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No. 40
from santhony44
Old Jul 16, 2006, 08:18 PM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Someone mentioned male doctors being "exempt" from the image of predator, and I assume from being unjustly accused; I don't see that at all. Most male physicians I know are very careful to have female chaperons, and/or have female providers perform pelvic or breast exams.

I am a female FNP and currently work with two male physicians. I do most, though not all, of the breast/pelvic exams. Usually this is per the patient's preference. I get the well-woman exams as well as most of the "female" problems.

There are a variety of reasons for this; some women do have issues of rape or sexual abuse, some women believe that another woman will do a gentler exam, some are modest, some are just plain uncomfortable with a man seeing that part of their bodies.

By the same token, I will offer a male patient the option to see the male provider for a genital or rectal exam.

We want the patients to be happy with their care, and at the same time prevent any accusations against the male providers.

I've been in health management in industry as well. We had a young male occupational health physician. When he saw female patients in our clinic, I made sure he was never for one second alone with a female employee; he had a female nurse, usually me, with him at all times. When I was in the room and he was examining a female employee, I positioned myself to see where his hands were at all times, particularly if he were examining places like the lower back. It wasn't that I mistrusted him; it was the employees I didn't necessarily trust. In fact, we had a couple complain about inappropriate remarks he had supposedly made- with me right there in the room!! That stopped when I started making noises to the union about considering those complaints to be defamation of my character. It was amazing how a perfectly innocent remark or question could be twisted!! I also had a male staff nurse there and tried to be super careful of him also, for the same reasons. When you've heard a female complain that "he told me I needed a man" but you were there to hear him ask her if she had a husband or someone at home who could give a good firm massage to her tight shoulder muscles (otherwise she'd need the company nurses to massage them just after work) then you don't have trouble understanding why a male nurse would be extra careful with "intimate" procedures on his female patients.

It's unfortunate, but I think the ligitiousness of our society, and the perception of males as predators, has gotten worse over my years in nursing, not better.
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No. 41
from jb2u
Old Jul 16, 2006, 08:19 PM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Originally Posted by runningfool
Many women - not just older women - don't want any man except the one they love and trust (their husband) to see them. As mentioned earlier, many women have religious beliefs about having a male doctor or nurse. And lets not forget that 1 in 4 women are victims of rape or molestation. Would you be the one to tell a rape victim who doesn't want you to touch her during a pelvic exam that she doesn't have a choice because you think it's discrimination? I'm a rape victim and if I was forced to have a man do my intimate exams there would be hell to pay. I'm sorry. I DON'T care about your feelings in this matter. I care about ME being comfortable in those already awkward and vulnerable exams.
for the record....i would NEVER force care on anyone (man or women)! i can understand certain situations, but as a rule to say "hey pts. pick which gender you want to care for you" is wrong and IS discrimination. let us not forget that males are also victims of rape/molestation and we should also be sensitive to their feelings also...right? we seem to have a habit of asking female pts if they mind having a male care provider, but we do not usually say to a male pt "MR. so and so you have a female care provider today, is that o.k. with you?"

also, there are women, who have male docs, but do not want a male nurse to care for them. they equate education with morality which are two completely different things. and i would also like to say that i am sorry you had to go through such a horrible experience in your life. i pray that you continue to heal internally.

sincerely,
jay
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No. 42
from jb2u
Old Jul 16, 2006, 08:39 PM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
let us not forget....the problem with sexual predators is not that they are MEN, it is that they are PREDATORS! as we have seen lately in the news...women ARE predators too!!! and i am sure MANY go WAY under reported! and as i said in another post...i have heard female nurses at my work talking very inappropriately about the size of a male pts member as well as here on this site!

yes, i do expect females to understand how it makes me feal to be treated like a deviant when i haven't done anything wrong. i want to give the best care possible because i LOVE taking care of others. it brings me much joy, but to be treated like a deviant without cause brings me sadness. please, understand that!

sincerely,
jay
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No. 43
Old Jul 16, 2006, 08:56 PM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Many of you are not responding to me, and I am curious why.


Why is it that female nurses generally can assess both MALE, and FEMALE, but males cannot generally assess female, and women are embarassed about their "private" areas, but most of you female nurses feel like men are not embarassed about theirs. Why is it everyone is concerned for a male nurse having a witness, while hardly anyone is concerned for a female nurse having a witness?

Myself, I would just care for the patient like I am male, and female. Why should what I have on the lower portion of my body decide whether I care for you, or not. I could myself have a female organ down there.(Don't worry I DON'T!) Perfectly male here. But why is it so consentual with males, but not with females.
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No. 44
from jb2u
Old Jul 16, 2006, 11:02 PM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Originally Posted by WannabeOrthoSurgeon
Many of you are not responding to me, and I am curious why.


Why is it that female nurses generally can assess both MALE, and FEMALE, but males cannot generally assess female, and women are embarassed about their "private" areas, but most of you female nurses feel like men are not embarassed about theirs. Why is it everyone is concerned for a male nurse having a witness, while hardly anyone is concerned for a female nurse having a witness?

Myself, I would just care for the patient like I am male, and female. Why should what I have on the lower portion of my body decide whether I care for you, or not. I could myself have a female organ down there.(Don't worry I DON'T!) Perfectly male here. But why is it so consentual with males, but not with females.
the answer is males are easy to discriminate against and there is a HUGE HUGE double standard!
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No. 45
from 58flyer
Old Jul 17, 2006, 01:19 AM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Originally Posted by jb2u
and as i said in another post...i have heard female nurses at my work talking very inappropriately about the size of a male pts member as well as here on this site!sincerely,jay
You got that right Jay! I have noticed that too on this site, unfortunately. Over the years I have heard LOTS of female nurses make inappropriate comments about their male patients. I have also known many male nurses and doctors and have never once heard any inappropriate comment about female patients come from them, not on this site either, unless I missed it.
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No. 46
from 58flyer
Old Jul 17, 2006, 01:40 AM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Originally Posted by runningfool
Many women - not just older women - don't want any man except the one they love and trust (their husband) to see them. As mentioned earlier, many women have religious beliefs about having a male doctor or nurse. And lets not forget that 1 in 4 women are victims of rape or molestation. Would you be the one to tell a rape victim who doesn't want you to touch her during a pelvic exam that she doesn't have a choice because you think it's discrimination? I'm a rape victim and if I was forced to have a man do my intimate exams there would be hell to pay. I'm sorry. I DON'T care about your feelings in this matter. I care about ME being comfortable in those already awkward and vulnerable exams.
Men can also be rape/molestation victims as well. Sometimes the perpetrators are female. Hopefully you can understand why these men would be uncomfortable with intimate care by female medical personnel. There is a lot of unreported sexually inappropriate behavior commited by female providers against male patients. I have been on the receiving end of that myself. I have also been the victim of an egregious act of sexual abuse by a female nurse as a vulnerable young male patient. My knowledge of this is first hand. I agree that patients should have the choice in the sex of their provider when it comes to intimate care, without offense being taken. I don't think it's the least bit discriminatory.
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No. 47
Old Jul 17, 2006, 01:42 AM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Just recently....a male coworker was assigned a pt. The lady more or less told him to get lost. She was not comfortable with it. I admitted the pt. Not long later,,,,I got my own admit with zip for help
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No. 48
Old Jul 17, 2006, 02:37 AM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
Originally Posted by Lesli61
My two sons and husband (as described in my previous post) are kind of 'wigged out' by the thought of being touched by a homosexual. I do not understand this AT ALL. I just don't get it!! If I were a patient, I wouldn't care less what the nurse's sexual orientation is!
We are all so PC that our brains are falling out (not meaning to be insulting). Let's be real about men (I've been one for 39 years). Men are predatory and voyeuristic by nature. That's why they go hunting and "read" girlie magazines. Men get sexually aroused by sight and there have be 12 gazillion playboy magazines sold (to men) to prove it. Men take advantage of the physically weaker and there have been 12 gazillion rapes and armed robberies (by men) to prove it.

Men understand that other men (gay or straight) have an aggressive sexual nature. The average male nurse might have his sexual nature under control, but it's still fundamentally different than the average female nurse's sexual nature and therefore her internal experience and external vibe is different when she encounters the nude privates of the opposite sex.

Might I suggest that your lack of understanding about the men in your life's "wigging out" over the idea of having there genitals handled by a male has to do with your lack of understanding about male sexuality. Women get sexually aroused by people. Men get sexually aroused by bodies and body parts. Ever heard of a "boob-man" or a "leg-man"? Imagine. A man can be defined (and indeed define themselves) by which female body part sexually arouses them. Stereotypes tend to have a basis in reality.
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No. 49
from NeuroMedic
Old Jul 17, 2006, 02:51 AM

Default Re: Male Nurses/female Patients
At the hospital I do work with; ALL pelvic exams require an RN to be present.
It is just common sense to ask a female to do an exam on a female and a male to an exam on a male; however given certain circumstances(Packed ER's, Pt Drama, Code Heart, etc) this is not possible. All that matters is that you had
enough respect for your pt and their privacy to go out of your way to find another provider of the same sex to make it more comfortable for them.

In those situations where the pt claims they will make false accusations
of rape and molestation against a provider of the opposite sex; Don't even reply. Make sure the patient is safe, IMMEDIATELY leave the room, Report to your supervisor with COMPLETE details about what was said using the pt
EXACT words.

In today's world--lawsuits are worn by everyone..
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