NP w/no desire for RN? - page 22

Well, not so much NO desire...but are there any NP's out there that wanted to become (and had their sights set on being an NP from day 1) an NP with no real 'drive' to be an RN first? My cousin is... Read More

  1. by   desanobsn
    Quote from LCRN
    In response to Desanobsn--> Not all jobs are as you described...maybe it was at the facility that you chose to work at or the particular floor. I am extremely happy as a nurse, I feel I'm respected and love to discuss the plan of care with my physicians. The patients are my priority and I am their advocate. I feel I work in a safe environment because of my co-workers who know what true teamwork means and have my "back" to prevent safety issues when we have a patient doing poorly. I could not imagine doing anything else other than bedside nursing. As many RN's have told me, I hope in 10 years I will remain feeling the same way.

    My opinion is that to go on for graduate work you NEED to do some time as a nurse and I'm glad that many schools require a minimum amount of time required.
    lcrn, i'm happy that your experience has been good, my wish is for all nurses to have your personal experience, but i know that it's not. that why we are in the mist of a nation wide nursing shortage, that will only get worse with the ever increasing geriatric population. statistics show that many new nurses are coming out of school, working one or two years, and getting out of the profession entirely because of the poor working conditions and low pay. i worked in two of the three facilities in my area, and never knew of one floor nurse that liked their work. we all wanted to like it, but how do you do that when you are expected to work with limited staff all the time. many times i've seen the night nurses come in with 13 pts each, and they don't take acuity into account like some facilities do. how can you like working in a place like this. my dream job would have been working in same day surgery, but those jobs never opened up, and if they did, they hired internally. if you didn't know someone working there, forget it. i was totally new and just out of school, when i went in for this interview. i guess that's why 75% of their staff are travelers, and they don't renew either. i just want to encourage those who are unhappy, and have not found that dream nursing job, to remember that you can never go wrong by increasing your level of education, because it always opens up your opportunities. it's always worth it.
  2. by   zenman
    Quote from desanobsn
    lots, WRONG!!

    It's unfortunate that I have to give some examples of how nursing experience helps in NP school. Here's a few.

    1. I have lot's of experience dealing with patients, families and other healthcare providers.
    2. I have a working knowledge of how the healthcare system works.
    3. I know medications, including which ones are given for different conditions. I actually gave the meds and I'm the first to see the effects of them.
    4. I know how to assess patients and when a physician makes rounds can verify his findings with mine. I can even "play" like I'm the attending and see how correct I am when the physician makes his assessment.
    5. I really know how to set priorities in the care of patients.

    Do you see how this could be a rather long list? Startling how much you actually know!
  3. by   sirI
    I know my opinion will not be well received, but I need to interject again.

    Having RN experience prior to NP school is, IMHO, a must. I've had experience with NPs coming from both backgrounds, with and without RN experience prior to NP school.. The ones who possess the exceptionally higher critical thinking skills are the ones with adequate RN experience. This cannot be obtained with little or no experience and certainly not something one can sharpen in an NP program. It is always difficult to sharpen a blunt object without the proper tool.

    Yes, you will get a wonderful education as NP. But, the ones without any experience will not have that smooth transition as they "advance" their practice. And, that is the whole idea, to advance ones' practice.

    For example:

    As an RN, especially one seeking the NP career, one will gain much knowledge on the whys and hows of medicine. As an RN seeking the NP role, one should be able to logically and systematically obtain an adequate health history applicable to the disease process. If one has never done this prior to NP school, one will be less than prepared for the complex nature of the disciplined physical assessment tool.

    As an RN, one will obtain valuable knowledge on why certain diagnostic tests are ordered and how they apply to the disease process. How to interpret said diagnostic values and how these interpretations guide the health care provider (HCP) to tweak the treatment of the patient. This is something you learn in any NP program, but believe me, prior experience in this area allows for a better understanding during the learning process while in the NP program.

    As an RN, one will learn how to interact with members of the healthcare team and understand the valuable role each play in the management of the patient. The RN will learn how each develop and manage treatment modalities for the patient.

    As an RN, one will observe firsthand how the HCP consults and when, when referral is necessary and why; all necessary to the role of the NP.

    Again, this is siri speaking from years of experience as an NP. An NP who serves as mentor for newly graduated NPs coming from both backgrounds and is privy to the difficulties of each. An NP who believes the difference between a good NP and a great NP is a systematic process: the RN living and working in the world of advanced practice.
    Last edit by sirI on Apr 23, '06
  4. by   desanobsn
    Quote from tinderbox
    WOW!! Talk about judgmental and bitter! I am a new grad nurse, very SLIM (not that it matters), healthy, non-smoker, workout--- and I, personally, would never want to go to an NP who had no bedside nursing experience. And my future goal is to possibly go to CRNA school as well, but I believe strongly that my skills learned while working as an RN will be invaluable and important.
    Thanks for your time and good day...
    tinderbox, just because you don't like what brownrice has to say, doesn't mean she's judgmental or bitter. she is telling you how it is, or should i say, how it can be. i can tell you, i have personally seen this exact behavior. people can have good or bad experiences. if your a new grad, you don't have a clue about what your talking about anyway. that's usually how it is, people that know the least, have the biggest opinions. i can relate to everything she says!!! about the NPs, i'd be much more concerned about their knowledge base, skill at diagnosing disease, and following through with a good plan of care, than how good they are at placing an ABD pad, or inserting an NG tube. i think you need to reseach the role, and scope of practice of the NP.
  5. by   desanobsn
    Quote from zenman
    It's unfortunate that I have to give some examples of how nursing experience helps in NP school. Here's a few.

    1. I have lot's of experience dealing with patients, families and other healthcare providers.
    2. I have a working knowledge of how the healthcare system works.
    3. I know medications, including which ones are given for different conditions. I actually gave the meds and I'm the first to see the effects of them.
    4. I know how to assess patients and when a physician makes rounds can verify his findings with mine. I can even "play" like I'm the attending and see how correct I am when the physician makes his assessment.
    5. I really know how to set priorities in the care of patients.

    Do you see how this could be a rather long list? Startling how much you actually know!
    this is not rocket science. you make it sound like a NP is just thrown out there. when you graduate as an advanced practice nurse, that means you have gone to school for a minimum of 6 years. don't you think in that time, you would have a good understanding of everything involved? if you don't, then somethings wrong. i believe that if you plan to practice mostly in a hospital (which i don't), then get some experience if that's what you feel like you want to do, but i don't think it's necessary. before i began working the floor, i thought the same way, you HAVE to have experience. it wasn't UNTIL i worked on the floor that i realized everything i was doing had nothing to do with being an NP. so i asked my friend who was already in the NP program, "of everthing i'm doing on the floor, what translates to helping me in the NP program", she said basically.....nothing, and she was right. now that i'm in the program, she's totally right. it's two entirely different jobs.
  6. by   zenman
    Quote from desanobsn
    this is not rocket science. you make it sound like a NP is just thrown out there. when you graduate as an advanced practice nurse, that means you have gone to school for a minimum of 6 years. don't you think in that time, you would have a good understanding of everything involved? if you don't, then somethings wrong. i believe that if you plan to practice mostly in a hospital (which i don't), then get some experience if that's what you feel like you want to do, but i don't think it's necessary. before i began working the floor, i thought the same way, you HAVE to have experience. it wasn't UNTIL i worked on the floor that i realized everything i was doing had nothing to do with being an NP. so i asked my friend who was already in the NP program, "of everthing i'm doing on the floor, what translates to helping me in the NP program", she said basically.....nothing, and she was right. now that i'm in the program, she's totally right. it's two entirely different jobs.
    You have one year of experience! Siri will you respond to this as you have more patience than I do? (I studied too much Carl Whitaker!) With my years of experience, I'm cruising through NP school and waiting for the challenging stuff. On second thought, don't listen to Siri either as she never knows what she's talking about
  7. by   desanobsn
    Quote from zenman
    I wonder how this impacts those who want to go straight into NP school with no RN experience? Even though RN practice is not the same as NP practice you still have some valuable experience behind you.
    again zenman, your doing something completly different. valuable experience in one job is great for THAT job. different jobs require different skills. you have to compare apples to apples.
  8. by   desanobsn
    Quote from ramiro_ac
    this is sarcasm......so the BSN makes one a better nurse than the ADN? dont all nurses take the same licensure examination?

    by your post then you could say than an entry level MSN-RN nurse is better than a BSN nurse, even both took the same exam.
    this is not sarcasm, just incorrect information.
  9. by   Selke
    Well, I am heartened by the fact that the job postings I see for CNMs on listservs and other places state that they will "consider a new CNM graduate only if she was an experienced L&D nurse before going to midwifery school." (paraphrased)

    So my years experience aren't an unnecessary waste out in the Real World and maybe my learning curve will be steeper and shorter ...
  10. by   desanobsn
    Quote from prairienp
    my heart wants to agree with you, but the "research" suggests little to no difference in performance after completion of a np program using years of experience as the independent variable.
    i've read the same research prairie, i personally know several outstanding nps who went straight-through after getting their bsn. christy may not be great at starting an iv, but who the heck cares. she doesn't need that skill. i wouldn't hesitate to send any of my family or friends to her. she's top-notch, knows what she's doing (because she is book-smart), and her pts adore her. what more could you want.
  11. by   desanobsn
    Quote from Dragonfair
    Good Luck and God Bless I'm sticking with experience. It has got me through some tough time in codes and life experiences. Just make sure you have good Malpractice insurance.
    oh brother!!! seems to me that everybody who's any type of healthcare provider needs good malpractice insurance. even you
  12. by   desanobsn
    Quote from button2cute
    Hello, Amitai
    Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family.

    This thread is not about a health care applied to the provide. It does not show experience or no experience as a rn going into the nurse practitioner program at all. As I stated above it is bashing and off the topic of this thread. Anyone can begin a thread concerning any issue that would provide positive criticism and a resolution. In your post the description of the nurse practitioner does not show the theme of this thread at all. Your post reveals other issues that are concerning to you. 1) Lack of respect for you as an ER tech. 2) Lack of respect by your patient and medical personnel. 3) The negative attitudes by medical personnel due to the lack of education and skills of ER techs. 4) The lack of communication by medical personnel and ER Techs. Those are some of the issues that I derive from your post.

    In addition, part of the post spoke about your experience in the ER and the desire to continue your education of becoming an NP. Before, you can become a NP, one must become a nurse and the issue is the experience or no experience to attend nurse practitioner program. This shows the theme of the thread. Therefore, the theme and your thoughts/concerning experience or no experience prior attending a nurse practioner program is experience
    would be necessary to be successful according to your post.

    Any one can develop a thread on the site and reveal an issue that is concerning as well as to provide a resolution to the issue.

    Have a Safe and exciting day with your family and friends.

    Buttons
    butt, not one person is being rude or disrespectful. you seem to be having a lot of issues with these postings, i'd say maybe they're hitting just a little too close to home.
  13. by   desanobsn
    Quote from elkpark
    "Death by political correctness" -- the ANA and the other PTB in nursing made a big push, starting in the '60s (starting, specifically, with a 1965 ANA position statement on differentiated levels of practice), to move all nursing education into academic settings instead of hospital settings. I have no disagreement with that principle at all -- I just dislike how it's been implemented. I'm shocked at how little new grads know about nursing today compared with what my peers and I knew (and knew how to do) when we graduated.

    The irony, to me, is that, in the big push to "professionalize" nursing education and try to make it an academic pursuit, we're going back more and more to "on the job training" (which is what nursing fought so hard to get away from a century ago!) -- all the extended "new grad" orientation programs, "externships," "preceptorships," etc.; hospitals now assume that new grads don't know how to do anything and they're going to have to teach them everything practical they need to know.
    wow, you are soooo right. when i graduated with a BSN in 2004, i had no clinical skills at all. i knew how to make a bed and bath a pt., had started one IV, put in one foley, and had passed just a few po meds. that was it, no lie, but i could tell you everything you ever wanted to know about quantitative and qualitative research design. everyone in my class wanted more clinical time, but with 140 credit hours to get your degree, they said we didn't have time for clinicals, and that we would learn clinicals when we got on the floor. actually as they put it, "you can teach a monkey to learn practical skills". when i graduated and started working, let me tell you, many times i wish i was that "monkey". it was all so overwhelming and intimidating. you had to have extended orientation with a preceptor, because you had no knowledge about what do to on the floor, or how to care for a pt. my orientation was 8 wks, and even with that i was so scared to be on my own, because i had never had less that 7-8 pts. scary!!!

    this posting was very interesting to me, and i sure wish clinicals were like this when i got my degree.

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