current first year ADN student (starting Aug 30, 04) but am not worried at all about this. In the unlikely event that this passes, I would be exempt anyway since I am a current student......AND....for those who aren't exempt....10 years is a very generous amount of time to earn the BSN.

    REALITY though: NYSNA can propose anything it wants.....proposals though are meaningless since any major change like this in the licensing laws would need to be approved by the NY State General Assembly and Senate. ......as of today, August 03, our Governor, State Senate, and General Assembly can't even reach a compromise about a budget.......can't see them ever agreeing on a change as radical as this. First questions that they will ask? How much will it cost? Why is it needed? This goes against the trend of everywhere else in the USA and its territories (except for North Dakota). If every other state accepts the BSN, why does NY need to be different?

    Even if it did actually pass, it could still take several years to implement. Example, after years if not decades of advocacy by the National Associaton of Social Workers New York State Chapter, NY has a new social work licensing law that goes into effect on Sept. 1, 2004. You will start seeing the new licenses of L.M.S.W. or Licensed Master Social Worker (in place of the old C.S.W. or Certified Social Worker) and the new advanced practice license of L.C.S.W. or Licensed Clinical Social Worker. This proposal was passed by the Assembly and Senate and signed into law in 2002 but still took 2 years for implementation.
  7. by   Ross1
    sorry, I goofed. Corrections:
    1) This was proposed by the NY State Board of Nursing. I stated NYSNA in my posting.

    2) second to last paragraph. Should have said, "If every other state excepts the ADN, why should NY be different" (from the industry standard). I stated "BSN" in error.
  8. by   Chevelle
    [QUOTE=RNPATL]I understand that, but my question is ... why would anyone go into the ADN program, knowing that they are going to have to have a BSN in the next few years? It would be wiser to just go for the BSN from the start. The other question I would have ..... are there enough BSN programs to meet the need? I would venture to say that there are not. This is going to be another huge problem for NY.[QUOTE]

    I don't believe there are enough BSN programs around here. I have looked into programs with Plattsburgh, SUNY Upstate, Roberts Wesleyan...they all required you to have your RN license first. Yet, if you have thousands of nurses wanting to go right into their bachelor's after the AD, there is going to be some HUGE competition.

    I would also think that by enacting something like this before there are resources to back it up is going to cause a "supply & demand" effect. The cost of the BSN in NYS is going to through the roof...causing many people financial problems because it is harder to get decent financial aid with a nursing salary-especially in a two income househol...hospitals may be willing to take some of the cost, but that could get huge...increasing costs in the hospital...it is all a chain of effect.

    I also wonder what it would do to the nursing salaries. Will they go up higher if the shortage gets worse b/c people are deterred by having to get a bachelor's degree? Some people only want to go to school for a couple years-that should be their choice!

    I think it would also ruin the competition for certain positions. Before you know it, you will be required to go for your Masters just to stay ahead of the game.

    NYS doesn't have to pay for it, they don't have to do all the hard work that comes with becoming a nurse, let alone being one...who do they think they are telling people what they "have" to have!!

    How about worrying about our state budget first!!!!!!
  9. by   Kashmeera
    Hello Everybody!

    I am in the pre-nursing program in NYC and would like to ask a few questions.
    I started my classes and find it so interesting. I am thrilled to be back in school and now I would like to get some information and suggestions form you all.
    Originally I was planning to become a RN and then go into alternative medicine, but now I would like to find out more about my options once I`m a RN.
    Can I have an Associates in Nursing and then go back to school to become a Nurse Practitioner? How long takes that program and can I become a MD from there? What is the difference if I go straight to Medical school instead of becoming a RN, a Nurse practitioner and then a Doctor?
    The thing is that I would much rather have all the real experience in the hospital and work my way up, then come out of Med School without experienece.
    I simply met too many doctors who are not too bright and should definatly not manage other people!
    So, I wonder about the length of study and (if you should have any information) the difference in education.
    Thank you all so much!

    Kashmeera
  10. by   -jt
    <<<While continued education is certainly a good thing, I certainly cannot imagine how NYSNA could take up this proposal at a time when the nursing shortage>>>

    <<<NYS doesn't have to pay for it, they don't have to do all the hard work that comes with becoming a nurse, let alone being one...who do they think they are telling people what they "have" to have!! Worry about the state budget!!>>>

    Just to clear up a couple of things, it was not NYSNA that proposed this change. In fact, NYSNA has written OPPOSITION to it & is lobbying in Albany against it. It wasnt "the state" who proposed the changes either. All of this came from one place only - our state BOARD OF NURSING, not our state legislature or our state nurses association.
  11. by   Ross1
    Just to clear up a couple of things, it was not NYSNA that proposed this change. In fact, NYSNA has written OPPOSITION to it & is lobbying in Albany against it. It wasnt "the state" who proposed the changes either. All of this came from one place only - our state BOARD OF NURSING, not our state legislature or our state nurses association.[/QUOTE]

    Actually, in my follow-up posting, I pointed out my mistake and correctly reported that it was the NYS Board of Nursing that has proposed this change. But to reiterate to everyone, the authority to make this change is 100% in the hands of the NY State General Assembly and NY State Senate.
    I simply cannot imagine how our legislature (the Assembly and Senate) could ever seriously consider such a proposal which is completely out of step with the national standards for that define the educational requirements of an RN AND a proposal that would only exacerbate the nursing shortage. That said, everyone who is against this proposal has an obligation to telphone or send a letter to his/her representative in the NY Assembly as well as NY State Senator. And for those that don't fully understand politics, this is not Senators Clinton, Shumer or the Congressman/Congresswoman for your district. Those are your Federal Legislators.

    If you do not know your NY legislators, log onto www.vote-smart.org and follow the directions.

    A word of caution, while their e-mail addresses will be listed, this is the least effective form of communication with your legislator. A phone call to his/her office is far more effective as is a real letter that is mailed in the traditional way. A personal face-face meeting with the legislator or aide is the best strategy. Whether over the phone or via letter, always be sure to indicate that you are this legislator's constituent and give your full name, address, and phone number. Legislators are only interested in hearing from people who are constituents (live in their district).
  12. by   rasmu
    Quote from Kashmeera
    Hello Everybody!

    I am in the pre-nursing program in NYC and would like to ask a few questions.

    Kashmeera
    To become an RN in New York State you would typically get either a 2 year Associate degree in nursing or a 4 year BSN degree. There is a lot of other discussion on this website about what the difference is between the two, but out in the working world, RNs with either degree have very similar pay and responsibilities. The 4 year degree may perhaps have more prestige and some say that it provides better opportunites to move up in a healthcare organization.

    To become a NP, you need a Masters degree in Nursing. Typically you might need some job experience to get admitted into a Masters Nursing program.

    I don't know too much about admission to medical school, but my understanding is that the basic requirements are a Bachelor's degree (any field) and excellent scores on the medical school entrance exams.
  13. by   Kashmeera
    It is so kind of you to take the time and give me all this information!

    Kashmeera

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