Treating the Muslim patient - Page 5

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  1. Aug 10, '10 by
    I think it's important to respect peoples cultural preferences, however there are going to be times when you simply can't provide gender preferences. There are less male nurses than female in my hospital and it's not uncommon for the entire ward to have all female nurses on the one shift. A request for a male nurse may not be possible. And don't get me started on all gender operating teams-you want a liver transplant? Sorry all the surgeons who do these in my state are male.
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  2. Aug 11, '10 by
    "There are less male nurses than female in my hospital and it's not uncommon for the entire ward to have all female nurses on the one shift. A request for a male nurse may not be possible".
    Yes this does describe the problem, but yet again does not deliver a solution. Whether we want to accept it or not, people are becoming savvy enough to want to choose who may or may not have "full" access to their bodies.
    Quite frankly, we have this choice everywhere else in our lives, it is only rational to expect it in a medical setting.
    Going to school and learning a skill is simply a personal choice. Wanting to undress in front of opposite gender strangers is also a personal choice. There are no automatic entitlements to people's bodies regardless of gender.
    Let's not make this more complicated than it really is. People should be assured of private decency expectations ( choices) no matter what building they happen to be in or who the person is standing in front of them.
    This equates to hospital standards that are difficult to change, but not impossible. And it does require that most agree that the basic legal right to choose who you want to expose yourself to is a standard we all share in all situations of life. Simple.
    From Muslim to Wican, we are a modest society. Look outside....how many naked people do you see?
    lindarn likes this.
  3. Guide
    Aug 11, '10 by
    How do you propose to come up with the necessary staff members to allow for same-gender care? Seems like there won't be a practical solution to this problem for many years down the road.

    In the meantime, yes, patients do have a choice about who sees them in the buff. But they may end up choosing between same-gender care and having a long wait on elective procedures. This may have less to do with discrimination and more to do with the fact that there are not enough male nurses to go around and even fewer female neurosurgeons. Hospitals can offer what they don't possess, and that's simple mathematics.
    talaxandra, JennyNurse2B, lindarn, and 3 others like this.
  4. Aug 11, '10 by
    For a thread related to the above comments, see the one I started.
    I do agree that social changes take time, but there are ways to make
    things move faster,strategies to get more men into nursing.

    The End of Men - Nursing for Nurses
  5. Aug 12, '10 by
    [quote=RedCell;3900388]Muslim protoplasm is the same as any other human being. Treat them like you would any other patient. If they refuse your care....fine, let someone else pick up the slack. This is not something you encounter in the real world that often. Usually it is just an unlikely scenario nursing instructors enjoy wasting time on instead of teaching students useful information that actually improves care.

    If you are going to start worrying about muslim customs, you better start learning nursing considerations for sikhs, buddhists, shinto, scientologists, wiccans, the nation of yahweh, followers of the prince philip movement, the flying spaghetti monster (my personal favorite) and nuwaubians. Well, at least nuwaubianism has its roots in muslim culture so not too much to learn there. Start studying dude, there are a lot of sensitive people out there![I

    It's nice to be sensitive when you can, but REALLY, it's what you can do with what you are given; and I don't see alot of staffing assignments or ratios based on religious beliefs of patients. Now. if a complaint is filed, then it will be only you on the hot seat,; so file your ADO ASAP.
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  6. Aug 12, '10 by
    I believe it's important to be aware of individual cultural and religious preferences ...plus ask the p't if their needs are being met.
    We don't always do this where I work. I know many elderly women would prefer not to have a male nurse aide do pericare etc....but sometimes there is no female aide and the nurses are busy with tx.
    I have had surgery and have been pleased to have female nurses do my intimate stuff. Am not a particularly conservative person but would prefer not to have a male nurse insert my foley or have a male aide toilet me
  7. Nov 9, '10 by
    I think the complexities that have come up with providing culturally competent care are really just an outgrowth of this hole switch to a "customer focused" health care paradigm. The hole thing is nonsense really! I think wherever possible guide your actions with respect. But having said that, we are highly trained health care professionals providing life or death skills to patients; we are not diplomats. I wish that just for once the PhD's that develop these so called "theories" would remember the reality of their bedside nursing days/experiences. There just simply isn't time for this kind of concerns when you are spending 50%+ of your shift doing paper charting when your hospital probably should have made the switch to more efficient electronic charting years ago!!!

    I just think health care has become so dysfunctional in general; particularly because of this "customer" crap! Nurse managers are really glorified puppets for MDs and PhDs above them. Its sad really. Lord help me if I ever become one of them if I pursue further graduate studies; in fact, one of the things stopping me is that I don't want to walk around with the "head in the sand (or up my ...)" attitude that they all seem to exude, forever ignoring the very real concerns of the bedside nurse.
    Last edit by giveface on Nov 9, '10
    inshallamiami likes this.
  8. Nov 9, '10 by
    For a story of the ways that culturally unaware care can negatively impact the patient, the medical practitioners, and the family, see: Amazon.com: The Spirit Catches You and You Fall Down (9780374525644): Anne Fadiman: Books

    There are many ways to be American, IMHO. And consenting patients, who feel respected in their interactions with you, will come back to you happily and do the best long-term job of caring for their own health in teamwork with you. Health care doesn't allow the time to be taken for consent-building sometimes. That's a systemic problem, which leads, in the short term, to us being able to do our jobs more quickly, but in the long term, it leads to reduced patient trust and compliance, which in turn wastes health care practitioner hours, thus creating a huge hidden cost. This is all IMHO - anyone know of any studies that back this up OR refute it?
    sharpeimom, Cul2, and lindarn like this.
  9. Nov 9, '10 by
    Quote from giveface
    I think the complexities that have come up with providing culturally competent care are really just an outgrowth of this hole switch to a "customer focused" health care paradigm. The hole thing is nonsense really! I think wherever possible guide your actions with respect. But having said that, we are highly trained health care professionals providing life or death skills to patients; we are not diplomats. I wish that just for once the PhD's that develop these so called "theories" would remember the reality of their bedside nursing days/experiences. There just simply isn't time for this kind of concerns when you are spending 50%+ of your shift doing paper charting when your hospital probably should have made the switch to more efficient electronic charting years ago!!!

    I just think health care has become so dysfunctional in general; particularly because of this "customer" crap! Nurse managers are really glorified puppets for MDs and PhDs above them. Its sad really. Lord help me if I ever become one of them if I pursue further graduate studies; in fact, one of the things stopping me is that I don't want to walk around with the "head in the sand (or up my ...)" attitude that they all seem to exude, forever ignoring the very real concerns of the bedside nurse.
    It takes 2 seconds to ask a patient if they have any cultural or spiritual preferences, and most can be easily accomadated. And it can make a huge difference in thier overall experience. Regardless of what paradigm the concept arises from, wouldn't you want to make your patient feel comfortable?

    (BTW, it's spelled whole)
    sharpeimom and Cul2 like this.
  10. Nov 10, '10 by
    Quote from giveface
    I wish that just for once the PhD's that develop these so called "theories" would remember the reality of their bedside nursing days/experiences. There just simply isn't time for this kind of concerns when you are spending 50%+ of your shift doing paper charting when your hospital probably should have made the switch to more efficient electronic charting years ago!!!

    I just think health care has become so dysfunctional in general; particularly because of this "customer" crap! Nurse managers are really glorified puppets for MDs and PhDs above them. Its sad really. Lord help me if I ever become one of them if I pursue further graduate studies; in fact, one of the things stopping me is that I don't want to walk around with the "head in the sand (or up my ...)" attitude that they all seem to exude, forever ignoring the very real concerns of the bedside nurse.
    Nothing excuses ANYONE forgetting the reality of bedside care.

    I think I'm starting to see what you mean. Are you saying that, due to the insanity of workload combined with out-of-touch policy-makers, you are expected to provide a quantity of care that you already have to be damn good to provide......and then also expected to be social worker, chaplain, and PR rep on top of that, all rolled into one?