LATERAL Violence. How Nurses treat Nurses! - Page 15

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  1. May 27, '09 by
    Thanks for the replies, I can fight back and do in my own way. Others may think I let people walk over me because I am gentle and kind. I have been around long enough to know what I want to live with and what I don't. I have been in an abusive marriage so I don't take any lectures about being careful about what I say and all that blah blah. I left a CCU because I wasn't interested in staying and trying to change their culture.
    new nurses should be encouraged and supported indeed, it takes time to have confidence. I have had my time to build it and have been fired a couple times so really there's not much a person can do to me.
  2. Jun 28, '09 by
    ...

    I makes me chuckle to read that people are so off-put by the terming of the behaviors described in the original thread as "violent". I also find it interesting that the majority of those who find fault with the term are those with many years of experience in nursing (not nursing students - the most prone of the nursing population to victimization) and it makes me wonder...

    In my opinion, the term "violence" is incredibly accurate. Why? Because it is abuse. I'll say it again, it is abuse - psychological, emotional, social, and in some circumstances - physical and/or sexual abuse. Because full on physical violence in the workplace is not only easy to spot but easy to take disciplinary action against, these types of behaviors take the place of physical violence. In my mind (and in the minds of many psych professionals), the long term effects of both are uncannily similar. The only distinction perhaps being that physical wounds heal.

    I have a hard time believing that educated, trained professionals don't recognize the severity and impact of those behaviors. To go so far as to describe a perfectly acceptable description of calculated malice as 'melodramatic' speaks to an obvious lack of empathy and - if the person making the description happens to participate in said actions - an acute sense of denial, if not edging toward sociopathy.
    canigraduate, trixie333, Mahage, and 1 other like this.
  3. Jun 28, '09 by
    Forgot to add new grads as a portion of the nursing population most prone to victimization. Opps!
  4. Jun 28, '09 by
    When I worked on a unit, the nursing instructor came to a meeting, and asked which of us would like to have a student nurse perform care for a patient we were assigned. She had more than enough volunteers!

    It's important for any worker to feel they have the power to refuse an "extra" thing to consider. We can't refuse to come to work, we can't refuse our assignment or something off the wall that we're asked to do by doctors. When we have a choice, it's nice to know we can vote.

    Personally I love working with students, and have many times. They relieve me of a lot of work, and I like to think that I've had a positive effect on someone's career in the making.
    Last edit by lamazeteacher on Jun 28, '09 : Reason: clarification
  5. Jun 28, '09 by
    Quote from rpric7990
    One or two nurses went behind my back to the director to tell him they thought I was unsure of myself during a code. The director brought it up with me, without the anonymous nurse present. so I get to wonder who has a lack of confidence about my abilitites enough to tell the director, yet not me. I put it down to the director's lack of management experience. However, the work environment had become a hostile place for me. I was on to the next job within a month. (whatever you want to call it, the lack of support, silence, or openly patronizing to name-calling acts that uppity old nurses give the new ones leads to a not a fun place to work.) The manager who supports or tolerates this type of behavior is often intimidated by his staff and immaturely looking to join the clique.
    Something similar happened to me. We had a horrible, horrible code in inpatient dialysis (an area that has few codes; only BLS). It was the unit bully's pt, and IMO she dropped the ball by failing to recognize that the pt was going bad (she never called the RRT!) A chaotic code happened (not our fault, the code team was late and no doc showed up for a long time) and the pt died (probably would have anyway no matter how well the code was run since she had a PE). Anyway, the very next day unit bully jumped all over me for "abandoning her" during the code! Never mind I was right next to her, or in the unit having been asked to look after other pts, the whole time. After such a dramatic code with unexpected loss of life (this 49 y/o mother of young kids had just come in for a "routine" procedure) i got verbally abused by this horrible bully nurse (whose skills are mediocre at best).

    Unfortunately, the manager is just like you describe: friends with the bully and wanting to be liked by her (although she was sympathetic to me after other nurses spoke up on my behalf and explained what really happened). However, I was suddenly off the schedule (I was PRN) and, as usual, the newest nurse (me) got thrown under the bus... I have since quit.

    Just how long will lateral (and vertical) violence be tolerated in nursing?!

    DeLana
    trixie333 likes this.
  6. Jun 28, '09 by
    "Just how long will lateral (and vertical) violence be tolerated in nursing?!"
    quote from post#144 by DeLanaRN

    It's been present and advantageous for some, for so long that it seems that the answer to your question is "never"!

    Combatting it has hardly ever brought restitution of reputations, jobs, and any real kind of satisfaction, yet it perpetuates. The payoff seems to be "Gotcha!!"
    That makes the perpetrater feel more powerful, wise, and wonderful. We've all seen this, most of us back away from it, lest we become involved, and many good nurses have gone away from nursing, to other seemingly less avoricious vocations.

    So next time your staffing is low, think about that. Perhaps you'll think of ways to support those who have been victimized by it.
    Mahage, pennyaline, Moogie, and 1 other like this.
  7. Jun 28, '09 by
    It does happen in other professions as well - but that is no excuse for initiating, participating in, condoning or defending the behaviors...

    I was an operations manager for a Fort 500 company that uses a contracted employee business model for day to day operations and in one facility I was stationed, there was one contractor who tirelessly tried to have me fired. But not before she'd charmed her way into a friendship with me in an attempt to gain my trust and ascertain what my strengths and weaknesses might be so that she could exploit them. She was pretty well bonkers. And she underestimated me - thought she had me figured out. When the poo hit the fan, my response was one she hadn't anticipated. I saw her coming from day one. But had I been especially vulnerable at the time (dealing with divorce, illness, a death in the family, what-have-you) it might have ended badly.

    I've since moved on from the company, but in doing some research after I left, I found that her antics had been behind the resignations of 5 individual staff, including two managers leaving the facility within 3 weeks of each other - but because she was a contracted employee and not necessarily subject to all of company policy, she had been able to get away with it for a very long time. I know now that the reason I was targeted was two-fold: Her most recent target had left the company and she wanted my job but didn't have the credentials to be considered. So, like the two managers that preceded me I was (in her twisted mind) a necessary target.
    Last edit by metal_m0nk on Jun 28, '09
    pennyaline likes this.
  8. Jun 28, '09 by
    Quote from nanacarol
    jlsRN, I understand the nurse described may not see herself as an instructor, but as nurses we ARE to teach, that includes student nurses and new nurses. A rose by any other name remains a rose, and the response the student received was intended to bully and intimidate the student and it did absolutely nothing to foster nursing as a profession. It is no secret that "nursing eats its young" we can't afford the attitude displayed in this time of a major Nursing shortage. If we are seen to devalue new potential nurses and students how is that raising our credibility as professional in the eyes of other disciplines? Pharmacists, psuchologists and physicians don't publicly attack each other nor do they air their dirty laundry by maligning each other in public. It is workplace violence and intimidation, it is hurtful to all.
    It's no secret that some like to tout the phrase "nurses eat their young", although I don't think it's ever been proven that nursing is harder on newbies than any other job. Personally, I'd like to see that phrase go away.
  9. Jun 28, '09 by
    I truly believe health care institutions quietly encourage lateral violence among nurses because it diverts our attention and energies away from things we could change. We're so busy infighting that we don't have enough energy left over to duke it out with administration over issues like mandatory overtime, frequent call-offs, understaffing, safe patient care, adequate benefits and pay.

    We acquiesce our power and prefer to take our frustrations out on each other. Very sad state of affairs.

    If nursing is going to solve the problem of lateral violence, it has to take ownership of the problem and work positively to encourage HEALTHY communication between health care co-workers.
    DeLana_RN, Angie O'Plasty, RN, Mahage, and 3 others like this.
  10. Jun 28, '09 by
    Quote from Moogie
    I truly believe health care institutions quietly encourage lateral violence among nurses because it diverts our attention and energies away from things we could change. We're so busy infighting that we don't have enough energy left over to duke it out with administration over issues like mandatory overtime, frequent call-offs, understaffing, safe patient care, adequate benefits and pay.

    We acquiesce our power and prefer to take our frustrations out on each other. Very sad state of affairs.

    If nursing is going to solve the problem of lateral violence, it has to take ownership of the problem and work positively to encourage HEALTHY communication between health care co-workers.
    Correct. Other posters in this thread have commented that lateral (and vertical) violence has historically been used to the benefit of some staff and administrators for a very long time. In training, were we not all taught that the work and the workplace are not about us? We have sometimes taken that teaching so seriously that we start thinking that nothing is about us and that we have no business expecting respect and consideration from anyone.

    As for the use of the word "violence:" violence is what it is, hostile and brutal. It is an abusive, demeaning, dispiriting slap in the mouth when it happens, and that is what it is meant to be by the person doing it. It is intentional violence, plain and simple.
    canigraduate, Mahage, morte, and 2 others like this.