Foreign recruitment of nurses-thoughts? - page 2

I posted this in another section inadvertantly. How do you feel about foreign recruitment of nurses to deal with the nursing shortage. As stated in other post, forgive me if this topic has been... Read More

  1. by   mrh1953
    I don't think it's fair to "steal" nurses from other nations. There is a *worldwide* shortage of active (working) nurses. It is fine for nurses to practice where they wish, but active recruitment of Irish nurses, for example, to get them to come to the U.S. is a disservice to Ireland.

    And ultimately it's a disservice to us ALL because, as so many have said here, it's the CONDITIONS that need humongous improvement.

    "If you build it, they will come." If staffing ratios, hours, shifts, attitudes, etc. ever fall into line, there will be no shortage. All those myriad nurses out there who are currently "inactive" (myself included) will return in droves. Treat us like valuable workers with varied working needs--not like interchangeable machines--and the rest will follow.

    Do ANY DONs and other hospital administrators *ever* read this BB???? Do they talk to each other about the real issues?

    If a tree falls in the forest and there's no one there to hear it...

    Margaret
  2. by   frankie
    The nursing shortage problem will not be solved with importing nurses. The nursing shortage problem will not be solved until nurses are compensated as other professionals are compensated. Why pay a hiring bonus/pay shcool loans for "new" nurses/ import nurses when seasoned, high quality, smart, experienced bedside nurses get a 50 cent raise for the 25 years contributed to patient care? I vote no to foreign nurses.
  3. by   tonicareer
    Hey I'm in the US and can't get any financial aid at all. I don't understand the idea of paying so much money to bring foreign nurses here or potential students and paying their way. Duh I am taking one or two classes at a time (science stuff) and trying to figure out how to pay for nursing classes, clinicals, books, lab fees, uniforms ect.. What is wrong with these hospitals? Do they think these foreign nurses will be like indentured servants? If they pay them less than US nurses there will be lawsuits about their rights. If they don't know English how will they communicate vital information and read charts and medications? It takes a long time to really learn to speak and read a new language. Also paying their living expenses is ridiculous, when students from US can't get even tuition money. Where will they go to school? There are 700 applicants for 50 slots. Will they be in the school not having to meet the steep requirements for SAT scores, prereqs and other test scores? How will they check on criminal histories and drug arrests? Personally I find it frightening that I might be a patient in a hospital with caregivers that are poorly trained. It makes no sense to me.
  4. by   karenG
    I am in England- and we are facing a nursing shortage- and nurses are being recruited from all over the place! At the same time, there are loads of ads for jobs in the states- offering great pay and reallocation packages. I do think that the problem is retainment to some extend- the pay is awful here. the last class to graduate locally lost 10 newly qualified nurses to the police force because they are paying 10000 / yr more! child care provision is also a joke- the shift system is not child friendly. so lots of issues that need a long term solution, not a quick fix. Unfortunately, the powers that be are looking short term and so the problem will continue.

    Karen
  5. by   Dr. Kate
    One reason hospitals offer so much to foreign nurses is they are willing to sign long term contracts. Most American nurses won't do that.
  6. by   fergus51
    Plus it is way more expensive to pay for an American nurses training. My tuition in Canada was about 800$ American per semester or less. The American colleges I looked at were MUCH more expensive.
  7. by   tonicareer
    So should I move to Canada and go to school and then come back to the states? Gee whiz I still don't get the idea of recruiting that costs tons of money to bring people from overseas. Just because a foreign nurse signs a contract means nothing. They don't have to stick to it. So they get the free education and living expenses while in school and then disappear across the country, or go to England or back home. How are the hospitals going to stop that? Maybe the public should be aware of this. Hey in 5 years there will be news programs about poorly trained foreign nurses and tons of lawsuits. They will put them in fast paced programs and work them to death. They won't have the proper training. Patients will not get proper care. It won't work.
  8. by   fergus51
    toni, I don't think most are supported while in school like that exactly. I don't know anyone in my niece's class who has this kind of deal, even though many of them are planning on moving to the US after they are done. There are incentives like signing bonuses, help with liscensing and moving money, but these are also available to US nurses. The only difference is that they can also get help with immigration. Most of these nurses will fulfill their contracts if they want to have the immigration help.

    I am also hesitant to go along with your idea that there will be tons of lawsuits because of poorly trained foreign nurses, especially those coming from countries like Great Britain and Canada where the training is so similar to the US. I have not seen foreign nurses (from Phillipines, GB, Australia, N.Zealand, Nepal or India) give worse care to their patients than I do and I have worked with a fair number of them.
  9. by   tonicareer
    I think you missed out on the original thread which stated that they would be recruited to the US to attend school here and have all tuition and living expenses paid for. If this is true it is not fair to people who live here and can't get financial aid even for tuition. If these recruits are given free tuition and room and board who is paying for it? The hospitals( where do they get it from profits) or the government(we taxpayers). I'm sure some foreign nurses do a great job. But why have taxpayers and profits train nonAmericans when so many people here want to go to school.
  10. by   healthyone
    I totally agree with ALL the sentiments against training oriental nurses to come here...they are unfriendly and unkind and inflexible when working with patients!!! Their nsg skills and manner does not impress me at all. It's awful! In ICU at my hospital, there were so many of them working different shifts that the patients began freaking out, literally! They were so mean and task-oriented that the patients didn't even know where they were anymore! I don't know how the hospital plans to explain this unacceptable care level to their cleints...will they excuse it away because their eyes are slanted and they are from foreign lands? Would they explain away poor care given from a North American nurse? NO WAY.

    I feel that American women should be trained FOR FREE from all of the different cultural backgrounds to support the needs of it's people. White, Black, Hispanic women (and others) from different walks of life.

    I can attest to the fact from my own experience that if i had any kind of financial assistance, i could have made the decision to retrain in nursing years ago. Instead now I am financing myself on pitons wages and have already started to suffer the social ills of a below-poverty-line income--infrequent dental visits, weight gain due to sub-optimal diet and lack of regular excercise, stress from worrying about financial woes, mounting debt. Who's the one living in a 3rd country now? The sacrifices we are making to go back to nursing (especailly the 30+ crowd) go sadly unnoticed and un-rewarded.

    I think it's frightening that the US is simply allowing these oriental women to come here from unknown walks of life (good or highly questionable) and dump them on the public, without speaking english, without training for assimilation into this culture, and with complete indifference about the needs of the country's people. how appauling!

    Trust me, these countries, would never bend over backwards like this for american people. I think petitions need to be started to stop the madness and to promote training of majority and ethnic groups native to america.

    Signed,
    frustrated and just barely coping
  11. by   tonicareer
    You made some good points healthy one. Everyone make sure you read the original thread on the activism thread.
  12. by   globalRN
    healthyone: You are making dangerous generalizations that border on something even uglier..
    'I don't know how the hospital plans to explain this
    unacceptable care level to their cleints...will they excuse it
    away because their eyes are slanted and they are from foreign
    lands?'
    Perhaps you are struggling with your nursing school financing....why don't you go speak with your school's
    financial advisors? As for a poor diet....borrow a nutrition/healthy eating book from the library...it isn't that hard to eat to eat nutritiously and economically...borrow a book on 'how to save on just about everything'. Don't blame your sorrows on others...if foreign nurses choose to come...I am sure it probably included working as externs while in school and as staff for 'x' number of years after graduation.
    Why don't you try approaching some of the same sponsors for the same deal if you think it is so good?
    By the way, I am 'oriental'....speak superb English...paid off my student loans for my BSN and worked hard to pay off my MS degree tuition myself with no loans assistance(which I did in the US PAYING OUT OF STATE TUITION). And yes, I have a family too.
    My patients are very happy with the care I provide and I have never had dissatisfied patients, only grateful patients and families. AND my eyes do not slant...
    SO quit your *****ing and whining and get off your duff if you want to be a nurse and 'JUST DO IT"
  13. by   -jt
    <they would be recruited to the US to attend school here and have all tuition and living expenses paid for>

    First of all, nobody is taking just any woman 'off the streets of foreign lands' & sending them to US schools to become nurses free of charge. They are recruiting RNs. And as employees, those RNs are entitled to all the salaries, perks, & benefits any other RN employee has at the facility that employs her. So if your facility will pay for you to go back to school for an advanced degree or will give you tuition reimbursement, it must allow the same for any foreign trained RNs theyve employed. There are not enough seats for all the US citizens who want to be nurses now & there are already waiting lists for nursing schools. Isnt it a little illogical to think that recruiters would go overseas to find people off the street to come to school here when there are no seats for the US students who are already here & waiting?

    As far as loans, at the urging of the ANA, the President signed the Nurse Reinvestment Act recently, and that will allow for workplace conditions improvements, allow for loans, grants, and scholarships for students who want to become nurses, as well as allow for increasing the nursing programs & creating more space for more students. In addition, the law allows for total tuition loan forgiveness for a student who agrees to work in a certain short staffed region of her choosing for a limited number of years.

    But Congress has yet to allocate any money to implementing this new law.

    To all of you who want a nursing education but cant get any financial assistance, and to all RNs& LPNs in fact, a short note to your Congressman & Senator telling them to appropriate the maximum funding of $250 million for the Nurse Reinvestment Act NOW would get it into effect & make these scholarships & grants available to US students & nurses a lot quicker. Complaining does nothing. Taking action makes things happen. You can find Congressional email addresses at http://www.nursingworld.org

    FYI, foreign trained nurses have been recruited to the US for at least the past 30 yrs. Its nothing new. There has been no doomsday caused by it either. Whats new is now the places they have always been recruited from (Great Britain, Canada, Ireland, Phillipines, Carribean, Africa) have their own nursing shortages & its not right to steal them away from where they are needed. And whats new is now the hospitals are lobbying to relax the laws & requirements to allow for the importation of more, less credentialled recruits.

    Rather than spending the money to fix the problems that are keeping 18% of Americas 2.7 million nurses from working in nursing & then recruiting them back, its probably less of a headache for hospitals to just spend a ton of money on bringing in foreign nurses who will then feel they have to keep their mouths shut, will not make waves about their working conditions, & will be obligated to the hospital to just put up with anything it throws at them just to keep the job. Exploitation.


    "ANA condemns the practice of recruiting nurses to countries where authorities have failed to address human resource planning and problems that cause nurses to leave the profession and discourage them from returning. The ANA believes that the U.S. health care industry has failed to maintain a work environment conducive to safe, quality nursing practice and one which retains experienced U.S. nurses in patient care. Therefore, the practice of changing immigration law to facilitate the use of foreign-educated nurses is a short-term solution that serves ONLY the interests of the hospital industry, NOT the interests of patients, domestic nurses, or foreign-educated nurses."
    http://www.ana.org
    Last edit by -jt on Oct 5, '02

close