Should Respiratory Care get its own mid-level provider credential? - page 5

I know this is primarily a nursing forum, but Respiratory and RRT/RN dual title holders are also very prominent in this forum, but me being an RRT/and current PA student, I have an interest in this... Read More

  1. Visit  PMFB-RN profile page
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    Quote from netglow
    I agree with PMFB-RN, as well as Ktliz - many MDs think the length of MD edu is a joke, they feel that the first two years especially, could be totally dropped as a waste of time and money.
    *** The length of MD education acomplishes it's goal. That is to limit both the number of people who are willing to do it, and the type of people who can become physicians. They only want certain kinds of people to be MDs and one of the way they weed out the unwanted is the length and expence of education. Nursing is trying hard to do the same. Clearly the house wife in her 30's or the laid off factory workers who can become RNs in a couple - three years inexpensivly and close to their home via a community college as not what is wanted as the future of nursing. Better to drasticaly increase the time and expence (without providing anymore nursing education) and inconvenience but forcing anyone who wants to be an RN go to a university and spend tens of thousands on a BSN. The proposed BSN required is desinged to keep out those undesirable types.
    ktliz likes this.
  2. Visit  netglow profile page
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    It's only about the money - nothing else. Everything is easily understood if you look specifically at the motivation. Who pays whom off - that is what is most important to understand.
  3. Visit  netglow profile page
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    Quote from SycamoreStudent
    I had a foreign MD that couldn't find a residency (had been looking for 2 years) teach my physiology class, talk about scary!
    Also, there are specialty fellowship trained MDs who cannot find employment in many areas. This is due to the fact that in many areas almost all MDs are employed with the large hospital networks. When there is demand for that specialty eg increase in patient need, those MDs simply are ordered to work more hours and travel to locations that have a patient increase. Remember, they don't set their own working conditions anymore - they are more and more like us now. They are told what to do and where to do it. So more and more often when a brand spank'in new fellowship trained doc interviews, even though the doctors in the big network in his specialty are overwhelmed, he has to hope to get hired. Sound familiar? Of course it does, because, in many areas an MD's life is becoming more and more similar to a nurse's. The employer wants to work with less, and will. Private practice is almost non-existent these days, simply because you cannot get referrals from other MDs who must refer only to MDs who work for their same employer. Does patient care suffer, YES. But that is not an issue. Nobody in administration really cares. It's only about the money.
    SycamoreGuy likes this.
  4. Visit  HouTx profile page
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    This is a really interesting thread. The OP reminds me of the old metaphor of the blind men trying to describe an elephant. Each of them drew conclusions based on their own (very limited) exposure to the big picture.

    I wonder where the need yet another job title to help because of the looming 'shortage of pulmonologists' is coming from? In my neck of the woods (including my own plumonologist) they have AC- NPs working with them. Seems to be working out fine. I agree with the PPs who say we don't need any more alphabet soup of new titles in the mix. It would really be counter-productive since reimbursement is moving the other way... eliminating separate billing and making everyone share the pie.
    elkpark and roser13 like this.
  5. Visit  meandragonbrett profile page
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    "Looming shortage of pulmonologists" Pulmonary docs aren't the only ones practicing in critical care. ACNPs, Anesthesiologists, and surgical critical care.
  6. Visit  chrisspeilmanrules84 profile page
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    Quote from meandragonbrett
    "Looming shortage of pulmonologists" Pulmonary docs aren't the only ones practicing in critical care. ACNPs, Anesthesiologists, and surgical critical care.
    There's a shortage of all of those types of providers maybe except for the ACNP

    So to justify the need for advanced practice RT's ?? Why not....they have a knowledge base with the heart & lungs that's unrivaled among healthcare workers that have education equal to or less than a bachelors

    So yes ...it can only help, but the only problem would be that these advanced RT's would only be able to focus on the pulmonary system.....
  7. Visit  chrisspeilmanrules84 profile page
    0
    Quote from HouTx
    This is a really interesting thread. The OP reminds me of the old metaphor of the blind men trying to describe an elephant. Each of them drew conclusions based on their own (very limited) exposure to the big picture.

    I wonder where the need yet another job title to help because of the looming 'shortage of pulmonologists' is coming from? In my neck of the woods (including my own plumonologist) they have AC- NPs working with them. Seems to be working out fine. I agree with the PPs who say we don't need any more alphabet soup of new titles in the mix. It would really be counter-productive since reimbursement is moving the other way... eliminating separate billing and making everyone share the pie.


    Wow, I'm really amazed how rude some of you (not all of you) have been to the OP

    You know, if you disagree with something, there is a proper and improper way to do it and I think you can be a little more respectful than calling someone a "blind man describing an elephant"
    Even though that's one of the better ones.

    This person is just asking for an opinion and and an honest mature discussion ...and do without the name calling please ?

    And as far as someone else's post saying the next thing will be advanced practice Dental hygienists and pt assistants.... Your just being rude.

    Now to answer the op properly and respectfully: I Think an advanced practice RT would be very beneficial to healthcare: to have someone be able to specialize even further on the two most critical body systems?

    That's a huge asset to have ... And I do think respiratory care is capable of doing that , but there is a lot of politics and red tape to go through

    Plus there are already NP's and PA's already. One of the purposes of mid levels has always been to help relieve shortages and reach care to areas and populations that don't have them....and they have done that ...but not as we'll as we'd like.

    Now if your area seems like there are no shortages of Doctors, NP's and PA's....then good for you, but that doesn't mean that according to research that they're not out there...but I don't know this as a fact, I'm going by what I've read and heard.
  8. Visit  chrisspeilmanrules84 profile page
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    I will say that the status quo of just having PA's and NP's is good enough

    But if they determine that a decade or two from now that they need to find away to alleviate the shortage of pulmonologists, if there ends up being one of course...then yes an advanced practice RT may be an option to explore...

    Many nurses don't have respect for RT's and only view them as neb jockeys and don't think they're capable of doing more and that's a shame....because nursing has come a long way itself as a profession, I don't see why respiratory can't ?
  9. Visit  SycamoreGuy profile page
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    Quote from chrisspeilmanrules84
    And as far as someone else's post saying the next thing will be advanced practice Dental hygienists and pt assistants.... Your just being rude. .
    FYI: Advanced Practice dental hygienist is a real thing, or atleast in the works. See here: http://www.nationaloralhealthconfere...esentation.pdf
    elkpark likes this.
  10. Visit  chrisspeilmanrules84 profile page
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    Interesting.....



    Ok , I just don't see why having more mid level providers I'd bad, but its ok for nursing to have everything?
  11. Visit  netglow profile page
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    I think that if you keep touting anything that has "shortage" attached to it as a reason to go back to to college in order for you to be alleviating this "shortage" of whomever and thus securing ficticious future employment for yourself ...even after all the bogusness of the "nursing shortage" has been busted wide out into the open, well, then you'd pretty much be a fool.
    hiddencatRN likes this.
  12. Visit  SycamoreGuy profile page
    1
    Quote from chrisspeilmanrules84
    Interesting.....



    Ok , I just don't see why having more mid level providers I'd bad, but its ok for nursing to have everything?
    Its not bad per say... If there is a true need for an advanced level of respiratory care then by all means lets get them trained. I'm just not convinced that there is a need that can't be filled by existing professions (i.e. Pulmonologists, ACNPs, PAs, AAs, or even RNs). Its getting to the point where we have a specialist and the associated assistants for every disease.
    elkpark likes this.
  13. Visit  LadyFree28 profile page
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    Quote from SycamoreStudent

    Its not bad per say... If there is a true need for an advanced level of respiratory care then by all means lets get them trained. I'm just not convinced that there is a need that can't be filled by existing professions (i.e. Pulmonologists, ACNPs, PAs, AAs, or even RNs). Its getting to the point where we have a specialist and the associated assistants for every disease.
    ^agreed.

    The logical sense is that if RTs want to bridge out at some point to a Bachelors, they could have the option to go for an already established Mid-Level practitioner degree, such as PA or NP. There are tracks already established for straight MSN programs, and RTs can make a great transition into these programs because of the familiarity of anatomy and physiology, physics, and that their specialty is an important part of bedside nursing.

    In my opinion, we have plenty of bridges and overlapping of health team members. To reach a point of a team of people for every body system would do more harm than good...each "system" member would end up having potential opposing plans of care, potentially driving up costs and possibly increasing pt morbidity. There is a reason why there is a saying about "too many cooks in the kitchen..."

    I think the best thing about having mid level practitioners are the ability to have these providers pull it all together. There are increasing NPs in ICUs, transplant teams, ERs, General Hospitalists, Endocrinology, Cardiology, Pulmonary/ENT, Surgery, Pediatrics...I have and are working side by side with them. I had a NP come by to see her pt last night who had reconstructive surgery for her trachea. She is an Pulmonolgy/ENT NP. So it's happening.


    I have worked with co worker who went to PA school and was an exceptional PA for a Cardiology practice that my mother went to. They were a great team of MDs, NPs, and PAs. As well as seen PAs on a surgical team, Hospitalist team, dermatology, Family practice, as well. Again, it's happening.

    The MD, NP, PA, Nursing, Therapist team is doing well. There are plenty of opportunities to go under an umbrella and practice...there is specifically no need to institute another umbrella.

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