Working at the VA hospital with Professionals! - page 2

On a travel assignment at the VA hospital here in Seattle, I floated to another unit. I was amazed at the helpfulness, the caring, and wonderful nurses I worked with on the Spinal Cord unit there! ... Read More

  1. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by RNPD:
    <STRONG>Brownie-when I first read the original post, I must admit that i felt the exact same way as the next 2 posters did. I didn't really know about the problems you were having with SOME BSNs you had worked with, and out of context, the remark sounded like bashing. When I read your explanation, I understood better where you were coming from.

    A suggestion-it might have worked better had you said something like-"I worked with a BSN recently who treated me so well that I realized that generalizations are unfair and that there is good and bad in every group". I don't think anyone could find fault with that, and I believe it is the gist of what you wanted to say-although I don't mean to put words in your mouth, so if I am wrong, tell me.

    I have worked with some great LPNs-in fact my only complaint in ever working with an LPN was not their lack of knowledge, but that some had TOO much knowledge and attempted to practice outside their scope-dangerous for any licensed professional. I may know when a person needs Lasix, for example-but if I give it w/o the doc's order, I am practicing medicine w/o a license and could lose mine! I'm sure you get the point!

    I think everyone gets defensive when they hear ANY kind of comparison among the various types of licensed nures. But I think we all need to admit that those differences DO exist by virtue of education and licensure and act accordingly. I must admit that i have never worked in any patient care unit where ANY type of nurse didn't work her butt off, with the exception of maybe the manager or charge nurse who didn't take patients.

    At any rate, try not to get so excited and angry by a post that you lose your professionalism. I know that it makes you feel bad later on, because it's happened to me so many times, and I always feel terrible when I cool off. I also think it sounds defensive to drag in other posters who are known for their bashing, as a way to deflect criticism from you. Let's just try to have a dialog as calmly as we can. I almost missed your point where I understood what you meant with the first post, because you were so out of control at times that I didn't want to read it.

    You sound like a good and caring nurse. Let's all try to be caring to each other as well.

    PS: I'd like to put some of those smiley faces here, but for the life of me I can't figure out how!!)</STRONG>
    You what, YOU'RE absolutely CORRECT! I see your wording as one, that would may have made my point better! I thank you for taking the time to point this out to me!

    Unfortunately, until recently, I had been working with BSNs, and having some experiences, that would seem like horror stories, if I were to relate them! The stories I did relate were only the light weight stuff!

    I also NEVER go out of my scope of practice, as it relates to the hospitals, and states, I'm working in. I have however, been asked to do things, I KNEW was out of my scope of practice, as the BSN didn't want to do it, and tried to get pissed when I refused, and had to get the policy down for THEIR own hospital, and showed it to them! I had one BSN asked me if I would do something, and I asked, am I allowed to do this? I already knew I wasn't, but HE refused to answer, and continue to ask, WOULD YOU...LOL! NO!

    I thank you for taking the time to post this, and if you click on one of the instant graemlins at the end of the post field, to the left, you will find some smiley faces..

    Brownie
  2. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by fergus51:
    <STRONG>I wasn't trying to imply you said the monkey comment because I know you didn't. I was only trying to explain why I interpreted your comment as a dig when you didn't mean it as one because a lot of people interpreted jason's comment as a dig (including me) while others didn't. I NEVER wrote that you think all nurses are as smart as monkeys. Believe it or not I am not pure evil. If you could read my post in the tone I meant it in I don't think it would have been so offensive to you. Unfortunately tone of voice can't be expressed on a computer screen. I took what you said at face value (that you were being positive) and tried to explain why I misinterpreted your post and apologize if I was wrong. That's all...Really. Can I call a truce?</STRONG>

    YOU'RE CORRECT,...tone is difficult to inflect online. I'm glad you were nice enough to disregard my previous post, and responded as you have! Thank you , ...truce!

    Brownie
  3. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by Jo_deye_yuh:
    <STRONG>Brownie~

    Two thumbs up! Your original post was received by me with your initial intent. Others like to look for "digs". Insecurities perhaps, or just the inability to accept the positive.


    THANK YOU JO_deye_yuh! I was sooo elated after working on that unit, I just wanted to share, how perceptions can be changed with just ONE good interaction!

    Brownie

    [As a LPN the above quote is faced daily, so I completly understand Brownie's sentiment about those holier than thou'ers and the way they may act or treat.

    I am not inciting anything, just adding. I respect all levels of nursing and what each in their capacity has to offer. We are all valuable to our field and to our patients!

    I also work in a VA hospital as a Med/Surg nurse, and found Brownie's positive experience a breath of fresh air to read!

    [ May 14, 2001: Message edited by: Jo_deye_yuh ]</STRONG>
  4. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by john william:
    <STRONG> Thanks brownms46 for that nice posting.It's good to hear about people working together,helping the float or new person, all pulling to get the job done. I worked per diem at one place, got treated like I had the plague!
    About the BSN thing, SOME people do cop an attitude when they start getting letters after their name, SOME don't. All depends on the person really. Some nurses are very good some arn't. That last statement also applies to DON's, MD's, all types of RN's from PHD's to nursing assistances to health techs. When your working with a good one you know it, no matter what the persons educational level is. It sounds like you've run into more than your share of people with an attitude. I work with some great BSN's and I've worked with others who couldn't nurse their way out of a paper bag.All depends on the person.Any way thanks for that great posting.</STRONG>

    THANK YOU WILLIAM, ! I'm glad you're ALSO in a supportive environement now! Until recently, I couldn't see even making it to the end of the year, as a nurse! I had started thinking, that working at Blockbuster would be preferable to seeing pts., not being adequately cared, by those with the most knowledge to do so!

    I go to work NOW, with a renewed sense of purpose, and I FINALLY have a mostly supportive setting, to once again do what to me, is as natural as breathing! Taking care of those, for whom for the Grace of God, could be ME!

    One day I will finally be able to finish my goal of being a PA. But for now, I have TWO in college, which my kids, and I pay for, as I refuse to let them be trapped in loans, or govt. assistance, after paying for private schools also, prior to now. Then it will be MY turn to remember where I came from! I hope I NEVER become, what I have detested in others! I have completed prereqs, and only waiting until my youngest completes this next year before stating the program. I have already been offered a position from two physicans when I have finally finished.

    Bronwie
  5. by   JennieBSN
    Brownie-

    I did not tell you not to post here. Get glasses.

    While you're at it, get a thesaurus and a dictionary, and you might want to install spell-check on your computer. Oh, and by the way, you might want to take a class on proper use of punctuation and grammar. Commas put, in, between, every other, word, and phrase, as you do, is grossly, erroneous.

    I am through explaining or posting s*** to you. You're ignorant and hateful, and next time you feel like blowing someone's head off with your verbal toxicity, do it to your damn self.

    [ May 15, 2001: Message edited by: kday ]
  6. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by kday:
    <STRONG>Brownie-

    I did not tell you not to post here. Get glasses.

    While you're at it, get a thesaurus and a dictionary, and you might want to install spell-check on your computer. Oh, and by the way, you might want to take a class on proper use of punctuation and grammar. Commas put, in, between, every other, word, and phrase, as you do, is grossly, erroneous.

    I am through explaining or posting s*** to you. You're ignorant and hateful, and next time you feel like blowing someone's head off with your verbal toxicity, do it to your damn self.

    [ May 15, 2001: Message edited by: kday ]</STRONG>

    OOOOOh NOW YOU'RE,,,,,,,,,,,LOL, and LOL,...LOL,,,,, youre soooo funny..HEEEheee!
    I love it when I make dumb, folks, cuss,! LOL,,,,, just what i needd a instructr who can't commnicate any better than the person she , TRIED to correct! LOL,,,,whooaaaaa ,,,too funny! Why should I have all teh fun,,,posting to myself,,, I'm havin too much fun with ya!


    Brownie,,,,,, who could care less bout ya!
  7. by   sandigapeachlpn
    I thought it was interesting reading all the posts, in regard to "digs,", so to speak. Whether you are an LPN assuming that all BSN'S are immediately going to look down on you, or on the other hand ,immediately assuming that all LPN's are not really intelligent. In trying to understand both points of view I realized a new one that has been said many times to me. " OH, YOU MEAN YOU'RE AN LPN? I THOUGHT YOU WERE A RN THE WAY YOU CARRY YOURSELF."
  8. by   night owl
    I'm a LPN who has worked in the VA system for 25 years. I can honestly say that every BSN I've EVER worked with has been a ball of fire including ADNs! I've NEVER had a problem with any condesending nurses and If I ever do, I probably won't know what to do or say!
  9. by   -jt
    Nice to hear you are enjoying your new place.
    I find it interestesing how people here are describing each other by initials after their name. It sounds so funny to hear someone say "this BSN I work with..."
    Where I work, no one notices any difference between the ADN & BSN & diploma nurse.We just say "nurse" We all have the same job, same kind of assignments, same responsibilities & are held to the same standard. In my unit we even have a good % of MSNs & NPs who have chosen to remain at the bedside. They do the same work the diploma nurses in my unit do.
    I understand its been your experience that nurses who have a BSN for some reason are lazy but I think it would be more accurate to say some people are just like that - no matter what degree or title they have.
  10. by   nurs4kids
    I'm with JT, I think this whole thing of superiority is an institutional problem, not a nursing problem. My hospital recognizes us as "nurses", not BSN, LPN, ASN, etc. They will not allow BSN's to put "BSN" on their nametags, all RN's have simply "RN" behind their names. I'm an ASN and have never experienced this problem with the BSN's. I also think it's about how one perceives self. There is not a BSN, MSN or MD out there who could make me feel less a nurse simply because they have more education. I think RN's are often frustrated with LPN's not because of the abilities of the LPN, but because of the scope of practice that the individual facility or state allows them to practice. I have worked with some damn good LPN's in the past, but the institution I now work for has limited what a LPN may do to such menial tasks that it's very frustrating for a RN to work with a LPN. This is NOT the fault of the LPN, and I'm sure with the shortage their job descriptions will widen. As for other differences in the education, I agree that each education level should have perks above the other. Hell yeah, those who suffered through two+ more years of the torture of nursing school should make more than me and I have tremendous respect for their dedication to education. I can make excuses for why I didn't get a BSN, MSN, etc. but bottom line is that everyone has family/personal responsibilities and it's a matter of sacrifice and what's important to one as to whether he/she furthers the education. Sooo, we can argue this point all day, but the bottom line is it's about self. I've had the woman at the drive-thru window at McDonald's try to "talk down" to me. I'm sure it isn't because she has more letters behind her name, it's probably because she had a need to build her own esteem. You can't build yours by attempting to degrade mine. I am responsible for ME.

    Kday, I am shocked by your previous post. You lost all professionalism. You did exactly what Brownie and other LPN's talk about. Spelling, grammar, etc does NOT make a person more or less intelligent. I'm sure there are things Brownie can do that you can't. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. My husband's grammar and spelling are pathetic, but when it comes to Trig, History, Science, etc. he can blow me out of the water. Don't be so quick to judge the book by it's cover!

    Peace all! We NEED each other!!!

    [ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: nurs4kids ]
  11. by   nurs4kids
    KDay,
    You took her original post and turned it into a debate. She only intended to tell about a wonderful experience, not start a fight. No, I do not agree with the manner at which she went about responding to you, but she's now on the defensive. YOU know what she meant by the original post. You know why LPN's have the attitude they do toward RN's. RN's in general DO treat LPN's differently. She never said "ALL BSN's/ALL RN's". If it doesn't apply to me, I have no reason to be offended by her comment.

    As for her grammar/spelling: This bb is not a term paper, and I got her point without it seeming "comical". I don't recall this site requiring an "A" in English 101 in order to post. In your last post, you call her anything from an idiot to a neanderthal, then end by calling her a babbling 4 year old...&lt;cocks head and grins&gt;I'm trying to remember how a 4 year old reacts when threatened.
    chil girl!

    [ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: nurs4kids ]
  12. by   JennieBSN
    Nurs4-

    #1) It's a nice, fluffy thought to say 'you can't judge a book by it's cover' when it comes to spelling and grammar, HOWEVER...when one is trying to make an argument or point, grammar and spelling count. Try using that kind of grammar and punctuation on a resume or term paper, and that philosophy just doesn't cut it. If one is attempting to assert one's point in an argument in writing, writing like a mental midget makes the whole argument seem comical.

    #2) I find it interesting that you 'are shocked' by my post, yet say nothing to the myopic blowhard who has spent this entire post doing nothing but yelling and attempting to belittle me.

    #3) I certainly DO NOT 'need' such an inarticulate, vehemently hostile, insecure idiot like the one who started this post. Fortunately, I work with people who do not feel the need to bash each other because they feel threatened by their degree, thus the definition of a true 'professional.'

    Do not chastise me for defending myself against an unwarranted attack from an intellectual neanderthal. SOMEONE had to show some brains in this post, not just nonsensical babbling and 'LOL' over and over again like a giddy 4 year old.
  13. by   Brownms46
    Originally posted by nurs4kids:
    <STRONG>I'm with JT, I think this whole thing of superiority is an institutional problem, not a nursing problem. My hospital recognizes us as "nurses", not BSN, LPN, ASN, etc. They will not allow BSN's to put "BSN" on their nametags, all RN's have simply "RN" behind their names. I'm an ASN and have never experienced this problem with the BSN's. I also think it's about how one perceives self. There is not a BSN, MSN or MD out there who could make me feel less a nurse simply because they have more education. I think RN's are often frustrated with LPN's not because of the abilities of the LPN, but because of the scope of practice that the individual facility or state allows them to practice. I have worked with some damn good LPN's in the past, but the institution I now work for has limited what a LPN may do to such menial tasks that it's very frustrating for a RN to work with a LPN. This is NOT the fault of the LPN, and I'm sure with the shortage their job descriptions will widen. As for other differences in the education, I agree that each education level should have perks above the other. Hell yeah, those who suffered through two+ more years of the torture of nursing school should make more than me and I have tremendous respect for their dedication to education. I can make excuses for why I didn't get a BSN, MSN, etc. but bottom line is that everyone has family/personal responsibilities and it's a matter of sacrifice and what's important to one as to whether he/she furthers the education. Sooo, we can argue this point all day, but the bottom line is it's about self. I've had the woman at the drive-thru window at McDonald's try to "talk down" to me. I'm sure it isn't because she has more letters behind her name, it's probably because she had a need to build her own esteem. You can't build yours by attempting to degrade mine. I am responsible for ME.

    Kday, I am shocked by your previous post. You lost all professionalism. You did exactly what Brownie and other LPN's talk about. Spelling, grammar, etc does NOT make a person more or less intelligent. I'm sure there's things Brownie can do that you can't. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. My husband's grammar and spelling are pathetic, but when it comes to Trig, History, Science, etc. he can blow me out of the water. Don't be so quick to judge the book by it's cover!

    Peace all! We NEED each other!!!</STRONG>
    I totally agree with your post.

    Brownie

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