Jehovah's Witness nurses in the critical care unit? - Page 16Register Today!
- Jan 1, '11 by Belle EpoqueQuote from DoGoodThenGoBut like nurses, pharmacists are also regulated health professionals and have moral obligations in return for the trust given them by society, regardless of whether they are hospital employees or self employed individuals.Will give you that, things are going to vary on the ground according to what type and or sort of healthcare "worker" or provider we are speaking about.
Pharmacists running their own stores are not the same as nurses or doctors for that matter, employed by a facility/hospital.
A hospital's first and foremost duty is to the patient and his/her safety. Refusing a direct order to provide care under one's scope of practice can open you up to anything from being written up for insurbordination, and or termination. Each of these choices can also expose the nurse in question to legal action (patient and or facility), and perhaps a report to the state BON.
They are still obligated to act in the best interest of and advocate for the patient, observe the law, uphold the dignity of the profession and practice in accordance with ethical principles and their standards of practice. Instead these pharmacists are allowing their own personal biases to interfere with the code of ethics they promised to uphold when they signed up to be a pharmacist in the first place. Refusing to dispense that pill is in the best interest of the pharmacist, NOT necessarily the best interest of the patient. That is just plain wrong, and I hope that ruling is upheld.
- Quote from ocnrn63transfusions require verification by two licensed persons: 2 rns, an rn and an np, pa or md all work. in the latter case, the np, pa or md wouldn't be hanging the blood or "pressing the button" because they have other responsibilities. so the nurse had better be prepared to do so.actually, it's immaterial.
transfusions require the verification of blood by two nurses. your critical care scenario doesn't pass muster because there would be at least one nurse in the scenario who could hang the blood. the one who objected to hanging the blood could still verify the blood.
i'd be interested to see if anyone could come up with an actual case where someone died as a result of a jw nurse not hanging blood on a patient. no hypothetical scenarios, i mean a real case of a patient death.
i am not advocating one way or the other. i am only talking about what i have experienced in my own career. it's certainly not workable if there is not cooperation on all sides. personally, i wouldn't go into areas where transfusions are highly likely if i didn't feel comfortable giving them. there are too many misconceptions out there to have to work around, and it could lead to difficulties with co-workers.
last night i hung 103 units of products on my patient -- we had two nurses and an md working on her at all times. if one of the nurses had not been willing to spike the blood -- whichever of us was on the side of the bed that had the nearly empty blood bag -- we would have fallen seriously behind. since she was bleeding upwards of a liter an hour, a delay in transfusing would have been critical.
i don't know any jehovah's witness nurses personally, but i can assure you that i have no interest in working with someone who will not hang blood and monitor the transfusion -- for any reason. if you're not willing to do so, you do not belong in a critical care unit.
- Quote from cutekittenjcome back and talk to us when you have some actual critical care nursing experience. i can guarantee you that if someone is bleeding liters/hour not having a transfusion in a timely matter may cause them to die. your life experience is interesting, but not meaningful to this discussion.hey thanks for the question. it actually happened to me first hand. they asked if i wanted a blood transfusion and i refused because i hate receiving blood that is not my own. they told me i would die if i didn't get one and i was like you can just use fluids. and when i needed one they gave me fluids to expand my blood it worked out really well because i didn't die like they said i would. now on a sad note i had a cousin who received blood(said he would die without one) and he was allergic to it and died even though he had one.
so i do see your point and understand why people my feel uncomfy about the whole thing but my i think you whatever a person believe in should not go against their religion. i do understand both sides of it and your point but for someone to say that a person will die without one is unreasonable and it is unreasonable for someone not to work at a certain place for what they believe in and for people to encourage them to something contrary to what they believe is right. kinda see where i'm going?(and not knocking what you said in no way because i do see where you are coming from but just having real life experience on the exact opposite on a blood transfusion not working for my cousin has me thinking how good are the blood transfusions really)
- Quote from cutekittenjthere are ccus that are actually critical care units, and there are ccus in smaller hospitals who actually don't get that many critical patients. sounds as if you work in the latter. believe me, it would be an issue in the former.this is definitely a sensitive topic because of all the different views and you bring out good points. however it really is a shame to say that jw's can't be nurses b/c they are great nurses. i honestly don't agree with a lot of the comments saying they need to choice a different profession because nursing isn't all about blood transfusions. i love people really do care about their patients but i'm sure a jw would too they just don't want to transfuse blood. it really isn't that big of a deal to find someone else(especially in a ccu) to help out with that. the reason i say this because ccu is all about team work or at least on my floor. we help each other out. hasn't been a problem on our floor with the jw not administering blood. since we are all aware of that we make adjustments. we help her out and when we need something she helps us out. i do understand how you feel but i understand where the person who came up with this thread is coming from.
- Jan 1, '11 by CrazierThanYouI am trying to imagine myself in an emergency situation, where every second counts and in the middle of all the hustle and bustle saying "Oh sorry, I can't spike this bag. You'll have to find someone else". I just cannot imagine it.
- Aug 22 by msr91331If you hang blood or start the administration of it is really a conscious matter. You are not the one that is accepting the transfusion but your the one who is obeying a legally authorized order. If you worked at a market and someone wanted to buy Cigarettes would you refuse to sell them, probably not, but if you wouldn't necessarily work in a cigarette shop where all you do is sell them. Now it is different if your working in a place where all they do is take blood for transfusion or administer it. If it is your choice not to administer blood it is your personal decision and it is not the position of the organization. There was a watchtower article that asked could you work for a company that paints businesses and they are contracted to paint a church does that mean you have to quit, not necessarily but you wouldn't work for the church exclusively.
- Oct 10 by imaginarycardinalThere are many hospitals that are developing bloodless programs or that are even going bloodless altogether as an institution. Due to the added expense and complications from blood use, much research is now geared toward blood alternatives. In fact, the only reason why blood alternatives are not more commonly offered is because physicians are just not informed or trained in this area. For those who are, it is often considered the "gold standard". Just keep looking. Remember that we as nurses have the same rights as patients. Do not let anyone coerced you to do things that are against your personal belief system. Also refrain from using the statement "because I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses I cannot do _____". Rather it is because you have made a conscientious decision based on your relationship with God and careful study of His word. I am doing research myself about this issue because I do not see that there is a definitive Bible-based answer to your decision.
- Oct 10 by PMFB-RNQuote from imaginarycardinal*** This is VERY simple. If one chooses not to preform the normal and expected duties of a position they shouldn't apply for such a position. I would suggest to PETA member that they not apply for jobs in slaughter houses, Jews and Muslims from job on pig farms, etc.Remember that we as nurses have the same rights as patients. Do not let anyone coerced you to do things that are against your personal belief system. Also refrain from using the statement "because I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses I cannot do _____". Rather it is because you have made a conscientious decision based on your relationship with God and careful study of His word. I am doing research myself about this issue because I do not see that there is a definitive Bible-based answer to your decision.
If one chooses to apply and work in an ICU then they should be willing to preform the normal and expected duties of that job. Simple as that.
I have zero sympathy for any nurse who refuses to administer blood who also chose to work in an environment where it is a normal and expected task.
- Oct 10 by GrnTeaQuote from msr91331If you hang blood or start the administration of it is really a conscious matter.
Conscious = awake
Conscience = that little voice that asks, "What's that gonna cost me?"
I do hope that if you're giving blood it's a conscious matter. I'd like to think you couldn't do it in your sleep. Or is it like with Ambien, where people eat and drive and do all sorts of stuff in their sleep? Has anyone ever hung blood in their sleep? I've done it when I was really, really tired, but still ... conscious.