Failing A&P - page 2

Hi everyone. My name is Nicole. I'm 27 and ADN is my major... This is my 2nd semester and I'm taking Anatomy and Physiology I. Not doing well at all. First of all, my instructor is a MATH TEACHER.... Read More

  1. by   HappyNurse2005
    This thread is moving off topic, but i'd like to mention the topic and the side topic
    A&P
    memorization, memorization, memorization. since you have seen teh first test, does that help? maybe you know what kinds of things she asks? does your book have a study guide that helps? do you know anyone in any other A&P class you can study with? Find out the drop date at your school, and if you aren't passing by then, withdraw from the class to save your record from having a bad grade, which would negatively affect your gpa, and your chances of getting into the nursing program. Go ahead and complain-if you really feel she is unqualified and unprepared. Type a letter, use specific examples of why you think she's not good "When Mrs X was asked about osteocytes, she was unable to give us the correct answer" not just "she's a math teacher, she shouldn't teach this stuff". Turn it into the head of the math/science department. If you can find anyone else in your class who agrees with you, they can sign the letter too. It won't do you any good this semester, but it may help future semesters.

    community colleges/financial aid/etc
    why am i seriously getting a vibe from this thread that you all think community college students are lazy and out for money? "its just a community college" "my class is full of delinquents" "they are just going to college to satisfy their parents". Judgemental, no?
    I go to a community college, graduating from the nursing program (ADN) in 3 short months. I took all of my prereqs there. Sure there are lazy ppl in classes, but in my nursing geared classes, there are a heck of a lot more people out there willing to work their arse off to do well. I could have gone to the university for nursing school, but it is a bit far away (CC is in town). my CC also has a higher NCLEX pass rate than the university, too. Plenty of lazy "delinquents" go to universities, too.
    and the money? Yes, I get a lot of money in pell grants. I would not be able to afford to go to college wihtout that pell grant. It pays my tuition and my books, then I have about 500 dollars left. I have 2 kids, bills, etc so im not blowing it on anything. And unlike loans, you dont ask for a certain amount when you apply for pell grants. they just give you what they think you need. so one is not being greedy by having that money, it is what the school decided to give them.
    loans? so what if someone takes out the max? that is their business, adn they'll have to pay it back.

    sorry, i just dont like hostility towards CC students
  2. by   Lovely_RN
    Ummm..O.K I don't know if you read all of my post. I too was a CC student..twice. First from 1998 to 2000 and I am one currently. I am taking my pre-requisites at my old cc because the tuition is much cheaper then the college I eventually obtained my B.A from. I never said that ALL cc students were irresponsible slackers. But some of them are. It is a fact. I went have returned to Borough of Manhattan Community College, which is part of the CUNY system. During the late 90's things were so bad that Mayor Guiliani had to revamp the entire system. It is a fact that students were over borrowing and abusing their grants. It is a fact that sometimes after 4 or 5 years that many of the students were leaving w/o degrees after they had capped themselves on loans and ran out of Tap (which you can receive for 10 semester's max). The standards at the 4-year schools were even worse.

    It has gotten a bit better because standards are more stringent but there still is and always will be students who take advantage of the system. There is no excuse for taking 10 semester to graduate from a 2-year college when you are attending full time. And it is the business of the student body whether students cap themselves on loans and then go into default. Because when a schools loan attrition rate exceeds 20% the school no longer qualifies for Federal loans. So people like that make things worse for people like me. What is wrong with expecting people to use the money that taxpayers provide for its intended purpose?

    P.S I too am a single mom...my son is 11 years old and is autistic. I didn't let that stop me from graduating in 2 years the first go round. I got grants at the 2 year level and loans at the four year. So, I too received federal and state aid and I took out my loans. The difference is that I used them for what there intended purpose was...classes...books...transportation expenses etc.

    What I didn't do was skip out on buying my books and then show up to class wearing Prada and asking the person next to me if I could make copies.

    If you know that you do what you need to do and don't abuse the system.. why are you so concerned with those who don't?
    Last edit by Lovely_RN on Feb 3, '05
  3. by   NicInNC
    Soooo....I had a SCHEDULED appointment with my advisor for 9:30 today. I waited until after 10. She was a no show. She called me on my way home and said she was running late because of ice. We have a slight glazing on the trees, but that's it. The temps have been ABOVE freezing. ARGH!!!!!!!!

    I'm going to talk to the head of the Dept. I found out who that is and got his name and room number. I also am going to get in touch with my Psy teacher from last semseter. HE was the one that told us how English teachers are teaching math, Math teachers teaching English, etc. He himself told us that we were getting robbed of a good education. He has been with the school for several years and has a lot of contacts in various areas, so I'm hoping he can give me some advice on what to do.

    So, in class today there were students talking about apartments, playing checkers, playing Connect Four, sleeping, etc. I kept telling the teacher that I couldn't hear, but she didn't do anything. Then she would go to tell us how to spell certain words and was getting it wrong! I finally spoke up really loud and said "NO...that's wrong. THIS is how you spell it." She kept saying "HYDROHYSEAL". She was leaving out the P. I spoke up and gave the correct spelling, and she STILL said it without the P.
    It's H-Y-D-R-O-P-H-Y-S-E-A-L!!! She even argued with me and when I pointed it out in the book, she got mad. HELLOOOOO!!!!! I wanted to SCREAM! It's just so dang frustrating! Then there was a point that she was trying to show us a slideshow of something about the Mandible and she kept going past it. She has NO CLUE how to work the computer. So, I spoke up again and kept telling her that she passed it. I was pointing to it up on the screen, but she was like "i didn't go past it...I went past it? I didn't go past it". I told her "Yes you did, it's right there. Just click on where it says 7.9 MANDIBLE. She gave up, then right before we left, she decided to try again and was able to pull it up.

    I'm at my wits end.

    Nicole
    Last edit by NicInNC on Feb 3, '05 : Reason: Forgot to add something
  4. by   Lovely_RN
    Quote from NicInNC
    Soooo....I had a SCHEDULED appointment with my advisor for 9:30 today. I waited until after 10. She was a no show. She called me on my way home and said she was running late because of ice. We have a slight glazing on the trees, but that's it. The temps have been ABOVE freezing. ARGH!!!!!!!!

    I'm going to talk to the head of the Dept. I found out who that is and got his name and room number. I also am going to get in touch with my Psy teacher from last semseter. HE was the one that told us how English teachers are teaching math, Math teachers teaching English, etc. He himself told us that we were getting robbed of a good education. He has been with the school for several years and has a lot of contacts in various areas, so I'm hoping he can give me some advice on what to do.

    So, in class today there were students talking about apartments, playing checkers, playing Connect Four, sleeping, etc. I kept telling the teacher that I couldn't hear, but she didn't do anything. Then she would go to tell us how to spell certain words and was getting it wrong! I finally spoke up really loud and said "NO...that's wrong. THIS is how you spell it." She kept saying "HYDROHYSEAL". She was leaving out the P. I spoke up and gave the correct spelling, and she STILL said it without the P.
    It's H-Y-D-R-O-P-H-Y-S-E-A-L!!! She even argued with me and when I pointed it out in the book, she got mad. HELLOOOOO!!!!! I wanted to SCREAM! It's just so dang frustrating! Then there was a point that she was trying to show us a slideshow of something about the Mandible and she kept going past it. She has NO CLUE how to work the computer. So, I spoke up again and kept telling her that she passed it. I was pointing to it up on the screen, but she was like "i didn't go past it...I went past it? I didn't go past it". I told her "Yes you did, it's right there. Just click on where it says 7.9 MANDIBLE. She gave up, then right before we left, she decided to try again and was able to pull it up.

    I'm at my wits end.

    Nicole

    What is the nursing department like in this school? Have you checked their NCLEX pass rates? What would be the point in going through all of this drama just to fail? You need to do some research this doesn't look good.
  5. by   NicInNC
    Quote from Falon
    What is the nursing department like in this school? Have you checked their NCLEX pass rates? What would be the point in going through all of this drama just to fail? You need to do some research this doesn't look good.
    Here you go: http://www.ncbon.com/LicStat-PassRates.asp

    I'm in the ADN program at Forsyth Tech CC. That's a shame that the rate went from 93 down to 77.
  6. by   Maggie in NC
    Nic, I am assuming based on the "Ice" you are pretty close to me in geography. What book are you using? Please let me know so I can assist you. If you were prefer, send it in a PM. I'd be happy to help you with anything I can. I know money is a concern but, keep in mind, dropping and starting over with the possibility of passing beats failing, hands down. Additionally, there should be some specific hiring/teaching parameters for each prof to teach a subject. Please check your prof's qualifications against the CC's policy to insure they are meeting their own guidelines. There is a possibility they are not. You may also ask the dept head to audit the class to make your point.

    Look forward to hearing from you.
    Sincerely,
    Maggie
    Quote from NicInNC
    Soooo....I had a SCHEDULED appointment with my advisor for 9:30 today. I waited until after 10. She was a no show. She called me on my way home and said she was running late because of ice. We have a slight glazing on the trees, but that's it. The temps have been ABOVE freezing. ARGH!!!!!!!!

    I'm going to talk to the head of the Dept. I found out who that is and got his name and room number. I also am going to get in touch with my Psy teacher from last semseter. HE was the one that told us how English teachers are teaching math, Math teachers teaching English, etc. He himself told us that we were getting robbed of a good education. He has been with the school for several years and has a lot of contacts in various areas, so I'm hoping he can give me some advice on what to do.

    So, in class today there were students talking about apartments, playing checkers, playing Connect Four, sleeping, etc. I kept telling the teacher that I couldn't hear, but she didn't do anything. Then she would go to tell us how to spell certain words and was getting it wrong! I finally spoke up really loud and said "NO...that's wrong. THIS is how you spell it." She kept saying "HYDROHYSEAL". She was leaving out the P. I spoke up and gave the correct spelling, and she STILL said it without the P.
    It's H-Y-D-R-O-P-H-Y-S-E-A-L!!! She even argued with me and when I pointed it out in the book, she got mad. HELLOOOOO!!!!! I wanted to SCREAM! It's just so dang frustrating! Then there was a point that she was trying to show us a slideshow of something about the Mandible and she kept going past it. She has NO CLUE how to work the computer. So, I spoke up again and kept telling her that she passed it. I was pointing to it up on the screen, but she was like "i didn't go past it...I went past it? I didn't go past it". I told her "Yes you did, it's right there. Just click on where it says 7.9 MANDIBLE. She gave up, then right before we left, she decided to try again and was able to pull it up.

    I'm at my wits end.

    Nicole
    Last edit by Maggie in NC on Feb 3, '05
  7. by   RNSuzq1
    Quote from NicInNC
    Hi everyone. My name is Nicole. I'm 27 and ADN is my major...Nicole
    Hi Nicole, So sorry to hear about the problems in A&P. I'm also in an ADN Program in NC - just curious - what school are you attending? I've been taking A&P along with the Nursing Course - took A&P I last semester and A&P II this Semester. It's hard when you are taking both of these courses together, going to Clinicals, etc. but it can be done. Like you, I've also been out of school for years, have 3 boys, husband, house, etc. - it's very hard to get it all done and find time for studying, but you can do it.

    A&P I was a little overwhelming at first, but thankfully we have a great Instructor who explains it very well and we also have 3 hour labs each week that coincide with the lectures (so you can see and do things that deal with the topic) - it helps a lot. Just a tip about the skeletal and muscle system - the easiest way to learn it is (memorization) - just going over and over it. The book we use is "Holes Anatomy" - they have a fantastic web site (anyone can use) - it has practice test questions and all sorts of "labeling exercises". You click on whatever part of the skeletal system you want to go over - Ex: - the Skull - it brings up a picture of the skull and has a list of names for the skull bones - you simply click on the name and drag it over to whatever part of the skull you think it matches up with - if you're right, the names stays on the part, if you're wrong, the name goes back to the list and you try again until you get it right.

    You might be like me - I'm a very "visual learner". When we had lectures on mitosis - it wasn't really clicking, but when our Instructor showed us a video and slides about how cell division happens - it made total sense to me. When we did the skeletal system, for our test we had to know not only the bones, but all the many parts of each bone (overwhelming to say the least). In lab, she gave us boxes of bones - we put them together to build a skeleton and can't tell you how much that helped learn where each little part fit in.

    Anatomy is a very complex subject and the framework for Nursing - if you don't know how and why each system in the body works, it would be almost impossible to get through the Nursing Course. To me at least, the Instructor teaching it should have a background in Biology - makes no sense that a math teacher is your Instructor. If none of you are learning this stuff - sounds like you have every right to complain to someone in Admin. Please check out the "Holes Anatomy" web site - I really think it will help you out.
    If you have any questions, I'll be happy to help you out. Susan
  8. by   NeoNurseTX
    You really need a good A&P instructor because it's the basis on everything you will learn!
  9. by   Catys_With_Me
    I must admit I have not read this entire thread and want to take off and go to bed (it's really late, I just got in from clinical and I'm exhausted) so will just say this:

    YOU HAVE SOMEONE TEACHING YOU A&P THAT DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT?!!

    It's not like it's Art History where they point to the slide and say, "Rodin's The Thinker 1880... memorize this." An A&P instructor actually needs to be able to explain some pretty complicated material !!!! In our community college no one goes near a student unless they have a master's degree in whatever area they're teaching.

    Your whole class should seriously complain. They are collecting your tuition money and giving NOTHING (an education) in return! That makes me so mad and it's not even happening to me..
  10. by   oregonrene
    Quote from Catys_With_Me
    I must admit I have not read this entire thread and want to take off and go to bed (it's really late, I just got in from clinical and I'm exhausted) so will just say this:

    YOU HAVE SOMEONE TEACHING YOU A&P THAT DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT?!!

    It's not like it's Art History where they point to the slide and say, "Rodin's The Thinker 1880... memorize this." An A&P instructor actually needs to be able to explain some pretty complicated material !!!! In our community college no one goes near a student unless they have a master's degree in whatever area they're teaching.

    Your whole class should seriously complain. They are collecting your tuition money and giving NOTHING (an education) in return! That makes me so mad and it's not even happening to me..
    Exactly! At my CC, the instructors have to have a masters degree in the subject they are teaching. To the OP - you need to complain long and loud. No way should you have to put up with a so-called learning environment like that. A&P is TOUGH. You need a teacher who knows it backward and forward and can teach it!
  11. by   lilk8tob
    Hello,
    I have an Anatomy test today, so I don't have time to read all the replies to see if anyone else has suggested this, but I'm getting by in A&P by using the book's website. It has practice quizzes that really help me understand what the key points are in each chapter. If your book does not have a website, send me an email and I will let you know how to log into my book's site.

    Good luck with everything, I'm sure you will do fine!!

    Katie
    lilk8tob@hotmail.com
  12. by   RedSox33RN
    Quote from RNinMay2005
    This thread is moving off topic, but i'd like to mention the topic and the side topic
    A&P
    memorization, memorization, memorization. since you have seen teh first test, does that help? maybe you know what kinds of things she asks? does your book have a study guide that helps? do you know anyone in any other A&P class you can study with? Find out the drop date at your school, and if you aren't passing by then, withdraw from the class to save your record from having a bad grade, which would negatively affect your gpa, and your chances of getting into the nursing program. Go ahead and complain-if you really feel she is unqualified and unprepared. Type a letter, use specific examples of why you think she's not good "When Mrs X was asked about osteocytes, she was unable to give us the correct answer" not just "she's a math teacher, she shouldn't teach this stuff". Turn it into the head of the math/science department. If you can find anyone else in your class who agrees with you, they can sign the letter too. It won't do you any good this semester, but it may help future semesters.

    community colleges/financial aid/etc
    why am i seriously getting a vibe from this thread that you all think community college students are lazy and out for money? "its just a community college" "my class is full of delinquents" "they are just going to college to satisfy their parents". Judgemental, no?
    I go to a community college, graduating from the nursing program (ADN) in 3 short months. I took all of my prereqs there. Sure there are lazy ppl in classes, but in my nursing geared classes, there are a heck of a lot more people out there willing to work their arse off to do well. I could have gone to the university for nursing school, but it is a bit far away (CC is in town). my CC also has a higher NCLEX pass rate than the university, too. Plenty of lazy "delinquents" go to universities, too.
    and the money? Yes, I get a lot of money in pell grants. I would not be able to afford to go to college wihtout that pell grant. It pays my tuition and my books, then I have about 500 dollars left. I have 2 kids, bills, etc so im not blowing it on anything. And unlike loans, you dont ask for a certain amount when you apply for pell grants. they just give you what they think you need. so one is not being greedy by having that money, it is what the school decided to give them.
    loans? so what if someone takes out the max? that is their business, adn they'll have to pay it back.

    sorry, i just dont like hostility towards CC students
    I have to say, that I've did about 1/2 of my pre-req's at a CC also. I'm now attending an expensive Catholic college, and I have seen JUST AS MANY lazy students as there were in the CC. There are many young students whose parents are paying for their education, and they don't care if they pass or fail. Many DO care, but there is a lot who don't. It's sad - no matter what school they're attending, that they can waste money like that.

    On the other hand, I had a lot of students in my classes at the CC who were paying for college themselves, and wanted to get everything out of it they could.

    I'm a non-traditional student, in my late 30's, and it's really important to me that 1) I get everything out of my education and 2) that my 4 children SEE me getting everything out of it, and appreciating any loans and scholarships given to me.
  13. by   rvh414
    Hi Nicole,
    I'm finally knocking out my last pre-req. I just got done applying to nursing school and will find out something by the end of May. A/P-1 was definetly the hardest for me. All I can tell you if you decide to retake A/P again ask some other students about the instructors. You can go to a website http://www.ratemyprofessor. You will find a listing of feed backs provided by other students that have taken certain instructors. Don't give up. Believe me I know where your coming from. I have three kids and have to wait till everyone falls asleep before I can get any quality studying done. Its pure memorization. But the most important part is understanding what your reading. Of course the lab section of your A/P is memorization of all the different parts. Just hang in there. You'll be fine

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