Four years for an associates? - page 3

So this is my first year in college, and I signed up for general ed classes at my local community college. In the middle of the semester, I decided I wanted to be a nurse, but unfortunately I didn't... Read More

  1. by   caliotter3
    Agree with llg. Even quicker is to find an accelerated BSN program or one of the entry level MS programs with the BSN opt out option in case your circumstances change. Start looking into the nurse anesthesia programs you are interested in now so that you can find out their requirements and start making tentative plans. Good luck.
  2. by   Tweety
    Quote from nozyrozy40
    At a CC, the ADN is set up for 2 years. You do your pre-reqs (A&P, PSY, etc) at the same time you are doing your nursing core courses. It is actually a much more intense program. Most people are not able to do this, therefore they take another year or two to spread these courses out. You need to check out the requirements and time table for the ADN or BSN at the college of your choice.

    My school was set up to be done in two years as well. There were no pre-reqs. We had one person, only one do it in two years. She took English, A&P, Socialiogy, and Nursing all at once and made it through it two years. The rest of us with jobs and kids took our time.

    That's not how it is everywhere. Many schools are requiring pre-reqs for a year, then two years of nursing courses
  3. by   ByTheLake
    Not all schools have these issues. My school did not have a waiting list. Either you were in the top so-many number of applicants, or you weren't. No waiting list nonsense. They started new classes each semester, not just once a year. Finally, I was able to take all pre-req's in one semester (18 hours, A&P I, Micro, Eng and Math) and then do the nursing classes in another 4 semesters plus a 12-week summer session. Of course, not many people did it that way. Most people did take a loooong time to finish because they wanted it to be easier, so they too very light course loads and took every single class they possibly could before applying for the nursing program. Not me. I'm too impatient to do 3-6 hours a semester for most of the rest of my life! LOL!

    Of course, I wasn't supposed to take all those Bio classes at once, but no one checked to make sure I'd taken the A&P before the Micro so I got away with it. It was one heck of a wild ride, and I did end up having to take one extra semester to graduate, but that was because we moved 4 hours away for dh's job, not because of nursing school itself!

    But I do have to say that IF I'd had to deal with silly waiting lists, long waits to apply/get in, and possibly 4 years of school for an ADN, I probably would have gone the BSN route instead. I'm glad I did it the way I did--get ADN first, start working, and then have my hospital system pay for me to get my BSN while they pay me to work for the same pay I'd get if I'd taken 2 more years to get my BSN on my own dime ;-)
  4. by   GadgetRN71
    Quote from llg
    Actually, that's not true anymore at a lot of Community Colleges. That's the way it was supposed to be, but a lot of schools now require that you take prerequisite course prior to even applying to the nursing program. If you are accepted into the nursing program (which may involve a waiting list), the required nursing courses require 4 additional semesters to complete because they must be taken in sequence.

    That's what some of us feel is very wrong. Even the best student going full time can not possibly compete the program in 2 years -- and if there is a waiting list for the nursing courses, it can easily take 4 years.

    Some schools even encourage their waiting nursing students to take extra classes and to retake classes to boost their GPA's in hopes of being moved up the waiting lists -- in the meantime, collecting the tuition money all the while.
    And the sad thing is, many schools go by a "first come, first served" basis to get students off of the waiting list. Your GPA has nothing to do with it. The CC I graduated from did this for a long time, but the quality of student was taking a sharp nosedive, so they're trying to get back to performance based admissions, as it should be. That probably sounds elitist, but when you have students who can't do 5th grade math and have poor reading skills taking up seats in a program, it's really not fair to anyone on the long run. The school is more than happy to take your money, they don't care if you flunk out.
  5. by   lindarn
    Quote from WitchyRN
    And the sad thing is, many schools go by a "first come, first served" basis to get students off of the waiting list. Your GPA has nothing to do with it. The CC I graduated from did this for a long time, but the quality of student was taking a sharp nosedive, so they're trying to get back to performance based admissions, as it should be. That probably sounds elitist, but when you have students who can't do 5th grade math and have poor reading skills taking up seats in a program, it's really not fair to anyone on the long run. The school is more than happy to take your money, they don't care if you flunk out.
    I find it had to believe that individuals are admitted to a nursing program by a "first come, first served" basis. This is not a deli in the supermarket. I have never heard of Physical Therapy, Ocupational Therapy, Pharmacy, Medical School, Law School, etc., admitting students on a "first come, first served", basis. They are admitted on the basis of their HS, and College pre-requisite class grades, and on the scores from the standardized tests- SAT, ACT, GRE, MCATS, LSATS, etc.

    This does nothing but denigrate the profession, and hold us in a lower esteem, than we already are. Please spare me the, "Nurses are the number one profession to the public". We hold that esteemed position because we allow everyone to push us around, and continue to work for far less than our education, responsibility, and accountability should allow us.

    Admitting students who are not truly qualified for the profession, either intelluctually, or personnally, does nothing but drag us down. And make alot of money for the school when these people drop out.

    Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
    Spokane, Washington
    Last edit by lindarn on Nov 25, '07
  6. by   llg
    Quote from lindarn
    I find it had to believe that individuals are admitted to a nursing program by a "first come, first served" basis. This is not a deli in the supermarket. I have never heard of Physical Therapy, Ocupational Therapy, Pharmacy, Medical School, Law School, etc., admitting students on a "first come, first served", basis. They are admitted on the basis of their HS, and College pre-requisite class grades, and on the scores from the standardized tests- SAT, ACT, GRE, MCATS, LSATS, etc.
    .

    Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
    Spokane, Washington
    The schools that operate on a "first come, first served" basis are almost always Community Colleges whose charters requires that they accept all students who are legal residents of their tax-paying community and meet a minimum standard requirement for the College as a whole (e.g. "C" average in high school.) Their stated purpose as a school often involves that of providing opportunities for entry-level education for students for whom a 4-year college/university is beyond their reach academically as well as financially.

    Traditionally, the foci, purposes, and legal charters of many community colleges are quite different from those of research universities and other colleges and universities that place more emphasis on the higher academic realm. It has only been in recent years that an increasing number of Community Colleges are thinking of themselves in more academic terms.
  7. by   Plagueis
    Quote from llg
    The schools that operate on a "first come, first served" basis are almost always Community Colleges whose charters requires that they accept all students who are legal residents of their tax-paying community and meet a minimum standard requirement for the College as a whole (e.g. "C" average in high school.) Their stated purpose as a school often involves that of providing opportunities for entry-level education for students for whom a 4-year college/university is beyond their reach academically as well as financially.

    Traditionally, the foci, purposes, and legal charters of many community colleges are quite different from those of research universities and other colleges and universities that place more emphasis on the higher academic realm. It has only been in recent years that an increasing number of Community Colleges are thinking of themselves in more academic terms.
    The local community college here does have an open admission policy, just like the "first come, first served" basis that you mentioned, except for the nursing program. In order to even apply for that program, a student needs a 3.0 gpa in the nursing prereqs and a score of 75 or higher on the NET.
  8. by   GadgetRN71
    Just recently, this CC decided to go back to performance based admissions. When I finally got in, there was no standardized test, and they most certainly did not look at your gpa(mine was a 3.85). At one point, I was talking with an advisor and I asked why they didn't do performance based admissions. He told me that "people would be protesting on the steps of the State house" if they did.

    This school had previously had an excellent pass rate for the NCLEX and had a good reputation for graduating good nurses-but, this is in the old days where you had to pass an entrance exam and have good grades. The pass rate for the NCLEX took a turn for the worse, and the dosage teachers and nursing instructors are getting people in the classes who can't do simple things like multiply or divide. So, they are on track to bring back the old way. You now have to have at least a B in Physiology to get in, and I think They do a standardized test as well. And funny, no one is protesting on the steps of the State House either!!
  9. by   LuckyMe2g
    You have to ask yourself...are many people really getting their BSN in only four years? I honestly don't know, but when I was getting my first BS degree (non-nursing) I was the only person I knew who graduated in just four years. It seems to me that the BS degree in general takes longer than 4 years. There are so many gen ed courses plus all the science pre-reqs for nursing school I don't see how anyone could do it start to finish in 4 years.

    So, the ADN takes 3-4 years to get. My guess is that the BSN takes 5-6 years to get in reality for people who take a normal load. So I don't think it's really fair to say "Why is my ADN taking as long as a BSN" I'm sure it varies on area..in my area there are a few differences in the pre-reqs for ADN vs BSN and it would take longer to do all the pre-reqs for the BSN.

    For the record, I'm about to enter a ADN degree program so I'm not knocking it at all. :spin: I think it really depends on individual goals and circumstances.
  10. by   queenjean
    Quote from llg
    The schools that operate on a "first come, first served" basis are almost always Community Colleges whose charters requires that they accept all students who are legal residents of their tax-paying community and meet a minimum standard requirement for the College as a whole (e.g. "C" average in high school.) Their stated purpose as a school often involves that of providing opportunities for entry-level education for students for whom a 4-year college/university is beyond their reach academically as well as financially.

    Traditionally, the foci, purposes, and legal charters of many community colleges are quite different from those of research universities and other colleges and universities that place more emphasis on the higher academic realm. It has only been in recent years that an increasing number of Community Colleges are thinking of themselves in more academic terms.

    That is not quite true in our area. In our state, anyhow. There are four tiers. First tier are people who live in that county. Second tier are people who live in adjacent counties. Third, people who do not live in adjacent counties, but are not served by a nursing program. Fourth, all others.

    BEFORE the tier system kicks in, though, all applicants are evaluated on their entrance exams, grade point averages, and interview. A person in the county with a borderline gradepoint average, average entrance exam scores, and an average interview is not going to get in before someone with an excellent gradepoint average, top entrance scores and a great interview who doesn't live in that county. But if there is a "tie" they are going to go then to the tier system.

    I explored this fairly thoroughly when I was applying to schools, because I didn't live in a county with a community college. I had high scores and a great GPA, and I got into every program to which I applied. People who just met the requirements and had county residency were on the waiting lists.

    I assume this varies from state to state, or even county to county. But the residency-favoritism, "first come, first serve" admissions policy is not entirely accurate in my experience.
  11. by   queenjean
    It took me probably probably almost four years to do my ADN--maybe closer to three and a half.

    But every semester was part time. Even the "full time" ADN nursing program was three days a week--meaning I could work or be home as a mom on four days a week. Every BSN program I explored would require 5 days a week of classes (maybe not all day every day, but a significant time commitment), not leaving me enough time to work, be a mom, and do homework.

    I have a previous degree. The accelerated BSN course that was available was an hour away, and it was full time for a year-all day, 5 days a week.

    The ADN was the cheapest route for me. The cost per credit hour was significantly lower. The over-all time commitment was less. I could work (and therefore our family had health insurance) and still be a good mom. I do plan on getting my BSN, and all I have to do is take a couple more classes. I've completed all the prerequs, between my previous bachelors and my ADN prerequs.

    I think that every program has its advantages and disadvantages. If you go into the ADN thinking that you can do it in two years when in fact you can't, you didn't do your research, and it's your own fault. CCs and other colleges shouldn't be deceptive in their advertising, either, but you ultimately are responsible for doing your research about which program will fit your pocketbook, your lifestyle, and your academic needs.
    Last edit by queenjean on Nov 26, '07 : Reason: typo
  12. by   LeavingTeaching4RN
    Quote from LuckyMe2g
    You have to ask yourself...are many people really getting their BSN in only four years? I honestly don't know, but when I was getting my first BS degree (non-nursing) I was the only person I knew who graduated in just four years. It seems to me that the BS degree in general takes longer than 4 years. There are so many gen ed courses plus all the science pre-reqs for nursing school I don't see how anyone could do it start to finish in 4 years.

    So, the ADN takes 3-4 years to get. My guess is that the BSN takes 5-6 years to get in reality for people who take a normal load. So I don't think it's really fair to say "Why is my ADN taking as long as a BSN" I'm sure it varies on area..in my area there are a few differences in the pre-reqs for ADN vs BSN and it would take longer to do all the pre-reqs for the BSN.

    For the record, I'm about to enter a ADN degree program so I'm not knocking it at all. :spin: I think it really depends on individual goals and circumstances.
    You make a good point. I completed my first BS in 4 years but my school had a mandatory summer school requirement. Without, attending over the summer, it would have taken longer.

    In fact, I know it wasn't the norm for students at my university to graduate in 4 years because the school had a hugh "Take 15, don't delay your dream" campaign to encourage students to graduate.
  13. by   llg
    Quote from LuckyMe2g
    You have to ask yourself...are many people really getting their BSN in only four years? I honestly don't know, but when I was getting my first BS degree (non-nursing) I was the only person I knew who graduated in just four years. It seems to me that the BS degree in general takes longer than 4 years. There are so many gen ed courses plus all the science pre-reqs for nursing school I don't see how anyone could do it start to finish in 4 years.
    .
    The desired standard for higher education in the United States (all disciplines, not just nursing) is 4 years of full time study for a Bachelor's Degrees. That's why athletes have only 4 years of competition eligibility and standard undergraduate scholarships are only 4 years. Colleges and Universities track their statistics on both graduation rate and time and get concerned when too many people are taking longer than 4 years. Results are published in surveys, etc. and become a source of embarrassment and controversy for the school when they can't produce a 4-year graduate. Of course, some people do take longer for a wide variety of reasons ... but, the desired standard is 4 years or 8 semesters of full time study.

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