treatment of students-venting - page 2

How are you treated at clinicals by staff? I find the nurses treat us well while the unit clerks and some of the unlicensed assistive personal treat us like crap. What's up with that? Are they... Read More

  1. by   WDWpixieRN
    Quote from EmerNurse
    Oh and don't let frazzled nurses get you down. Sometimes we really don't have time to stop and explain things, we are just trying to get through the shift. And you'll be welcomed with open arms, I promise, when you pass that old NCLEX! Good luck in school!
    Thanks for the encouragement, but it would be nice to be welcomed a bit NOW!! Any help at this point is SO appreciated by us lowly Student Nurses!!
  2. by   nursejllrn
    Thanks for all the great responses. I have calmed down now and realize that some people are just rude and mean and it has little to do with their job title or salary. I just take solace in the fact that what goes around comes around. Just FYI that rude unit clerk got chewed out by a doctor today for not putting in an order he wrote yesterday, and it was right in front of ME! Like I said, what goes around comes around.
  3. by   JentheRN05
    This reminds me of a core instructor I had while I was in nursing school. Going to a catholic school - core generally stood for religious classes or gen ed classes. Anyway - one of the gen ed teachers would have to drive 40 minutes to come teach a bunch of us nursing students (which her actual classroom is at another locations) 1 time a week. Now mind you, there would be traditional, non-nursing students in the class as well, but just a handful.
    Over 3 weeks, she constantly belittled us nursing students. Or grouped us all under an umbrella for someone elses oops.
    One day, I was fed up. After yet another relentless b!tching session about 'you nursing students'. I finally raised my voice as said as calmly as I could, yet as loudly as I could calmly say it. "Someday - mark my words- someday - you WILL lie in a hospital bed, and that someday I just might be your nurse - so you should keep that in mind when you complain about us nurses, because what comes around goes around'
    Needless to say, that actually shut her up and got me a round of applause from all the nursing students, and even some of the traditional students. So - there are ways to make a point.
  4. by   Imafloat
    Luckily, we have never been treated like that by staff. What kind of history does your school have with the facility? That might be part of it. I am in my practicum right now and even though I am a student, I kind of see it from the staffs point of view. There is one school with a bit*hy instructor, even though the students are ok, it is difficult to be excited when they are on the unit each week. Also, not all students are conscientious like you.
  5. by   WDWpixieRN
    Quote from MyBSNin06
    What kind of history does your school have with the facility? That might be part of it. I am in my practicum right now and even though I am a student, I kind of see it from the staffs point of view. There is one school with a bit*hy instructor, even though the students are ok, it is difficult to be excited when they are on the unit each week.
    That's another interesting perspective I hadn't thought of, although in my case, each of the 3 nurses were VERY young, and one, in fact, was a recent graduate of MY college!!

    I'm just going to work on not taking it personally because honest, the thought that went through my head is that if this is the usual atmosphere in a hospital/ward/unit, maybe I need to be looking for something else...these did not look like a bunch of people who enjoyed their job.

    Thanks for the insight.....
  6. by   CCStudent916
    Yeah, I volunteer at a local ER and there is a unit secretary there who does everything he can to make my experience miserable. From talking down to me, making rude comments, being bossy, negatively/personally inflecting his words, talking to other staff about me, you name it. You know, one thing I've learned is that if it doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger. What I do now is practice professionalism when in his presence, noting that whatever I do is being watched by others... so if it is this person's goal to make me angry and appear to have a bad attitude so that I gain a negative reputation by other staff, I won't let him do it to me.
    Picking up on the subtelties of other's negativeness is a skill you should learn, because you can anticipate potential problems and adjust yourself accordingly. Conflict is inevitable, you should not fear it.
  7. by   BlueEyedRN
    Quote from wdwpixie
    ....what is aggravating to me is these were all young nurses....2 whom we were told were just out of school themselves....okay, so maybe they're flustered themselves...but is civility and a smile and a welcome so difficult? I really feel like we're just considered more in the way than anything, and for those of us really trying to learn things and get familiar with our environment, it's somewhat discouraging.
    I'm a very new nurse (still getting precepted) and we've had students on our unit (ICU), and seriously, in this point in my nursing career, there is nothing more annoying than students. I had no idea that I would feel like that and I feel terrible about it and I swear, as soon as I have more experience, I will make up for this to all the students I ever see. I was one myself three months ago and so I totally understand. But you have no idea what kind of pressure a new nurse is under. It is incredibly overwhelming to be completely responsible for patients and you have so much to learn in a very short period of time. They aren't joking when they talk about the learning curve being practically vertical in the first few months of nursing. There are so many things I have to deal with that didn't even register as a student. And it is another stressor to have students on the unit. You have to be worrying about what they are doing when they wander into your patient's room without talking to you first. And then they sit in little groups of threes at your desk talking about the cute neurosurgeon. When you have a patient that they could be helpful with, they'd rather be assigned to the super-critical trauma that they really aren't allowed to even touch. I had a semi-emergency happen with one of my patients that I didn't know how to deal with myself and had to drag my preceptor away from a student who wanted to shave her patient. And he didn't want to let her go. I had to be short with him to get him to leave us alone about it so that she could help me deal with my patient bleeding out. If I had more years under my belt, I probably would have invited him along, but I was scared spitless and didn't have the time to be nice with a warm smile.

    I'm really sorry that it is hard as a student and believe me, I understand how it is to have a nurse or CNA that is a jerk to you. But you gotta understand how hard it is for us. I totally agree that a lot of time, students are treated badly for no reason, especially by those who should be patient and accomodating. And some students are very aware of what's going on and don't interfere or cause problems and just learn. But you never know if this student is going to be the one to accidentally shut off your patient's oxygen supply, you know? It's scary.

    I guess my point is, yes be mad at the CNA's and experienced nurses, but please forgive the new nurses who are currently overwhelmed and terrified. You'll be in our place soon, just as we were in yours just a short while ago, so a little understanding on both sides would be very helpful. I promise that I will love and be inviting to students as soon as I get my feet under me.
  8. by   DaFreak71
    OP: I feel your pain. I'm in my second semester and am currently doing clinical on a med surg floor at my local hospital. The hostility toward the students is palpable. I generally avoid the staff like the plague. If I have a question that my classmates can't answer, I wait until I see my instructor and ask her. There are a few nice RN's on the floor and I'll ask them if I happen to see them, but the majority of them are unbearably nasty. I've just had to make a mental note to never work on that floor when I graduate. If I experience a high level of negativity when I'm there to learn, I don't expect that they are going to suddenly turn into a helpful supportive co-worker.

    With regard to the R.N.s and other unit staff who are annoyed by us students, I can understand being annoyed. I can sympathize with how frustrating it might be to take time out of your day to answer questions or what not. But what I cannot understand is the condescending tone, the abrupt rudeness or hostility. If being a nurse means you're too busy to take literally one minute out of your busy day to tell us where certain items are kept or get report, my guess is that you need some work on your time management skills. If being a nurse means your too busy to be civil, you gotta wonder how much good your really doing for patients. Unless of course you have the ability to go from hostile to caring in .3 seconds flat. If so, more power to ya.

    Here's the thing, OP. Try not to judge them hastily. Don't take one day, or even one week as enough evidence to judge a person's attitude. You never know what they might be dealing with. But if over time they are consistently rude, even when they are sitting around looking at a scrubs catalog in the break room or sitting there reading the newspaper, then just accept the fact that you won't be getting any help from them either as a student or as a co-worker. Perhaps if people tried to be more helpful in getting others up to speed with regard to the job, they'd find that their own work environment would be more pleasant. Teamwork is a beautiful thing, but not everyone contributes positively to it.

    I guess there's probably a good reason why the "Excellence Report" hanging up on the wall in the nurses station indicated that in 2004 and 2005 they had a whopping total of 30% patient satisfaction. So it's not only the nursing students who aren't happy with how things are going.

    Decide to be different. Decide that everyday when you are on the job you will take five minutes to answer some questions or show a student where something is located. If you are dreadfully busy, tell them that. You can say it nicely and you can also tell them that you'd love to spend a few minutes with them later when things settle down. Also, when you learn something share it with your classmates. Learn how to be helpful while you're still in school. Seeing your classmates succeed contributes to fostering a positive and helpful attitude when your on the job. It's good for nursing. Learn good time management skills so that when a student needs some help, you might be able to walk them through a few things. If you're about to do a procedure, no harm in telling a student to come watch. Learn from this experience and then change the course.
  9. by   SummerGarden
    Quote from SisterJ392000
    Thanks for all the great responses. I have calmed down now and realize that some people are just rude and mean and it has little to do with their job title or salary. I just take solace in the fact that what goes around comes around. Just FYI that rude unit clerk got chewed out by a doctor today for not putting in an order he wrote yesterday, and it was right in front of ME! Like I said, what goes around comes around.
    Speaking up for the little person I want to give my . How much experience do you have working with doctors in a clinical setting? It does not sound to me like you have very much, if any at all.

    I doubt the clerk is jealous of either you or your friends. Some people have NO DESIRE TO BE NURSES. The clerk corrected your behavior and was not polite. But the two of you were not polite either. You and your friend were very very rude.

    First your friend was touching papers on her desk. Even if it was just a newspaper that should have been off limits to you two. If anything comes up missing or is a violation of confidentiality or HIPPA, it is her behind and not yours.

    Secondly, you sat down in her seat. It is not her problem you have nowhere to sit. No one should have to tell you to stay out of people's workspace. Use some maturity and discretion when working in other people's space.

    Lastly, if you think the clerk being chewed out by the doctor was any indication that "what goes around comes around" then you are in for a shock. If you work in a clinical setting directly with doctors you are going to get your share of being chewed out (notice how I did not write the word "fair").

    In any case, I do agree that what goes around comes around. Since you and your friend do not realize you were being rude to the clerk, then some day you will have rude student nurses violate your workspace then run off and post it on the internet as a "poor me" scenario. Maybe then you two will understand?
  10. by   WDWpixieRN
    Quote from BlueEyedRN
    You have to be worrying about what they are doing when they wander into your patient's room without talking to you first. And then they sit in little groups of threes at your desk talking about the cute neurosurgeon.
    I guess my point is, yes be mad at the CNA's and experienced nurses, but please forgive the new nurses who are currently overwhelmed and terrified. You'll be in our place soon, just as we were in yours just a short while ago, so a little understanding on both sides would be very helpful. I promise that I will love and be inviting to students as soon as I get my feet under me.
    BlueEyedRN:

    Thanks for this perspective...having only spent 3 full days in clinicals and just going into my 7th (?) week, it's great to have this insight....I will try also to be more understanding....

    I will also try to do a better job of communicating to my RN what I'm doing, but basically I'm in assessment, vitals, and now meds mode only....oh, and baths & changing bed.....and the meds are only done under the supervision of my instructor....

    And we do kind of tend to conglomerate when we're done the above and don't get any more direction or interaction from the CNA or RN (we're the only ones we feel safe with!!)....but there's not a one of us who comments on any dr's...heck, we don't even know who they are yet...but then our group as a whole it a bit older, mostly married, and maybe scared to death to even LOOK at an M.D. at this point!!

    Thanks again....food for thought next time I'm at the hospital!!
  11. by   OhioMTCRN07
    I know the nurses have a lot to do as do the CNAs but we're all in it together, I think. I had the nurse from the hot place down under this week. She looked right through me when I spoke to her and didn't acknowledge me speaking. I kindly asked her if she would "when you have time, check on my patient because she is requesting pain medication" and proceeded to rate the pain, etc. for her. She said "I'll check when I get ready to check and not before." Said pt had pain med ordered q2h and it had been 3.5 h. since last dose and pt was still waiting when I left. Instructor said RN had "personal problems" and there were other things going on. The point is, that patient needed assistance and didn't get it. I wasn't able to give IV meds yet and no one would help her. I felt so bad. Those types of RNs give nurses a bad name. Yes, I know students are just one more thing for them to deal with but we do a lot, assessing the patient, all the charting when we are there with the exception of given IV meds, bed baths, lunches, all the total care. One would think, they would be happy to have us help out especially when they are short handed. I will never, ever, treat a student nurse like a problem when I've got my RNs. It's a team effort, plain and simple. And yes, even though she wasn't kind to say the least, when I left the floor to give report, I said to her "Thanks for letting me work with you today." Ok, I will admit I hope I don't have to do it again but . . . .
  12. by   DaFreak71
    Quote from OhiostudentRN
    I know the nurses have a lot to do as do the CNAs but we're all in it together, I think. I had the nurse from the hot place down under this week. She looked right through me when I spoke to her and didn't acknowledge me speaking. I kindly asked her if she would "when you have time, check on my patient because she is requesting pain medication" and proceeded to rate the pain, etc. for her. She said "I'll check when I get ready to check and not before." Said pt had pain med ordered q2h and it had been 3.5 h. since last dose and pt was still waiting when I left. Instructor said RN had "personal problems" and there were other things going on. The point is, that patient needed assistance and didn't get it. I wasn't able to give IV meds yet and no one would help her. I felt so bad. Those types of RNs give nurses a bad name. Yes, I know students are just one more thing for them to deal with but we do a lot, assessing the patient, all the charting when we are there with the exception of given IV meds, bed baths, lunches, all the total care. One would think, they would be happy to have us help out especially when they are short handed. I will never, ever, treat a student nurse like a problem when I've got my RNs. It's a team effort, plain and simple. And yes, even though she wasn't kind to say the least, when I left the floor to give report, I said to her "Thanks for letting me work with you today." Ok, I will admit I hope I don't have to do it again but . . . .
    You post brings up a good point. As student nurses, we are helping the RN's and the CNA's by being on the floor. We bathe, do meds, assess, do personal care, chart, bandage, etc. If the RN's and CNA's are so horribly busy when they have 10 nursing students on the floor doing all this basic care, what would they do without us? I suppose ten patients every Thursday and Friday would go without bathing, meds, bandaging, assessments, etc.

    I have never had a clinical shift where I wasn't able to get everything for my patient done and still be able to have time left over to assist (or at least offer to assist) my classmates with anything they might need.
  13. by   carolinapooh
    Quote from MBA2BRN
    Speaking up for the little person I want to give my . How much experience do you have working with doctors in a clinical setting? It does not sound to me like you have very much, if any at all.

    I doubt the clerk is jealous of either you or your friends. Some people have NO DESIRE TO BE NURSES. The clerk corrected your behavior and was not polite. But the two of you were not polite either. You and your friend were very very rude.

    First your friend was touching papers on her desk. Even if it was just a newspaper that should have been off limits to you two. If anything comes up missing or is a violation of confidentiality or HIPPA, it is her behind and not yours.

    Secondly, you sat down in her seat. It is not her problem you have nowhere to sit. No one should have to tell you to stay out of people's workspace. Use some maturity and discretion when working in other people's space.

    Lastly, if you think the clerk being chewed out by the doctor was any indication that "what goes around comes around" then you are in for a shock. If you work in a clinical setting directly with doctors you are going to get your share of being chewed out (notice how I did not write the word "fair").

    In any case, I do agree that what goes around comes around. Since you and your friend do not realize you were being rude to the clerk, then some day you will have rude student nurses violate your workspace then run off and post it on the internet as a "poor me" scenario. Maybe then you two will understand?

    This woman - the OP - is 43 years old. I doubt that she was intending to be 'very, very rude' when she sat in an obviously empty chair. And it appears that this newspaper was sitting on a desk in plain view - this was not HIPAA-protected material, it was a NEWSPAPER that apparently the student didn't even TOUCH. (And if, as you pointed out, it HAD been HIPAA material, I would have reported the unit clerk to my clinical instructor myself for having it lying out in plain view. Sorry - that happens to be the law.)

    This has been blown out of proportion - and not just by the rude staff, who were EXTREMELY rude and extremely childish. What a wonderful, professional example to set for students.

    I don't blame the OP for wanting to vent - but I think she's been judged a bit too quickly. Maybe some of her thoughts weren't charitable, but maybe she'd just had enough.

    I too happen to believe what goes around comes around - as long as we all realize it's a two-way street. I'm sure I've gotten mine for stupid stuff I've done myself....I feel safe in saying we ALL have at one time or another.

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