Breastfeeding questions - page 8
Just wondering what your thoughts are on this.. I know that especially in our culture today breastfeeding is the absolute it thing to do, but sometimes it is not best for the baby, or not done... Read More
Feb 19, '05It's seen as weird because women who nurse past the first year don't do so in public anymore. Some of it is to avoid ignorant people like NoCrumping, some of it is just because a toddler doesn't nurse as much and there's not the same urgency to nurse everywhere as you do with a newborn. If you go back a couple of decades, nursing in and of itself was seen as weird or odd.
Feb 19, '05Quote from LilPeanutThat is very true . .. my mom started having her kids in the late 1950's and the thinking then was the formula was better for babies than breastmilk and mothers were discouraged from breastfeeding. I have my baby book which recommended started solid foods at 4 months, and not just rice cereal but everything. I wonder how many food allergies started this way?It's seen as weird because women who nurse past the first year don't do so in public anymore. Some of it is to avoid ignorant people like NoCrumping, some of it is just because a toddler doesn't nurse as much and there's not the same urgency to nurse everywhere as you do with a newborn. If you go back a couple of decades, nursing in and of itself was seen as weird or odd.
Feb 19, '05Quote from LilPeanutLIlpeanut: I AM NOT IGNORANT.I JUST HAVE MY OWN VIEW ON THE SUBJECT, OR IS THAT NOT ACCECPTABLE TO YOU, SINCE IT IS NOT THE SAME AS YOURS? 'IGNORANT' IMPLIES LACK OF KNOWLEDGE, THAT IS NOT THE CASE WITH ME. YOU MIGHT WANT TO USE THE TERM 'INTOLERANT'. (OF BREASTFEEDING A KID 3-5 YRS OLD)It's seen as weird because women who nurse past the first year don't do so in public anymore. Some of it is to avoid ignorant people like NoCrumping, some of it is just because a toddler doesn't nurse as much and there's not the same urgency to nurse everywhere as you do with a newborn. If you go back a couple of decades, nursing in and of itself was seen as weird or odd.
Feb 19, '05Quote from Ms.HobbesExactly!We should never be hasty to judge anyone, especially in the nursing profession.
I was just thinking to myself that whether we want them to or not,sometimes our feelings and biases to shine through in patient care. Educating ourselves about the differences in those around us may help us to be able to overlook someone elses choices,even if it is not a choice we would would make for ourselves,our own families.
To those of you that think breastfeeding past the age of two is bordering on sick,I hope you will read the info at the links others have posted. Also,the AAP *just* came out with new recommendations for breastfeeding within the past two weeks. Below is a quote from their new policy.
"# Increased duration of breastfeeding confers significant health and developmental benefits for the child and the mother, especially in delaying return of fertility (thereby promoting optimal intervals between births).196
# There is no upper limit to the duration of breastfeeding and no evidence of psychologic or developmental harm from breastfeeding into the third year of life or longer."
You can read the full text here:
I would HIGHLY recommend reading the text if you work with breastfeeding mothers. There are alot of changes from the last bf policy by the AAP,and there is some great info and studies cited within the policy that you might find helpful,as well.
From reading this thread,I've noticed that there seems to be some confusion over colostrum. I recommend the following links for this information:
Several things to keep in mind:
*What goes in must come out! (If it's coming out,it's going in. Watch baby's OUTPUT. Breasts don't have ounce markers ,so output is one of the best ways of telling whether or not baby is getting enough).
*If the output isn't there,work on latch on and positioning.
*If there appears to be a problem with milk transfer-get help! Don't wait.
*The #1 rule is: FEED THE BABY! If there appears to be a problem with latch/suck/supply/ect.,feed the baby. Whether it is ebm or abm,feed the baby!
Feb 19, '05You have your opinions on the subject that are not based on fact, which to me, speaks of a lack of education on the subject. I could have the opinion that the world was flat, but people would definitely call me ignorant if I were to assert that to them. There is an exceptional amount of proof that the earth is round. There is an exceptional amount of proof that breastfeeding, even past two and three years is normal and healthy for both mom baby.
And MaryMooMoo is correct, anyone who has been properly trained in lactation knows the the absolute number one priority is to feed the baby. It may be with ABM or EBM, bottles, cup, syringe or lactation aid, but the baby must eat and it's incredibly important to remember that. Even the most die-hard breastfeeder knows that.
The screaming isn't necessary, NoCrumping.
Feb 19, '05Regarding benefits to the mom with pregnancy and breastfeeding and decreased breast cancer risk . . .I guess I've got 36 months of protection from my 4 pregnancies and almost 10 years from breastfeeding. That looks pretty good to me.
NoCrumping - you are judging those of us who choose to breastfeed our children into toddlerhood as gross. How can we NOT respond to that?
I'm not gross. You also seem to not have up to date information on extended breastfeeding.
We also hope that when you encounter a mom who chooses to breastfeed longer than you did, you will not judge her gross.
That's all we are saying.
You can believe what you will. Just be careful not to judge others.
Feb 19, '05Ok, I'm going to throw in my 2 cents worth since the discussion really has turned from the original post.
Breast feeding is natural and wonderful, perfect nutrition for a baby. It's easy, convenient and cheap. And even in my fairly conservative, back-woods part of the country, I don't notice people having big hang-ups about a mother breast feeding her baby in public. There is a point-a developmental age, however, where breast feeding in public, and notice I'm saying in public, can certainly be considered odd.
I'll never forget eons ago when I was in college and a bunch of us had gone to the pizza parlor one afternoon. There was a woman there with her child, a boy about 4 years old, and several friends with their kids. The kids were eating pizza, drinking out of cups, running around the tables and acting like pre-schoolers act. In the midst of his circling this boy would stop by his mom, lift up her shirt, suck for about 30 seconds and was off again. He did this several times. At the time I was just dumbfounded because I'd never seen anything like this before. I'm thinking if a kid can chow down on pizza and koolaid, the breast feeding is happening for reasons other than nutrition. The fact it has stayed with me so clearly for over 25 years may be an indication that it is an event out of the ordinary for an ordinary person like me.
I guess my point is that bf is fine as long as it is the right thing for mom and baby. No one should be judged right or wrong because of their choice to start or stop breast feeding. It should not be a badge of honor to show off to every passer-by. If a woman is breast feeding her baby or toddler or pre-schooler, it should be a quiet, nurturing, pacifying, bonding private time between the 2 not an event to display to the rest of the world.
But I am rather old...
Feb 19, '05sparky . . . :chuckle
I can see why that would stay with you. I'm not advocating that. I've always been discreet and usually the 3 1/2 year old would nurse for comfort or when he first woke up or before bed. Like tonight - my son smashed his thumb in the hinge-side of the bathroom door and it hurt him so bad that I was wishing I was still breastfeeding.
I wouldn't let my son pull my shirt up in public and take a 30 second drink.
Feb 19, '05God, my children were always not allowed to do the "sip" thing because it drives me up a freakin' wall. Seriously. Nurse or not, but don't play around.
Though, clearly with nursing toddlers, it's not really all about nutrition, but I do have to say that you still don't know all the circumstances of why a mother and child might nurse even longer than what I would consider the norm. There are a variety of health reasons that might prompt a mother to nurse more frequently for a longer age range. Now, there are obviously exceptions and there are wacky nursing moms, but there are wacky formula feeding moms. I just like playing devil's advocate. I do know my 2 year old had some adjustment issues when I started back to school and asked to nurse every time she was around me and I was sitting because she missed me during the day (I had been a SAHM and now she had a SAHD) and she knew that if I was nursing her, I couldn't leave.
I don't judge all formula feeding moms by the ones who have a newborn propped with a bottle while they go shopping. (though I do have an intense urge to take the bottle out of the child's mouth so they don't choke.) I know there are a lot of moms who don't nurse for very good reasons, either psychological or physical and they treat their babies lovingly and didn't choose to bottlefeed because it's too inconvenient to have a child. I know that most moms aren't like that. And it wouldn't be fair for me to trot out the examples of horrendous parenting that a formula-feeding mom comes up with anyone in debates like that, because the majority of moms who formula feed, do so for very legitimate reasons or because of an inability to get good help (help is sometimes plentiful, but good help can be rare ) I don't think FF moms say "Well, I know that formula feeding is fourth choice in feeding options, but eh, I just don't want to be bothered." Of course that's not what happens.
Just like most breastfeeding women and advocates would never advocate starving a baby before using formula. They don't nurse their children until they're 8 or nurse their 4 year old exclusively or anything weird like that. We're just normal women who think that our society has weird hangups about breasts and feel there's no reason to choose an arbitrary cutoff for something that has immense health benefits to mom and babe.
And for those who are Christian (I am) Think about it. In Jesus' day, they were definitely nursed longer than they are here and now. Jesus was likely nursed until he was four or five. :chuckle
Feb 19, '05Lil Peanut what a great post!
And you are so right . .by trotting out the wackos on any subject you negate your argument. The rare cases don't make good examples.
I think you are right about Jesus.
I'm a wacko Christian too.
Feb 19, '05Quote from stevielynnI attended a CE class presented by Dr Hale a few years ago. The topic was Anti-depressants and the breastfeeding mother. He was wonderful! There was also a presnetation by Dee Kassing, IBCLC on using bottles to reinforce breastfeeding. Very interesting information. Glad to see that someone else uses Hale.There are a bunch of threads about extended breastfeeding and there are alot of us out there.
As LilPeanut said, I didn't breastfeed my kids like I breastfed them when they were infants and only relying on breastmilk. It became a first thing in the morning time for us, before naps or bedtime and yes, when they fell and got an owie or were just having a fatigue-related meltdown. It was comforting. Breastmilk also continues to have health benefits for my child and for me. As mentioned, a decrease in the risk of breast cancer.
My son doesn't play on a soccer team at 3 - I can't imagine him even doing anything that organized. He is bright, surprises people by how advanced his vocabulary is, rides his tricycle, takes walks with me, sings the ABC song, "reads" his books from memory (Green Eggs and Ham is one he has memorized), puts together track on his Thomas the Tank Engine track, puts puzzles together, just the typical pre-school stuff. I've coached soccer before with 8-10 year olds and they were NOT organized - basically played bunch ball. :roll
Fergus - Dr. Thomas Hale's book, Medications and Mother's Milk is very comprehensive. I had a mom who had already successfully breastfed 3 older children and then had a child 10 years later. She was on metformin and zoloft and her OB doc told her she could not breastfeed. She was at risk for depression and she called me and then her husband called me about their wish to breastfeed their child - she was very upset. I faxed Dr. Hale with the medications, her history and asked if she could breastfeed. He actually called me at work!! I was so surprised. He sent me two studies, one about metformin. He said she could successfully breastfeed without any problem. I had to go through her OB doc and let him have the info, diplomatically . . . .he agreed. I called her back and she was so happy.
This woman was already at risk for Post Partum Depression as she had a hx of psych problems and was diabetic. Not being able to breastfeed was pushing her into a depression. The best thing for her was to get accurate information. Alot of OB docs are not up to speed with this aspect of breastfeeding.
I use Dr. Hale's book and website often.
Feb 19, '05Quote from FutureNrseOK FutureNurse now that you have agreed with me I should tell you, I am one of those wierdos that bf's till my kids are 3:chuckle . I am sure that you keep your personal feelings to yourself when working with a mother so if it's not your cup of tea to bf for 3 years I have no problem with it.Thank you! I thought that I was the only one sitting here thinking " Why is this an issue? Take that baby away from them!"
Feb 19, '05Quote from NoCrumpingPlease NoCrumping take a deep breath I am currently nursing my 2 year old. It is not sexual abuse and it is certainly what she and I both want. I will NEVER critic your choice to formula feed (if you do so) so please do not come down so harshly on my choice. My choice may not be for you and that is fine, but please remember that telling me that nursing my daughter is gross is like telling me that hugging her is gross. Can't we all just get along?LIlpeanut: I AM NOT IGNORANT.I JUST HAVE MY OWN VIEW ON THE SUBJECT, OR IS THAT NOT ACCECPTABLE TO YOU, SINCE IT IS NOT THE SAME AS YOURS? 'IGNORANT' IMPLIES LACK OF KNOWLEDGE, THAT IS NOT THE CASE WITH ME. YOU MIGHT WANT TO USE THE TERM 'INTOLERANT'. (OF BREASTFEEDING A KID 3-5 YRS OLD)