DO LVNs GET RESPECT? - page 3

]Hello, I'll be attending nursing school this year, and I was curious if LVNs get the respect they deserve or are they looked down upon in the eyes of RNs? Just thought I'd ask...... Read More

  1. by   pagandeva2000
    Quote from RN34TX
    I understand what you mean.
    When I was studying for the NCLEX-RN, I kept getting the delegation questions wrong in the beginning when the questions were about appropriate assignments for LPN/LVN's.
    And I had been an LVN for 7 years at that time!
    I couldn't figure out why I kept getting them wrong.

    It seemed as if the patient in question had anything so much as a simple saline lock in their left arm that they were supposed to be assigned to an RN and not an LPN/LVN.

    Once I shifted gears and basically assumed that LPN/LVN's on board exam questions were little more than nursing assistants who could give Tylenol and insert foleys, I started answering the delegation questions "correctly".
    I think that the reason this is done is to prepare the RN to do NCLEX-RN. I do believe, though that schools should further explain the scope of practice to each nursing discipline because I was under the impression in LPN school that we were not allowed to do certain things, come to find out that we can at the workplace. Same thing with nursing assistants. The scope of practice for nursing assistants is broader now, but not according to NCLEX-PN/RN. I can see how you may have had trouble in the beginning of your studies, until you had to place a different assumption in your head in order to pass the exam.

    I had a question during my studies asking something about a nursing assistant doing a fingerstick. I used to do them as an aide so I assumed that it was correct, but I got it wrong, because according to the world of NCLEX-PN, that is the job of a licensed person.
    Last edit by pagandeva2000 on Feb 19, '07
  2. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from pagandeva2000
    I think that the reason this is done is to prepare the RN to do NCLEX-RN. I do believe, though that schools should further explain the scope of practice to each nursing discipline because I was under the impression in LPN school that we were not allowed to do certain things, come to find out that we can at the workplace. Same thing with nursing assistants. The scope of practice for nursing assistants is broader now, but not according to NCLEX-PN/RN. I can see how you may have had trouble in the beginning of your studies, until you had to place a different assumption in your head in order to pass the exam.

    I had a question during my studies asking something about a nursing assistant doing a fingerstick. I used to do them as an aide so I assumed that it was correct, but I got it wrong, because according to the world of NCLEX-PN, that is the job of a licensed person.
    Where I work, fingersticks ARE the job of a licensed person. CNA's cannot do them. Or foleys. Or wound care.

    steph
  3. by   postmortem_cowboy
    Quote from stevielynn
    I agree with this.

    NG tubes take practice as do starting IV's. No one magically appears with these skills w/o practice and nursing school just doesn't do it.

    And I don't agree with making blanket statements like "you have to be a CNA or LVN prior to be an RN in order to be a good nurse".

    steph
    And I totally agree with that. Some LVN students I was in nursing school with that were CNA's were awesome, and some were lazy, some that had no experience whatsoever were better nurses than those of use that had some experience. And then there were those students who stuck out like a sore thumb, didn't give a rats behind about the patients, they just wanted the license to make good money, and that was ever so evident.

    And yes, nursing school only provides the foundations, the how to, not the "how best to." So I totally agree on that wholeheatedly. When I started, I couldn't start an IV for nothin'. Now with having to drop 20-30 lines a day in a busy ER, it's just second nature. Alot of the times too, new nurses don't ask their peers for help or suggestions. Personally, i'm inquisitive, I've learned more from my RN's on the job that make what I do alot easier, than I did in school. It got to the point where I had other nurses asking me to start their IV's and drop in their NG tubes, cause I learned things here and there and got pretty good at it.

    Respect is a two way street if you expect it, walk the walk. I've seen alot of LVN's that make me want to vomit in my short career, lazy, put off their patient load on anyone they can, wander the hospital and can't be found, go and hide somewhere and only come out on the floor when they absolutely have to. It's ridiculous, and no RN should have to kiss butt on anyone just to get them to do their job. But unfortunately there are those types of people out there that give all the good LVN's who are smart, know their stuff and that do their job and are willing to help anyone out that asks and sometimes volunteer help when not asked a bad name. But then again there's always those RN's that have that "view" of what we do, and look at us like a CNA, and nothing changes their perception of us at all. I've seen both sides of it. Personally I don't take anyone who looks at what my name badge states as far as my licensing is concerned all too seriously. And I really don't take too seriously them giving no weight to the type of nurse I am either simply because I am an "LVN." There are things i'm licensed to do, and there are things i'm not licensed to do. Just because i'm not licensed to do this or that, doesn't make me any less of a nurse, and surely doesn't make me a bad nurse either, it just makes me/us not an RN.


    Wayne.
  4. by   pagandeva2000
    I think that the whole thing with this is that many LPNs (myself included) have been taught all of these skills, told that we are nurses, and yet, walk into the field and are not acknowledged that we, too are nurses. We are not always compensated by pay or able to practice all that we were taught to do. And, there is a fine line between "assessment" and "data gathering". It is hard to tell the difference. We see the word "assessment" in our textbooks, but are told that we can't do them, taught about care plans and yet, it is either that we can't do them or that they have to be co-signed...it does cause confusion.
  5. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from postmortem_cowboy
    And I totally agree with that. Some LVN students I was in nursing school with that were CNA's were awesome, and some were lazy, some that had no experience whatsoever were better nurses than those of use that had some experience. And then there were those students who stuck out like a sore thumb, didn't give a rats behind about the patients, they just wanted the license to make good money, and that was ever so evident.

    And yes, nursing school only provides the foundations, the how to, not the "how best to." So I totally agree on that wholeheatedly. When I started, I couldn't start an IV for nothin'. Now with having to drop 20-30 lines a day in a busy ER, it's just second nature. Alot of the times too, new nurses don't ask their peers for help or suggestions. Personally, i'm inquisitive, I've learned more from my RN's on the job that make what I do alot easier, than I did in school. It got to the point where I had other nurses asking me to start their IV's and drop in their NG tubes, cause I learned things here and there and got pretty good at it.

    Respect is a two way street if you expect it, walk the walk. I've seen alot of LVN's that make me want to vomit in my short career, lazy, put off their patient load on anyone they can, wander the hospital and can't be found, go and hide somewhere and only come out on the floor when they absolutely have to. It's ridiculous, and no RN should have to kiss butt on anyone just to get them to do their job. But unfortunately there are those types of people out there that give all the good LVN's who are smart, know their stuff and that do their job and are willing to help anyone out that asks and sometimes volunteer help when not asked a bad name. But then again there's always those RN's that have that "view" of what we do, and look at us like a CNA, and nothing changes their perception of us at all. I've seen both sides of it. Personally I don't take anyone who looks at what my name badge states as far as my licensing is concerned all too seriously. And I really don't take too seriously them giving no weight to the type of nurse I am either simply because I am an "LVN." There are things i'm licensed to do, and there are things i'm not licensed to do. Just because i'm not licensed to do this or that, doesn't make me any less of a nurse, and surely doesn't make me a bad nurse either, it just makes me/us not an RN.


    Wayne.
    Hi Wayne - wanna come work at my hospital?

    steph
  6. by   pagandeva2000
    Wayne, I like how you worded this. We ARE nurses, with a more limited scope of practice than RNs.


    Quote from postmortem_cowboy
    And I totally agree with that. Some LVN students I was in nursing school with that were CNA's were awesome, and some were lazy, some that had no experience whatsoever were better nurses than those of use that had some experience. And then there were those students who stuck out like a sore thumb, didn't give a rats behind about the patients, they just wanted the license to make good money, and that was ever so evident.

    And yes, nursing school only provides the foundations, the how to, not the "how best to." So I totally agree on that wholeheatedly. When I started, I couldn't start an IV for nothin'. Now with having to drop 20-30 lines a day in a busy ER, it's just second nature. Alot of the times too, new nurses don't ask their peers for help or suggestions. Personally, i'm inquisitive, I've learned more from my RN's on the job that make what I do alot easier, than I did in school. It got to the point where I had other nurses asking me to start their IV's and drop in their NG tubes, cause I learned things here and there and got pretty good at it.

    Respect is a two way street if you expect it, walk the walk. I've seen alot of LVN's that make me want to vomit in my short career, lazy, put off their patient load on anyone they can, wander the hospital and can't be found, go and hide somewhere and only come out on the floor when they absolutely have to. It's ridiculous, and no RN should have to kiss butt on anyone just to get them to do their job. But unfortunately there are those types of people out there that give all the good LVN's who are smart, know their stuff and that do their job and are willing to help anyone out that asks and sometimes volunteer help when not asked a bad name. But then again there's always those RN's that have that "view" of what we do, and look at us like a CNA, and nothing changes their perception of us at all. I've seen both sides of it. Personally I don't take anyone who looks at what my name badge states as far as my licensing is concerned all too seriously. And I really don't take too seriously them giving no weight to the type of nurse I am either simply because I am an "LVN." There are things i'm licensed to do, and there are things i'm not licensed to do. Just because i'm not licensed to do this or that, doesn't make me any less of a nurse, and surely doesn't make me a bad nurse either, it just makes me/us not an RN.


    Wayne.
  7. by   postmortem_cowboy
    HAHA... your all the way up north from me... lol... if you were down south i'd say where do I put the application in at... lol...


    Wayne.
  8. by   postmortem_cowboy
    Quote from pagandeva2000
    Wayne, I like how you worded this. We ARE nurses, with a more limited scope of practice than RNs.

    Yes I do agree! Personally, I tend to see the humor in things. It's my opinion that an RN that doesn't like LVN's, is afraid. Either they're afraid we're better at what we can do than they are at what we can't do. Or, they see us as a threat. I've also seen alot of RN's that value the good LVN's and could care less what cliff the lazy one's take a flying leap off of.

    Don't misunderstand me, I don't dislike RN's, I dislike hateful people that base their opinions off of false information and silly misconceptions of others. If they do that with their co-workers, it makes me wonder what type of nurse they truely are.

    To me, I could really care less if this LVN likes me or that RN likes me or not. I'm not on a shift for a popularity contest. I know i'm a good nurse. May not be able to push this med or hang this piggyback, but nonetheless, still a good nurse just like the rest of you here.


    Wayne.
  9. by   MelodyRNurse
    I just got my LPN last month, people such as friends and family will ask me how schools going and I tell them Ive finished the LPN, they often respond with "So how long wil it take you to be a nurse?"


  10. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from postmortem_cowboy
    HAHA... your all the way up north from me... lol... if you were down south i'd say where do I put the application in at... lol...


    Wayne.

    Oh well, our loss.

    steph
  11. by   pagandeva2000
    Quote from crazystudent
    I just got my LPN last month, people such as friends and family will ask me how schools going and I tell them Ive finished the LPN, they often respond with "So how long wil it take you to be a nurse?"


    Isn't it utterly amazing how a person with any higher level of education can come to that conclusion?? I make it my business to bring that out every now and then. I told an arrogant person once that they need to behave according to the amount of years spent in school rather than their shoe size. It didn't elicit positive feelings between me and that idiot, but it sure felt good...
  12. by   postmortem_cowboy
    ^5 to pagan!!!! It's like when you tell someone who has no clue what an LVN is, they ask... "so are you a nurse?" then you have to go through and explain what the difference is between 'em. Being a guy I get the whole "doctor" thing all the time, and I have to keep correcting the patients over and over... it's like ok people just cuz i'm a guy doesn't mean i'm a doctor.


    Wayne.
  13. by   TheCommuter
    Below is a very recent post from a popular member of these forums who regularly bashes LPNs/LVNs, ADNs, and diploma RNs.

    Quote from lindarn
    I have said it before and I will say it again. Nurses are shooting themselves in the foot by refusing/fighting increasing the educational leval for entry into practice. We are lumped in with minimally trained individuals, because THE PUBLIC CANNOT SEE WHAT ARE EDUCATION CONSISTED OF, AND THE RESPONSIBILITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY THAT WE HAVE. The public looks at how long we are in school, and they see LPN/LVNs coming out of school after just one year of post HS education, and most RNs coming out of school after a two year ADN. While I know that most ADNs end up in school longer than that with pre-requisites, what matters at the end of the day is the Associates Degree, which is only considered a two year degree, regardless of how long it took you to accomplish it. THAT IS WHAT THE PUBLIC SEES, AND WHAT HOSPITALS THROW AT US (what do you girls expect? You only went to school for two years?)!!

    When hospitals look to cut $$$, we look like an easy mark and career to de-skill. What is the difference between a nurses aide with six weeks of OJT, and an LPN/LVN with just a few months more. The public doesn't know or care what kind of classes you took, they look at the finished product.
    Same with ADNs. Most careers that are community college based, are blue collar non professional careers.

    We will always be a a line- item on the balance sheet, because we don't bill for or services like other departments. We will alway be thrown in with the room rate, housekeeping, and the complimentary roll of toilet paper.

    Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
    Spokane, Washington

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