Male Nurse Disgusted by Female Nurses - page 3

Hi Beth: I believe you submitted a recent article about Safe Patient/Nurse Ratios in this country. I have been a nurse for about one year and a half and I am appalled by what I have observed with... Read More

  1. by   Farawyn
    Quote from BostonFNP
    please stop all the petty politics among yourselves! Let's all come together as one body and push our legislators for change!! We are in the millions and we are in demand!! That is power!!

    Aside from his comments about disgusting girls (which we all know, most are infested with cooties) he did say this at the end. And he's absolutely right! We do need to put aside petty politics (just look at some of the responses). We do need to unify. We do need to push legislators and administrators. And we could have some serous power in numbers.
    Yes, I agree. But he was so off putting. The way you are saying it makes me want to burn my bra and march!
  2. by   sunny time
    This is in all businesses if it is mostly women. I am a woman and I absolutely hate working with women. I work ICU or a place where major work is done by me and I don't spend time at the desk. when I hear someone ripping someone apart, I leave. one time I stated the reason I did not eat lunch at the same time every one else did was because of the gossip. they ganged together and lied about an incident needless to say I was fired. women would rather whine and ***** about a situation rather than banding together. then put nonAmericans in the situation and you hear the ******** ing another language. these nurses are afraid to speak up because their money goes to other countries for family members. so they need their job. they keep their heads down and swallow all kinds of unequal treatment. This will not change. Sir, get more education and go into administration. I love nursing but hate the situation.
  3. by   Jerrysdogmommy
    This is why I left nursing. I love nursing; I cannot take the cattiness of it anymore. I have been group texted about by a charge nurse and her "groupies"; lied about where I was pulled into an office after three-overnight shifts and drilled by 5 managers, other nurses have looked into my charts and read my notes, charge and her buddies played hang-man on their iPhones while I was needing help with a patient (not critical) and asked but instead, they went out to smoke, it does not end. I do not understand why this behavior is allowed. When I tell others that do not work in nursing about this behavior that is allowed, they are in shock. I have been told my a family member that if this went on in their organization, this would be an automatic firing. Try gossiping/group texting at Microsoft, see where that leads to. HR's are in on it, managers are allowing it and it has destroyed a profession that I worked hard in and loved. No, I will not develop thicker skin because they I end up like one of them. I am sorry to all the patients that lose out because of this rotten behavior.
  4. by   WestCoastSunRN
    Quote from Potatoskins
    I would hope most women would not blame patriarchy if he fairly acquired a job in administration. It's sometimes hard to tell, but I personally would never blame inequality unless I had substantial proof it was true. Say a woman more eligible and more experienced is denied the job and it's given to a man with less experience/credentials, then I'd say "hey maybe this is inequality". Nursing doesn't have to be all women. It shouldn't be all women. I know many caring and compassionate men. If my boyfriend didn't pass out at the sight of blood he'd be an excellent nurse. I have five men in my nursing class. Four of them are amazing with patients and excellent at their jobs as techs and they'd make awesome administrators for change.
    This has been my experience as well. I absolutely welcome men into nursing. Men and women are different -- with each gender having strengths and weaknesses. And I think it's easier to have a positive and richer work culture where that diversity exists.

    And yes, patriarchy is alive and well and effects nursing -- which is why my hope is that more men coming on board will help steer the ship in a better direction. I realize this could happen for both "wrong" and "right" reasons, but that's how I think of it from a purely practical standpoint.

    No one should get higher pay or advancement opportunity because they have a penis, though. Fortunately that doesn't happen where I work.
  5. by   Farawyn
    Quote from sunny time
    This is in all businesses if it is mostly women. I am a woman and I absolutely hate working with women. I work ICU or a place where major work is done by me and I don't spend time at the desk. when I hear someone ripping someone apart, I leave. one time I stated the reason I did not eat lunch at the same time every one else did was because of the gossip. they ganged together and lied about an incident needless to say I was fired. women would rather whine and ***** about a situation rather than banding together. then put nonAmericans in the situation and you hear the ******** ing another language. these nurses are afraid to speak up because their money goes to other countries for family members. so they need their job. they keep their heads down and swallow all kinds of unequal treatment. This will not change. Sir, get more education and go into administration. I love nursing but hate the situation.
    Go to a FD where it is mostly men.
    It's the same crap.
    Don't put it all on women acting like this because they are women.
    Educate yourself as well. Ma'am.
  6. by   FreeSoul
    Oh dear ... Normally I am not big on commenting but when I read the words of this male nurse, I couldn't help. So the perpetrator has the audacity to criticize the victim. Dear, we live in a male-dominated world, in any profession, let alone healthcare! I have been nursing for 10 years in various settings from hospital to community to international work and I can confidently tell you, in ANY of these settings, if I cut my hair and become a male, I would 1) earn more respect 2) earn more money and 3) only need to work half as hard as my female colleague to prove myself. Just because I posed as someone who has a `p.n.s` Nice eh? I have been the head of unions on my units, I have teamed up with nurses, we spent endless time filling workload forms, we complained, we "put our foot down" but hey, it's a male-dominated world. I even see it among the doctors, the female ER physician is always criticized for any error she made while for a male physician, there is always a lame excuse, hey, his workload is high, or hey, it happens. You are a male and you are new in the profession, therefore the above is really hard for you to comprehend, but I would love you to write back to us if you consider posing as a prop for 1 month as a female nurse, I would like you to tell us how things have changed for you. Also remember, you are paid well as a nurse (let alone that you are paid more than your female counterparts simply bec you happen to be a male) because the same female nurses you deemed passive and backstabbing have teamed up sometime before (when you were still in middle school) and demanded that. They fought a lot of ugly battles, they got harassed, assaulted, and many of them lost their jobs because they stood up for what's right. But they did it and got us a better pay and more respect. We still have a long way to go, and we shall continue to fight our fight, not for people like you, but for the sanctity and sanity of this great profession of ours. So every time you cash your nice paycheck, don't you forget that. You owe the profession an apology.
  7. by   holisticallyminded
    Oh my, where do I start?
    The nursing collective as it appears to be referred to by many here is not much of a collective at all. Our common thread is our license. Aside from this, nursing is still very much a blue collar job with various points of entry for most, including various ways to travel up the ladder into management positions. We are pitted against each other from the start because many of us come from different educational backgrounds and bring a different perspective. This could be said of any group of workers but the difference is that we are making decisions about another human being and the stakes are higher. So we come in with different knowledge bases and practical life skills (nursing is often a second career these days) to contend with others who may not have much of either. This doesn't change with standard entry education because a nursing license and a nursing position is still fairly easy to obtain in comparison to jobs with similar requirements in other fields. A BS degree is a hell of a lot easier to come by these days than it was in previous decades, even if it costs more.
    After establishing that nursing is easier to take on than say, engineering, you have to actually look at the varied socioeconomic, ethnic and cultural backgrounds of nurses, in addition to their personal motivations. These vary so widely we could have an entire thread devoted to the topic. First generation immigrants may have a more difficult time standing up for themselves in the workplace generally, for fear of rocking the boat. Younger women may not have a sense of their own voices yet; for some nursing is even a first job. Older women may be trying to bide their time for retirement. Some, like myself, prioritize my job last in a long list of priorities so that I choose to work part-time per diem only to accommodate more important interests and obligations. I may not be close to retirement but I also don't need a full-time job.
    As for the victimhood of women that is so popular these days (and we've been through before- I remember the 90s)- views tend to be largely generational. I see a whole lot of Millenial and baby boomer women complaining out there but less of my own generation (does this have anything to do with the fact that gen X has been more financially successful than their parents?) But I also remember growing up in a world where we shucked off the feminism of our mothers and grandmothers since we believed (and I still do) that we were living in a world with plenty of opportunity for women for the taking. Those boomers were so angry at us for not appreciating them enough (though it was their mothers and grandmothers who really did the work). So interesting that their own children are now out protesting divisivesly with silly pink hats. I'm sorry but I can't get behind the neo-women's movement. I'm doing just fine and so are many, many women that I know. I have CHOICES.
    So forgive me if I do not believe that the way to change nursing is with collectivism, which is the new political rage these days. I haven't any issues standing up for myself, asking for better working conditions, speaking up in a meeting, standing my ground over an important issue, asking for more pay and GETTING it, refusing work, quitting my job, or letting another nurse know that they are WRONG. I have positioned myself so that I OWN my work and that is each individual's responsibility. If we had more personal accountability and less kowtowing, we might get somewhere. Having someone else hold a gun to the head of management (unions) gets "us" very little.
    Wanna change nursing? Change HEALTHCARE. No, I'm not talking about lobbying for more care for the sick, I'm talking about a wellness model. KEEP people well. Advocate for alternative therapies, promote naturopathy, clean food and water, advocate for livestock health and small farms, advocate for personal choice in healthcare, model wellness to your patients. We need to change the sickcare model. You work in an INDUSTRY that operates for PROFIT and it is no different than any other, I am sorry to say. Why would you expect any more? If you lobby your state officials, perhaps you should think bigger and stop worrying so much about teeny tiny changes that frighten the beast but keep him going.
    And on that note, I'm going for a run.
  8. by   feelix
    The female of the species shoots itself in the foot while trying to shoot her sisters. As a woman I have scoffed at how female nurses risk their licenses day in and day out and don't speak up. How they will outright tell you they are busy while the men will come out and help. Not all men make sexual advances on co-workers. Not all bosses want to pinch your behind for promotion. Let us women learn to take the blame for what we do to our sisters and consequently ourselves. Let us empower ourselves and stop blaming the rest of the world for our woes. After all, very few men would have a honey on the side if none of us agreed to that role.
  9. by   holisticallyminded
    Thanks Feelix, this man-hating "equality" business is absolutely ridiculous. People keep THEMSELVES down and nursing is hardly a patriarchy. Neo-feminism has become another way for the militant left to sink their claws into society.
    I wish I had time to tell my personal story. As a woman, listening to all of this political riff raff, I could put many voices to shame for what I have accomplished in my life based on my personal statistics. I am what I made myself: I blame no one and I take all the credit for every success.
  10. by   Farawyn
    Quote from feelix
    The female of the species shoots itself in the foot while trying to shoot her sisters. As a woman I have scoffed at how female nurses risk their licenses day in and day out and don't speak up. How they will outright tell you they are busy while the men will come out and help. Not all men make sexual advances on co-workers. Not all bosses want to pinch your behind for promotion. Let us women learn to take the blame for what we do to our sisters and consequently ourselves. Let us empower ourselves and stop blaming the rest of the world for our woes. After all, very few men would have a honey on the side if none of us agreed to that role.
    How do we do that, if many men are still pinching butts and making sexual advances?
    Or, is speaking up when this does happen not empowering ourselves?

    As for the men and the "honeys"?
    Maybe HE is the honey.
  11. by   Farawyn
    Quote from holisticallyminded
    Thanks Feelix, this man-hating "equality" business is absolutely ridiculous. People keep THEMSELVES down and nursing is hardly a patriarchy. Neo-feminism has become another way for the militant left to sink their claws into society.
    I wish I had time to tell my personal story. As a woman, listening to all of this political riff raff, I could put many voices to shame for what I have accomplished in my life based on my personal statistics. I am what I made myself: I blame no one and I take all the credit for every success.
    No one is talking about Hate.
    Equality does not mean that.
  12. by   GaryRay
    I've been frustrated by this more than once... or twice.... or fifty times. I've learned the whole "Power to the People" "If we all take a stance they have to listen" thing just doesn't work. Too many nurses are ambitious and will use this to label you as a trouble maker to climb over you to the top.

    I learned early on Washington has it all wrong. The problem with healthcare can't be solved with legislation. There are just too many women in too small of a space... they could probably solve a lot of healthcare problems by giving us cubicles so we didn't have to work on top of each other.

    That being said the best way to cut down (not eliminate lets have realistic expectations) cattiness is through retention activities. Get everyone together outside the unit, try to plan things that different people will appreciate when various groups can attend. Give incentives for attending and try to make child care arrangements (maybe someone's teenagers watch the other coworkers' little ones), if people are hosting things at their homes be careful to rotate so everyone feels welcome to avoid cliques.

    Here's the hard part... garner a relationship and report between night and day shift. Often night shift feels left out of all of this stuff. its always in the middle of the day when they are sleeping, unit parties are held by leadership and they leave out the food " for night shift to enjoy too" they don't want your 12 hour old leftovers, they just end up throwing it all away and ******** about having to clean up after day shift, bring fresh treats for the night crew to show both groups they are appreciated, plan events around 5-8 so it can be convenient for everyone, schedule meetings before night shift or after day shift, no one wants to come in on their day off at 7 am... they will only be at that meeting if they are just getting off work, they are much likely to come in and participate on a day off if it is in the evening when they were up already.

    As far as the ratios go, this will depend a lot on the type of hospital you work in and the state you are in. Magnet hospitals have shared governance so join the committee. Don't just complain, suggest solutions. Create a paper trail to get administration's attention. Hit them where it counts... their wallets.

    I once got sick of pre shift huddle because after huddle everyone sat around until after 7 then wandered out to get report. I never left work until after 8... drove me crazy! I did the math to show them a conservative estimate of how much the huddle was costing the unit a year in unnecessary overtime. We could have onboarded 2 nurses or paid the salary for an additional support staff member. They started paging out the huddle information.

    Another nurse got sick of our lipid bags leaking, he wrote a safety report for every nurse on the unit when any lipid bag leaked and had to be replaced (about 3-5 a night) wrapped each bag in a biohazard bag with a patient label and sent it to pharmacy administration. After a month the issue had the attention of the CNO, and after 2 months we had new tubing that didn't leak.

    I would gather some data on clabsi, cauti, fall, hapu, employee turnover, and overtime due to call ins at your hospital compared to other area hospitals with better ratios. Compare those costs (and they are all REALLY high) to that of onboarding (around half the nurses yearly salary) and pay for the additional nurses needed to have proper ratios. Also look into what your company spends on contract staff. Lower ratios would lead to higher retention rates and mitigate the need for travelers and contract employees.

    There is only so much you can do and change never happens over night, make sure to join the ANA and your state Nurses association, your member dues go toward lobbying for these very issues and more. All else fails, thats the beauty of nursing... go work somewhere else... I hear California is nice.
  13. by   Farawyn
    Cali is not very pro vaccine.

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