Are online ANP degrees destroying our credibility? - page 28

by jilljw

I was talking to a private practice doctor about an opening in his practice. Currently, I am employed by the hospital. He told me that they will only consider PA's due to having more of a hard science based training and longer... Read More


  1. 0
    Quote from Mark Hill BSN
    What schools did you attend? I did my ADN at a brick and mortar, then my BSN at a brick and mortar, but I chose an online schoo lfor MSN for two reasons. One, most of the schools I am familiar with have gone to online formats...and two, the convenience of the online format. Having been an RN for 20 years, I dont think I will learn how to me an FNP any better in a crowded stuffy calssroom than I will in the comfort of my own home!
    Northwestern State University-Psych CNS-brick and mortar

    Rush University-Psych NP-Distance ed
  2. 0
    Quote from Mark Hill BSN
    Actually, my state BON specifically states on it's wedsite, that any graduate from a CCNE accredited university may sit for the state board.
    Which state?
  3. 0
    I agree with Myelin. I think that it is for-profit online education that is hurting our profession. Many professions offer online training-accountant, teachers, MBAs, etc. I am currently attending online classes and they are actually more rigorous than brick and mortar classes. My school, however, is well-known and respectable. It is the for-profit education that makes people look down on NPs, but this doctor sounds like a real douche. I wouldn't want to work for him in general. He obviously has a problem with nurses in general.
  4. 0
    It's only matter to those who hasn't practiced, gone to NP or attending school to become NP.
  5. 0
    Quote from Mark Hill BSN
    This discussion is amusing from the standpoint that those who dont thing online education is a good thing have gone to a brick and mortor schools, and those who think online school are good, have gone to "online universities". The only way to prove which is better would be to do a study on the subject, until then it is all anectdotal speculation. My idea in all of this is,if online education is so "inadequate" then why are so many traditional universities going to an online format? In the end, in order to be reputable, all the schools have to be CCNE accredited for their graduates to sit for state exams.
    The answer is money. I am opposite of most in that I just finished an online degree with a well-respected university, and felt like the "quality" was terrible. Adjunct instructors for some of the classes didn't check into the class during the entire semester. Not one adjunct became involved in the discussion forum, and many of their notices and announcements were written more like a tweet.

    For instance: A question that was posed "is there a systematic way you evaluate a 12-lead EKG?". If I were the instructor, my answer would be "RRAHBI". Rate, Rythm, Axis, Hypertrophy, Bundle Branch Block, Ischemia. Any instructor at the advanced level should be able to tell you how THEY approach this basic concept in their practice. This instructors answer "you don't really need to know this for the test".

    Another comment from an adjunct "I am seeing this class for the first time also".

    But I can tell you that one of the cardiologists I work with was summa cum laude at Geisel School of Medicine at Dartmouth University in the 80's. He went on to cardiology fellowship at Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center. But at the time, stents didn't exist yet, so he had to teach himself how to do all of the cardiac techniques we consider common now.

    If he wants to look down on my online degree, ok. It will just make me try harder.

    But I will tell you, accreditation is a money game also, and there are no state boards for advanced practice.
    Last edit by casias12 on May 9, '13 : Reason: added
  6. 0
    QUOTE=Mark Hill BSN;7307426]Actually, my state BON specifically states on it's wedsite, that any graduate from a CCNE accredited university may sit for the state board.

    I misread this, it actually reads "any universtiy that is nationally accredited"...


    [/QUOTE]
  7. 0
    Quote from elkpark
    Which state?
    Mississippi
  8. 2
    Quote from casias12
    The answer is money. I am opposite of most in that I just finished an online degree with a well-respected university, and felt like the "quality" was terrible. Adjunct instructors for some of the classes didn't check into the class during the entire semester. Not one adjunct became involved in the discussion forum, and many of their notices and announcements were written more like a tweet.

    For instance: A question that was posed "is there a systematic way you evaluate a 12-lead EKG?". If I were the instructor, my answer would be "RRAHBI". Rate, Rythm, Axis, Hypertrophy, Bundle Branch Block, Ischemia. Any instructor at the advanced level should be able to tell you how THEY approach this basic concept in their practice. This instructors answer "you don't really need to know this for the test".

    Another comment from an adjunct "I am seeing this class for the first time also".

    But I can tell you that one of the cardiologists I work with was summa cum laude at Geisel School of Medicine at Dartmouth University in the 80's. He went on to cardiology fellowship at Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center. But at the time, stents didn't exist yet, so he had to teach himself how to do all of the cardiac techniques we consider common now.

    If he wants to look down on my online degree, ok. It will just make me try harder.

    But I will tell you, accreditation is a money game also, and there are no state boards for advanced practice.
    I agree the money does drive most things....I think my point in all this is, a nurse practitioner student or practicing clinician will be a good or as bad as they choose to be, and where they went to school will have little to do with this. I have been an RN for over 20 years and I can tell you there have been numerous times while working in ER that I would have the unpleasant experience of working with an NP who had very little idea as to what they were doing. Some of them went to very reputable brick and mortar schools. I beleive that the individual compitence levels of the individuals had little to do with where they went to school and much to do with their clinical compitence well before they started NP school.
    zmansc and nomadcrna like this.
  9. 0
    VERY late to this thread, but I found it when looking up a few things I've found troubling/been questioning. I embrace the fact that people learn differently. I attended a "prestigious" brick & mortar ABSN/NP program after a successful 1st career. I have huge respect for those that can attend respected online/mixed block university classes & excel. I think online learning CAN be more challenging than in class, but it must be a rigorous with very self directed students. (Disclaimer: from I have seen of/from most of the for-profit online universities, their curriculum/instruction/grading model is severely lacking). The thing that unites me to many of my most respected NP colleagues, regardless of which/what kind of university we graduated??...We agree on the fact that our education was woefully inadequate & the level of knowledge required to pass the NP boards was substandard. There are classmates from "prestigious" schools I wouldn't let touch my family w/a 10 ft pole & colleagues from "sub-par" universities that I would seek out above all others. The difference is those I trust/respect are self-motivated learners bc (very few) MSN programs give NPs the education needed to truly function as APRNs. I finished my boards with more embarrassment than celebration...I felt as though I could've/should've been able to answer all of those questions after completion of my BSN...to think that those boards were the gate that separated sub-par students from practice?...not exactly comforting! (For the record, I took ANCC ANP boards). My general point is that we need to raise the quality & *standard* for core MSN classes, the number of required clinical hours & raise the bar on our entrance boards to ensure clinical competence. I've seen the argument throughout the thread "online & brick/mortar students pass the boards with similar percentages"...I submit that the problem is the low expectation of the boards, & that you can teach to a lower standard in any number of ways. I am immensely proud of our profession & so many of my colleagues, but sometimes you can take the concept of "nursing model" vs "medical model" too far & miss many of the necessities vital to each.
  10. 0
    Quote from ashleyrobin
    VERY late to this thread, but I found it when looking up a few things I've found troubling/been questioning. I embrace the fact that people learn differently. I attended a "prestigious" brick & mortar ABSN/NP program after a successful 1st career. I have huge respect for those that can attend respected online/mixed block university classes & excel. I think online learning CAN be more challenging than in class, but it must be a rigorous with very self directed students. (Disclaimer: from I have seen of/from most of the for-profit online universities, their
    curriculum/instruction/grading model is severely lacking). The thing that unites me to many of my most respected NP colleagues, regardless of which/what kind of university we graduated??...We agree on the fact that our education was woefully inadequate & the level of knowledge required to pass the NP boards was substandard. There are classmates from "prestigious" schools I wouldn't let touch my family w/a 10 ft pole & colleagues from "sub-par" universities that I would seek out above all others. The difference is those I trust/respect are self-motivated learners bc (very few) MSN programs give NPs the education needed to truly function as APRNs. I finished my boards with more embarrassment than celebration...I felt as though I could've/should've been able to answer all of those questions after completion of my BSN...to think that those boards were the gate that separated sub-par students from practice?...not exactly comforting! (For the record, I took ANCC ANP boards). My general point is that we need to raise the quality & *standard* for core MSN classes, the number of required clinical hours & raise the bar on our entrance boards to ensure clinical competence. I've seen the argument throughout the thread "online & brick/mortar students pass the boards with similar percentages"...I submit that the problem is the low expectation of the boards, & that you can teach to a lower standard in any number of ways. I am immensely proud of our profession & so many of my colleagues, but sometimes you can take the concept of "nursing model" vs "medical model" too far & miss many of the necessities vital to each.
    In the end, I think it all boils down to the individual, and how well they want to function in this profession and very little about what school they attended. Just like with any other profession, there will be good and bad people in all of them. Nurse practitioners are no exceptions to this. I too believe that very few schools can properly prepare a nurse to be a nurse practitioner. My best friend is an MD, and he told me the medical school didn't prepare him to be a doctor either.....he learned it as he went along.


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