Gender biasing by MD's - page 2
Ever notice how MD's treat male and female nurses differently? Example: 2nd day on the renal ranch for me, see the renal guy around before so we knew who each other was, i had my assignment, he wrote... Read More
Oct 25, '01I happen to agree with your nursing instructor Craig. It is true that men seem to get more respect professionally than women, and there is not much to do about it, and honestly it doesnt bother me much. I do feel as though a Doc will turn to the nurse he knows and trusts first. Which is understandable, I would do the same.
I also think that a male Doc will turn to a male nurse first, because men think the same. I think a woman Doc would turn to a male nurse because they think differently, and lets face it girls, we are complex beings, when you talk to another woman even on a professional level, you are wondering what kind of layers you may have to scratch through before you reach her..We are balls of emotion and mood capable of almost any response at any time, we can cop an attitude at the drop of a hat. Men arent like this.
I am also very glad to have men in the profession,, I could enjoy looking at an ass that isn't wrinkled and broke down...lol!
Oct 26, '01I may get a few angry responses to this but...
One reason I think that male nurses get more "respect" from doctors is the attitude they go into it with. Female nurses frequently seem affraid to call or suggest an order because they might get "yelled" at. If a male nurse gets yelled at he takes the initative and makes his point that this is not acceptable. Male nurses tend to makes requests or suggestions with a firm authoritative voice than a more submissive one. Male nurses tend to be more confrontative and willing to fight for their respect.
I say this because I have found that female nurses willing to stand up and be authoritative are rarely treated poorly by doctors, and males who tend to be less sure of themselves get walked all over.
Just my POV.
You may flame me now.
Oct 26, '01....where i worked (in my country)..the female nurses are respected by the doctors..
.like in A&E (ER)..the female nurses are potential, they work harder and doctors rely on the female nurse because they do the work in a more profession way...where as the male nurses (in hospital) are lazy this is in my country....
but for the otho, the doctors love the male nurses ....
Oct 26, '01Matt, I think you're absolutely correct.
Male nurses (most) always speak with confidence and authority. Women (sickens me to admit this) timid and begging. This whole issue amazes me. I have that deep (sexy :P), smoker's voice, that is at times, confusing to distinguish sex. I am also (this will surprise ya'll), pretty confident. I rarely have a problem with a doc over the phone when calling for orders, but I AM more likely to have a problem in person. Is it my pure beauty or my sex?
I LOVE having men in nursing. Yes, it sickens me to see the difference in how male and female nurses are treated differently, but it also sickens me that in the year 2001, women are still submissive and ALLOW this behavior. Men will continue to improve nursing because THEY will not tolerate the attitudes that we, as girls, are taught to accept.
Oct 26, '01I have read this thread with great interest. While I am still a student, I find this "gender biasing" kind of backward. Since nursing is still a predominently female profession, it seems strange that males would get more respect. Way back when, the male nurse was viewed as "feminine" by much of society (not me, have a very good friend who is a male nurse and is definetely not "feminine", not that it would make any difference to me as long as he was a good nurse!) so I'm wondering why the change has come about. I think that it is fascinating and wondering why this change is happening.
Oct 26, '01this must be a worldwide problem, same things happening here.
Not just doctors treating male nurses different, patients do it too.
Here the male nurses even have a more professionel name; they are called Pfleger (means male nurse) and we are called Schwester (which means sister).
Yes sure, historical grown name etc. papapa........ I know!
But still, it's not ok, but what to do?
Oct 26, '01Matt, I also agree with you. In fact, I read a study some time ago-can't remember where-that communication differences in men & women are exactly the way you describe. It was not referring to nurses specifically, but men & women as a whole. Women tend to be timid, preface requests with "please" or a "sorry to bother you" & in a submissive tone. Men speak directly and with authority-they expect their "request" to be met and it shows in their tone of voice.
One other characteristic the study mentioned is that women tend to qualify their opinon with something like-"It's just my opinion", where men do not. This is a form of "apologizing" in case the listener doesn't agree with said "opinion". I find it interesting that 2 of the male nurses here-Matt & Dave-both ended their strong statements with such a qualifier. Maybe you guys have been hanging with us female RNs too long!
Oct 26, '01OK I just have to say I have never sounded timid or submissive in my entre life! But I have noticed that nurses like me (who won't tolerate crap from other nurses or docs and are female) get a bad label, whereas a male nurse who does it is being an advocate for his patients. Do I care? Not really... I have grown in to the sh*t disturber label and like it just fine.
I think the problem may have to do with how women act, but I also think the problem has to do with how we are "supposed" to act and how we are viewed. There was a discussion a while ago about how female nurses are catty and overemotional and submissive, which to me is a pretty broad generalization, but it seems to be a very common view. To me it suggests that right away when we meet other female nurses we think they'll be more catty and emotional than a male one, so of course we treat men differently.
Oct 26, '01Originally posted by fergus51
OK I just have to say I have never sounded timid or submissive in my entre life! But I have noticed that nurses like me (who won't tolerate crap from other nurses or docs and are female) get a bad label.
Oct 26, '01Originally posted by Sundowner
... and lets face it girls, we are complex beings, when you talk to another woman even on a professional level, you are wondering what kind of layers you may have to scratch through before you reach her...
sorry couldn't resist.
Oct 26, '01Originally posted by Susy K
Fergus - I knew I liked you! I think we are very similar in this regard.
Oct 26, '01There certainly is Bias!!! The doctors show bias to those nurses who "KNOW HOW" to do their job and then "DO IT" regardless of gender. Never had a problem with a doc.
Oct 26, '01One other characteristic the study mentioned is that women tend to qualify their opinon with something like-"It's just my opinion", where men do not. This is a form of "apologizing" in case the listener doesn't agree with said "opinion". I find it interesting that 2 of the male nurses here-Matt & Dave-both ended their strong statements with such a qualifier. Maybe you guys have been hanging with us female RNs too long!
When I end my statement with "Just my opinion". What I am really saying is "if you don't like it, too damn bad"
Just my opinion