EMT Starting RN program anyone else go down this road? - page 3

I started an EMT course 2 years ago and my original goal was to become a firefighter, but the longer I worked as an EMT the more I realized that RN would be a better fit for me. I'm currently 21 and... Read More

  1. Visit  elijahvirgo profile page
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    Emt /paramedic currently finished my first semester of nursing school. Real life experience bones me and like you've probably already read, its a whole separate frame of mind and approach to medicine and patients. You're gonna be focusing more on a patients chief complaint and not so much on their conditions or symptoms. Its challenging but not at all impossible. Good luck
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  3. Visit  sheepeggsandham profile page
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    I've been an EMT for 13 years and had my ff 1&2 cert for 10. Just finished my pre req's and took my entrance exam for An Adn program. Hoping to get my acceptance email this afternoon!! I've been told my prehospital experience will help with getting a job just hoping it doesn't get me singled out too much in class. Some of my instructors that new my background singled me out some in my pre req classes but all of the experiences with that have been good so far. I think the experience and networking from years of EMS will be a very good thing to bring with you in a nursing career.
  4. Visit  elijahvirgo profile page
    0
    Quote from sheepeggsandham
    I've been an EMT for 13 years and had my ff 1&2 cert for 10. Just finished my pre req's and took my entrance exam for An Adn program. Hoping to get my acceptance email this afternoon!! I've been told my prehospital experience will help with getting a job just hoping it doesn't get me singled out too much in class. Some of my instructors that new my background singled me out some in my pre req classes but all of the experiences with that have been good so far. I think the experience and networking from years of EMS will be a very good thing to bring with you in a nursing career.
    Never volunteer that information lol. Telling instructors I was a medic was a bad idea lol I get asked every question and held to a higher standard. Its not that I'm not up to the challenge but I'm just a medic..if I knew all the answers and how to be a nurse already I wouldn't be in school get off my back xD
  5. Visit  TraumaSurfer profile page
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    Quote from EMTJeremy
    I was an EMT/ ER Tech. Best 2 years of experience I could ask for. I got so much experience in the ED, I'm way ahead others in school, and the teachers and classmates notice. Sure, I get made fun of for my constant "this one time in the ER..." stories, but its all in good fun. I agree with the others- EMS is definitely different, but the skills you learn are often an asset, no matter where you work. No offense to RNs out there, but have you ever seen a nurse try to backboard someone? Its just a different specialty with a different skill set.
    I guess this post illustrates all of what not to do if you want to be an RN. EMT and Paramedic are both "tech" jobs. Both are very easy certs to get and you will be surprised by how many people, both health care and non health care, have these certs. Some even took an EMT class in high school at 16 years old. EMS has not advanced much in 50 years except to add a few new toys but without much education to go with it. Boy Scouts also get similar if not more first aid training than most EMTs. Sometimes your stories from an EMT-BASIC viewpoint might seem funny especially to those who have taken all the prerequisites and have expanded their knowledge. Some RNs who had been EMTs or Paramedics are even embarrassed later when they have more education and training by their attitudes when they worked the ambulances or they see the cocky attitudes of EMTs doing the us vs them crap in the ED.

    We could use the backboard as an example. This is something not used in the hospital for the same reasons EMS is getting away from it. The difference is the hospitals knew this long, long time ago. No need to teach "backboarding" when hospitals have many other spinal immobilization techniques and devices which EMTs have never heard of. The reason some patients still stay on the backboards in the hospital ED now is because of EMTs and Paramedics getting their knickers in a knot every time a doctor would ask do a quick assessment of the patient and yank the backboard out from under the patient. Believe it or not but that assessment is similar to the one now some Paramedics are doing to prevent putting the patient on a backboard. But, even today you get EMTs and Paramedics screaming foul when their patient is removed from a backboard upon arrival at the ED. It got so bad a few years ago when EMTs and Paramedics went to their Medical Directors and even the media to cry about all their hard work of backboarding and their assessment (per protocol to backboard everyone) was "ignored" by hospitals that some hospitals just now keep the patients backboards to avoid more outrage and threats of telling the patients/families to sue from the EMTs and Paramedics.

    So you see, what you do in EMS may not be appropriate for the long term and is sometimes just outdated. All those new gadgets like CPAP, may have been used for over 70 years in a hospital. You also learn you DO NOT talk about patients you have seen to others. At some point you cross the line of patient privacy and your teachers will try to change this or just weed you out because patients' need to feel they can have their privacy without fear someone is going to blab it around town.

    I also find this thread to be funny since it is in the "men in nursing" section like it is assuming all EMTs are male and all nurses are female. This is something else to get over.

    It is good to have some fond memories of your first entry level job but when it is time you move on, don't continue to live in the past. Learn to learn. Be more receptive of new things.
  6. Visit  big al lpn profile page
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    In hindsight I have nothing positve or constructive to say to the previous post. I hav redacted my response and welcome the mods to remove this post.
    Last edit by big al lpn on Dec 21, '13 : Reason: Cooler heads prevailed.
  7. Visit  203bravo profile page
    0
    Quote from TraumaSurfer
    I guess this post illustrates all of what not to do if you want to be an RN. EMT and Paramedic are both "tech" jobs. Both are very easy certs to get and you will be surprised by how many people, both health care and non health care, have these certs. Some even took an EMT class in high school at 16 years old. EMS has not advanced much in 50 years except to add a few new toys but without much education to go with it. Boy Scouts also get similar if not more first aid training than most EMTs. Sometimes your stories from an EMT-BASIC viewpoint might seem funny especially to those who have taken all the prerequisites and have expanded their knowledge. Some RNs who had been EMTs or Paramedics are even embarrassed later when they have more education and training by their attitudes when they worked the ambulances or they see the cocky attitudes of EMTs doing the us vs them crap in the ED.

    We could use the backboard as an example. This is something not used in the hospital for the same reasons EMS is getting away from it. The difference is the hospitals knew this long, long time ago. No need to teach "backboarding" when hospitals have many other spinal immobilization techniques and devices which EMTs have never heard of. The reason some patients still stay on the backboards in the hospital ED now is because of EMTs and Paramedics getting their knickers in a knot every time a doctor would ask do a quick assessment of the patient and yank the backboard out from under the patient. Believe it or not but that assessment is similar to the one now some Paramedics are doing to prevent putting the patient on a backboard. But, even today you get EMTs and Paramedics screaming foul when their patient is removed from a backboard upon arrival at the ED. It got so bad a few years ago when EMTs and Paramedics went to their Medical Directors and even the media to cry about all their hard work of backboarding and their assessment (per protocol to backboard everyone) was "ignored" by hospitals that some hospitals just now keep the patients backboards to avoid more outrage and threats of telling the patients/families to sue from the EMTs and Paramedics.

    So you see, what you do in EMS may not be appropriate for the long term and is sometimes just outdated. All those new gadgets like CPAP, may have been used for over 70 years in a hospital. You also learn you DO NOT talk about patients you have seen to others. At some point you cross the line of patient privacy and your teachers will try to change this or just weed you out because patients' need to feel they can have their privacy without fear someone is going to blab it around town.

    I also find this thread to be funny since it is in the "men in nursing" section like it is assuming all EMTs are male and all nurses are female. This is something else to get over.

    It is good to have some fond memories of your first entry level job but when it is time you move on, don't continue to live in the past. Learn to learn. Be more receptive of new things.
    Surprising that this poster attempts to sound so well educated about the job that pre hospital providers do yet has none of the facts correct.

    I will concede that the EMT-Basic certification is rather a simple class to complete and exam to pass BUT the Paramedic level is not nearly as easy -- and I've known many RN's that couldn't successfully challenge the exam when they wanted to work for an Air Ambulance service that required it.

    As far as back-boarding - I agree that many services board WAY too many patients for no good reason and the clear standard of practice is to clear the spine the field. But to say that EDs don't use boards is incorrect. While it is true that many facilities have spinal immobilization equipment that is not used it the field, this equipment is specialized for use in the facility and is not appropriate for immobilization during a road transport. So when these EDs have to transfer these patients by ambulance to another facility for any reason guess what they immediately use -- YEP a long spine board.

    And while many smaller services are slow to adopt new devices and technology - usually because of the price involved with the implementation of such devices - there are even more services out here that have very aggressive protocols that not only include the CPAP that as been identified but for years RSI, chest decompression, and the use of ventilators just to name a couple.

    So in short - just be a little more respectful of everyone on the health care team -- yes even the EMTs and Paramedics.
  8. Visit  TraumaSurfer profile page
    0
    Quote from 203bravo
    Surprising that this poster attempts to sound so well educated about the job that pre hospital providers do yet has none of the facts correct.

    I will concede that the EMT-Basic certification is rather a simple class to complete and exam to pass BUT the Paramedic level is not nearly as easy -- and I've known many RN's that couldn't successfully challenge the exam when they wanted to work for an Air Ambulance service that required it.

    As far as back-boarding - I agree that many services board WAY too many patients for no good reason and the clear standard of practice is to clear the spine the field. But to say that EDs don't use boards is incorrect. While it is true that many facilities have spinal immobilization equipment that is not used it the field, this equipment is specialized for use in the facility and is not appropriate for immobilization during a road transport. So when these EDs have to transfer these patients by ambulance to another facility for any reason guess what they immediately use -- YEP a long spine board.

    And while many smaller services are slow to adopt new devices and technology - usually because of the price involved with the implementation of such devices - there are even more services out here that have very aggressive protocols that not only include the CPAP that as been identified but for years RSI, chest decompression, and the use of ventilators just to name a couple.

    So in short - just be a little more respectful of everyone on the health care team -- yes even the EMTs and Paramedics.
    First, the Paramedic is not that difficult. Some states like TX only require 600 hours of training and can be completed in 3 -4 months. It is also easy enough for some Fire Departments to require all of their firefighters to obtain even if they have no interest in health care. Firefighters have very little problem maintaining both certs and often view the Paramedic as an add on to get a few $$$ more in their paycheck.

    Sure I am not surprised there are some RNs who fail the Paramedic exam. Some go in cold without any prep and some over think the questions by applying the experience and knowledge they have obtained from working in critical care.

    A back board is not going to replace a halo or Crutchfield tongs or internal fixation. If a LSB is used it is merely for the convenience of the EMTs to move the patient. The LSB is also what an EMT is familiar with so that is what will be used. It is just like when a Paramedic can not take certain medication on an IFT transport. Those meds may have to be discontinued and a bolus of some other med given which will hopefully last for the entire transport. The same for ventilators. These devices are not in the scope of practice for routine use by a Paramedic in every state. If they are it is usually just a simple demand valve with a rate knob. The Paramedic may have to bag the patient from one facility to another which definitely is not the best idea but some have no alternative if an RN can not accompany the EMS team.

    RSI is also not in the scope of practice for Paramedics in several states. Even the states which have RSI in their scope of practice, the medical director may not allow the Paramedics to do it.

    The price is not so much the concern as is the education. Medical Directors often much write protocols for the lowest common denominator in their organization which will be those who did just the minimum to get their Paramedic cert.
    Last edit by TraumaSurfer on Dec 21, '13
  9. Visit  big al lpn profile page
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    Referring to the original post. I think a lot of us started out with an EMT background an some of us felt we were well served by it. While some will look at EMS and EMTs of all levels as less than, I tend to look at them as equivalents on opposite sides of the wall. Floor nurses of any level of education shouldn't try and work an MVA or similar call, and EMTs of any level shouldn't try and work a floor. I don't care for the rhetoric in this thread, it's very condescending and lacks respect. I don't appreciate being talked down to or told my education or experience is subpar. I benefitted a lot from my EMS background, I'm proud of that certification. It wasn't just the education It was the experience and people I worked who taught me a lot as well. It launched me into my present career with confidence and knowledge. I wish OP well in furthering his education where ever it takes him. I think this thread is an excellent example of how some nurses like to tear others down and ride a high horse, and I hope OP observes what I believe is the best way to deal with that. I'm not going to change traumasurfers opinion on EMS, or anything else. I can only state my opinion and do what is best for me in my situation.
  10. Visit  TraumaSurfer profile page
    0
    Quote from big al lpn
    . I wish OP well in furthering his education where ever it takes him. I think this thread is an excellent example of how some nurses like to tear others down and ride a high horse, .
    Some nurses? This is more about EMTs and why EMTs feel they must be singled out. Look at some of the EMS forum on any given day and you will find several pages of conversations which are all about "stupid nurses". I guess you have been fortunate enough to have partners on an ambulance who didn't insist on ranting on and on about stupid nurses after every call. You don't see discussions just dedicated for the bashing of EMTs and Paramedics on this forum. Maybe as an LPN you join in with stupid nurse stories because you are also an EMT but put on blinders to all the things EMTs have done which could be seen as stupid. Fortunately most of these EMTs will never go to nursing school. But, the moment someone does move on to another health care profession and see is a lot more to medicine, you feel betrayed and start with the high horse comments. Some of the EMTs and Paramedics who have moved on have seen the same mistakes other EMTs will make when they try to go on into another field. They may have learned it themselves. Some had a difficult time getting the chip off their shoulder to listen that there might be another way to do things besides just the EMS way.

    The point is, don't dwell on the past and insist on telling everyone your experiences to put yourself in the spotlight. Others have probably had some great experiences also but are there to learn how to be a success nurse. I know you might have seen in EMT school or the refresher class where the instructor spends the whole time talking about his or her experiences in the pretense of teaching but most just come out with some cool stories and not really much more than that. This is a new chapter in your life. Keep the old book for the memories and maybe some of the experiences but don't continue to use it as "the" protocols of how things should be done now.

    Men have been around now as RNs for a long time. Even in EMS women now make up almost half of the EMTs. There are also many who hold an EMT cert working in other professions waiting for the 1x a year opening for applications with the Fire Department. The same for Paramedics. This is almost 2014 and the usual men vs women stuff seen in the 70s and before are gone for the most part.

    Remember that in health care patient privacy is taken very seriously. You don't talk about every patient you have had to everyone unless you know the guidelines for it to be a true teaching situations. Some EMTs and Paramedics do get carried away and give out too much information about their patients. This is not viewed as respectful to the patient or their families in health care.

    So, keep the chip off the shoulder, stop listening to all your EMS friends who tell you that nurses are the enemy, shut your mouth about your ambulance stories during class time and be prepared to listen and learn something new. If you really feel you are so different than everyone else in nursing, don't be a nurse. It isn't for everyone. If you are successful at completing nursing school to get the RN title, expect your relationship with some EMTs and Paramedics you have known to change. Some just can not handle change or when someone else makes changes to their life.
  11. Visit  big al lpn profile page
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    I have never used the phrase "stupid nurse" quit putting words in my mouth and telling me how I feel. But thank you again for writing another diatribe about how useless EMS is, and again bringing gender up even though I can't see how it's an issue. Again mentioning the awful stories EMTs tell even though no one in this thread reports disclosing PHI. Don't have a chip in your shoulder is good advice, you should take it as well. I have looked through your other posts and I know you won't stop until you get the last word or another better argument draws your attention. So I have said my peace. You enjoy your next post and last word. All I ask is that it not use the phrase you referring to me, because only I speak for me.
  12. Visit  TraumaSurfer profile page
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    Let's take this line for line to clarify.

    Quote from big al lpn
    I have never used the phrase "stupid nurse" quit putting words in my mouth and telling me how I feel.
    I never said that is what you stated. I highlighted what you said but thank you for the nice illustration of the double standard. It is okay if EMTs and Paramedics publicly tear down nurses.

    some nurses like to tear others down and ride a high horse, .


    Quote from big al lpn
    But thank you again for writing another diatribe about how useless EMS is,
    Now those are your words. Did you interpret that from the part about some of us who have moved on? If we want to advance our education and take another title, we should not be criticized for it.


    Quote from big al lpn
    and again bringing gender up even though I can't see how it's an issue. .
    Didn't you notice this is under the MEN IN NURSING section? Men...gender...


    Quote from big al lpn
    Again mentioning the awful stories EMTs tell even though no one in this thread reports disclosing PHI. .
    PHI? Do you think the only think covered in patient privacy is an insurance and billing address? No, it is not okay to talk about your patients on social media and very public forums. Some even go as far as posting photos or they post a news article with "that's me last shift" and start the discussion with all the gory details.

    Quote from big al lpn
    Don't have a chip in your shoulder is good advice, you should take it as well. .
    Many of us offering advice here are much older with much more experience. We've been there and done that. When you are young you might not think about the future and the consequences of your actions. If someone is planning a career move, they can expect some changes in their life both good and bad. It might be hard for some to believe that everything they learned in EMT school was not all you needed to know.


    Quote from big al lpn
    I have looked through your other posts and I know you won't stop until you get the last word or another better argument draws your attention. So I have said my peace. You enjoy your next post and last word. All I ask is that it not use the phrase you referring to me, because only I speak for me.
    I hate being misquoted. I also dislike those with an EMT or Paramedic title who will turn around any little word to prove they are right for their own "EMT vs nurse" agenda. Some just can not see the other side of the discussion even from those who may know both sides.

    The OP will have to look at the reasons why he or she is wanting to be an RN. It is a personal decision. If they can not get past dwelling on being an EMT and wanting to go only by what they have learned there, then they will have a difficult time. They may also lose friendships and acquaintances from their EMS days because of arguments such as what we are having now where it will be nurse vs EMT even if the nurse holds both titles. If they are motivated to go through the BSN for the right reasons, they will do find regardless of their gender.
  13. Visit  elijahvirgo profile page
    0
    Am i reading what im actually reading ??
    Last edit by elijahvirgo on Dec 22, '13
  14. Visit  burnrn85 profile page
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    Quote from jonnyvirgo
    A i readoing what im actually reading ??

    Unbelievable huh?


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