Experienced Nurses Only - page 5

No replies from students please! Nurses, are you frustrated with trying to read theses forums only to find that most of the posts are from students or nurse wanna-be's looking for medical advice?... Read More

  1. by   anne74
    Quote from ruby vee
    exactly! it would be lovely to have a thread where we can vent without being told we have bad attitudes, or shouldn't be precepting anymore or are old dogs or burnt out or any of the above by someone without enough experience to understand. i'm not sure how we'd go about keeping those kinds of posts out of our forum, though. still, if it could work, i'd love it!

    did you ever think that maybe there's some truth to these comments? that's one of the benefits of a web site like this - getting different perspectives and insights on topics. it's not a site where everyone is going to agree with you - and do you want it like that? (well, you probably do.)

    why do so many "experienced" nurses want to shut out the new generations of nurses? don't you feel some kind of obligation to help progress nursing?

    when i started out as a nurse (no - i'm not a student anymore) i fondly looked up to experienced nurses and admired them. but then when i started getting snooty comments, rolling eyes, being "tattled' on, and treated like i was a burden, my attitude changed. i was crushed and almost wanted to leave nursing. pretty juvenile behavior from such "experienced" nurses.

    it's such a shame, and very hurtful to our industry. sure - everyone needs to vent, but learn some more healthy - and less harmful - ways to cope. new nurses - and students - shouldn't have to pay for your unhappiness. the worst part of this whole phenomenon is that many students/new nurses are missing out on learning from your valuable experiences. very sad.

    anyway, i totally understand the desire for an experienced nurses forum. experienced nurses have a different perspective. but perhaps you should nix the "exclusiveness" of it, and stop separating yourselves from the unworthy, less experienced students. that makes people lose a lot of respect for you.
    Last edit by anne74 on Oct 6, '06
  2. by   CHATSDALE
    miranda, i can see why you are a supermoderator - this was a well thought out, helpful post

    thank you
  3. by   rn/writer
    Quote from CHATSDALE
    miranda, i can see why you are a supermoderator - this was a well thought out, helpful post

    thank you
    What a kind thing to say. Thanks. You made my day.
  4. by   RN34TX
    Quote from texas_lvn
    I can actually see where you are going, and I see that you are from Texas, so you realize that LVN's have pretty much the same experiences/autonomy as you. Are you saying that LVNs are not allowed to answer on this possible new forum? Pretty much the only thing Rns can do that I can't is hang blood, then LVNs do all the vitals and after care.
    Oh, I never even touched on that aspect and didn't mean to ignore it.
    I really took the post to mean experienced nurse period (LPN/LVN/RN) vs. student or new grad in any category with little/no experience, but the OP did in fact specify "RN".
    I'm not sure if it was intended to exclude LVN's or not because I notice that people sometimes do say "RN's" when they really mean "nurses" in general.

    Not only do I realize LVN scope of practice in Texas, I was one as well for years, both in TX and several other states.

    I'm not really wanting to "not allow" any particular category of member to post or not, as I myself lurk and post questions in areas that I'm not familiar with and just have an interest in. It's nice to have access to particular nurses that you normally never have contact with at work and have questions that they could answer, such as thinking about transferring to another area and wanting to find out what their jobs are like. I also sometimes ask students questions about their nursing programs and what is taught so I learn from them as well.

    I was just saying that it's nice to be able to vent to someone who understands without the post being interpreted through green/idealistic eyes who's more likely to focus on the other things I mentioned ("I hope I don't get burned out like you when I become a nurse" or "I'm a new grad and this post is freaking me out", etc.) than the situation in general that another experienced RN or LVN could relate to.

    It's just nice to be able to vent and tell your story of how your shift went without feeling like you're representing the whole profession or your specialty to students or new nurses.

    I might want to post about a particularly bad day or one isolated situation without it getting interpreted as:
    "Nursing is a nightmare and you need to get out while you can..... Every ICU in every hospital is horrible to work in....I hate my job and I hate nursing period......" but that's what sometimes happens when the yet-to-be seasoned folks read some of the posts.
  5. by   PANurseRN1
    Quote from RunningWithScissors
    No replies from students please!

    Nurses, are you frustrated with trying to read theses forums only to find that most of the posts are from students or nurse wanna-be's looking for medical advice? You can usually tell them by the poor grammer.

    Can we have a forum created for experienced nurses only to post?

    No flames, let's just be honest here.
    I'd be for it. It would cut down on having to wade throught all of the "horrible older nurses" threads/posts, or posts from people who are pre-nursing students but seem to know it all already. Not to mention there wouldn't be the "Write my paper/care plan for me" posts, either.
  6. by   PANurseRN1
    Quote from ruby vee
    exactly! it would be lovely to have a thread where we can vent without being told we have bad attitudes, or shouldn't be precepting anymore or are old dogs or burnt out or any of the above by someone without enough experience to understand. i'm not sure how we'd go about keeping those kinds of posts out of our forum, though. still, if it could work, i'd love it!
    yes, along with "my preceptor watches me too much/my preceptor doesn't watch me enough/my preceptor gives me too much feedback/my preceptor doesn't give me enough feedback, etc., etc., etc."

    every time an experienced nurse vents, you can be sure that some student/pre-nursing student/someone who is thinking about becoming a student/cna/cma will take that nurse to task. i would love to see a forum where the other posters would know exactly what i was talking about and not be quick to condemn.

    it could be like a "veteran nurse" forum. you have to have a minimum of 10 years as an rn/lpn...extra points for those who've been in nursing 20+ years.
  7. by   texas_lvn
    Quote from RN34TX
    Oh, I never even touched on that aspect and didn't mean to ignore it.
    I really took the post to mean experienced nurse period (LPN/LVN/RN) vs. student or new grad in any category with little/no experience, but the OP did in fact specify "RN".
    I'm not sure if it was intended to exclude LVN's or not because I notice that people sometimes do say "RN's" when they really mean "nurses" in general.

    I might want to post about a particularly bad day or one isolated situation without it getting interpreted as:
    "Nursing is a nightmare and you need to get out while you can..... Every ICU in every hospital is horrible to work in....I hate my job and I hate nursing period......" but that's what sometimes happens when the yet-to-be seasoned folks read some of the posts.

    I was not directing the RN/LVN at you. Please do not take offense.
    I agree about having a cruddy night and wanting to vent. I do get upset when someone was a thread and the first response is "if your unhappy, leave!" But I have to say I doubt that only students write that. And I doubt that having an experienced nursing only forum would eliminate this.

    I am all about having the forum, but I think I took offense to the "Experienced RN's" and the typo scenerio.

    And OP, You still not have answered what an experienced nurse is.?.?.?.?.?

    Edit to add: I LOVE THE FACT YOU USED YET-TO-BE in place of wanna-be. This would have eliminated alot of hurt feelings.
    also spell checked for RWS
    Last edit by texas_lvn on Oct 6, '06
  8. by   PANurseRN1
    Quote from anne74
    Did you ever think that maybe there's some truth to these comments? That's one of the benefits of a web site like this - getting different perspectives and insights on topics. It's not a site where everyone is going to agree with you - and do you want it like that? (Well, you probably do.)

    Why do so many "experienced" nurses want to shut out the new generations of nurses? Don't you feel some kind of obligation to help progress nursing?

    When I started out as a nurse (no - I'm not a student anymore) I fondly looked up to experienced nurses and admired them. But then when I started getting snooty comments, rolling eyes, being "tattled' on, and treated like I was a burden, my attitude changed. I was crushed and almost wanted to leave nursing. Pretty juvenile behavior from such "experienced" nurses.

    It's such a shame, and very hurtful to our industry. Sure - everyone needs to vent, but learn some more healthy - and less harmful - ways to cope. New nurses - and students - shouldn't have to pay for your unhappiness. The worst part of this whole phenomenon is that many students/new nurses are missing out on learning from your valuable experiences. Very sad.

    Anyway, I totally understand the desire for an experienced nurses forum. Experienced nurses have a different perspective. But perhaps you should nix the "exclusiveness" of it, and stop separating yourselves from the unworthy, less experienced students. That makes people lose a lot of respect for you.
    Prime example. Bash the older nurses strikes again.
  9. by   rn/writer
    Quote from anne74
    did you ever think that maybe there's some truth to these comments? that's one of the benefits of a web site like this - getting different perspectives and insights on topics. it's not a site where everyone is going to agree with you - and do you want it like that? (well, you probably do.)

    even if there is truth to the comments, there are times when you just want a listening ear. when i need to let off steam, the last thing i want at that moment is someone else's perspective and insights. i want the freedom to say ouch without being criticized for feeling the pain. even if i need helpful hints, i'm not quite ready to hear them just then.

    why do so many "experienced" nurses want to shut out the new generations of nurses? don't you feel some kind of obligation to help progress nursing?

    needing to vent is hardly shutting out new generations of nurses. i could turn this question around and ask why do so many aspiring nurses and students begrudge the veterans the chance to express what they're going through. as experienced nurses, we should be able to have bad days and feel frustrated, sad, afraid, lonely and the rest of the emotional gamut without that being interpretted as a lack of caring for those behind us on the path. no one should be so fragile that they can't let someone else be real without crying foul.

    when i started out as a nurse (no - i'm not a student anymore) i fondly looked up to experienced nurses and admired them. but then when i started getting snooty comments, rolling eyes, being "tattled' on, and treated like i was a burden, my attitude changed. i was crushed and almost wanted to leave nursing. pretty juvenile behavior from such "experienced" nurses.

    the reality is that the young of any species or profession are a "burden" to some extent. it takes time and energy and effort to grow a child or a nurse. for the most part, this is a special trust and an honor. nurses who forget they came up through the ranks can create shame and fear in the newbies, and this is wrong. the flip side is that we have needs, too. we aren't paragons of virtue whose sole purpose is to nurture others. sometimes we need a break and a little slack. it would be nice to get that without being judged as letting others down.

    it's such a shame, and very hurtful to our industry. sure - everyone needs to vent, but learn some more healthy - and less harmful - ways to cope. new nurses - and students - shouldn't have to pay for your unhappiness. the worst part of this whole phenomenon is that many students/new nurses are missing out on learning from your valuable experiences. very sad.

    maybe venting posts should be labeled, "enter at your own risk." anyone who finds a "letting off steam" post offensive should probably avoid such threads. venting is a form of coping and it need not amount to making newbies and students pay for your unhappiness. sometimes all you need to feel better is to discharge the emotions and have someone else say, "i totally understand." that little bit of connection can make all the difference in the world.
    newbies, students, wanna-bes (not meant offensively), please understand that no one, no matter how much she likes her job, is always positive. bad things happen. dysfunctional people cross your path. real life intrudes.

    i think one of the problems with experienced nurses venting is that aspiring nurses see it out of context and it can scare them. they don't know about the good times because we're not talking about that at the moment. other nurses who've been around awhile can fill in the blanks. they can often distinguish between someone who's having a temporary snit and someone who is headed down a dangerous path.

    when we're in dire straits, we have to take care of ourselves and sometimes that means we're don't have much left to take care of others. we need to direct our energy at solving problems and sorting out feeings and we don't want to feel like we have to hold everything in because some might not understand and be damaged by our candor.

    experienced nurses should remember that they were green and needy when they started out. they should help the newbies feel comfortable with asking questions and do any necessary correcting with respect.

    newbies and aspiring nurses should acknowledge that there is much they don't know about the real world of nursing and not assume that veteran nurses who have occasional struggles are bitter and burned out. let us be where we are and we'll try to do the same for you.
  10. by   vampiregirl
    When I read the op, I'll admit I was a little offended (ok, I'm a student... can you guess?). But as I read further along in the thread, I began to look at this topic a little differently. I'm glad to get some insight into how posters feel about other's responses (nurses, nursing students, etc...). I guess it encouraged me to think a little more before I post a response, to reflect as to whether I am adding something insightful or useful, or whether I am adding just another post to a thread. So, while I'm still not sure that I agree with the OP's approach, I do think that this topic needed to be discussed.
  11. by   PANurseRN1
    Miranda, you stated exactly what I was thinking so beautifully!
  12. by   Halinja
    Maybe I'm just adding another post...without thinking.

    But.

    I LIKE reading the ventings and the letting off of steam. I'm old enough to know there is no job that is perfect. When experienced nurses let down their hair, I can read that and think...okay, that kind of sucks, but it wouldn't destroy me. It makes the job more real, and more realistic. If someone tells me their job is all sweetness and light, I get wary. I wonder if they're going to try and sell me the Brooklyn Bridge next.

    I think I may have been guilty on this board of being all happy about nursing when someone was having a bad day, and now that I have read this thread, I realize I may have been insensitive. Sorry! (I'll brush up on my therapeutic communications)

    I hope that the time doesn't come when the experienced nurses shut those of us that are still learning away from their experiences...good or bad.

    If a nurse can't vent here on allnurses...wow, where WOULD it be appropriate? So please, don't hold back on my account!

    a student nurse
  13. by   caroladybelle
    Quote from anne74
    Why do so many "experienced" nurses want to shut out the new generations of nurses? Don't you feel some kind of obligation to help progress nursing?

    When I started out as a nurse (no - I'm not a student anymore) I fondly looked up to experienced nurses and admired them. But then when I started getting snooty comments, rolling eyes, being "tattled' on, and treated like I was a burden, my attitude changed. I was crushed and almost wanted to leave nursing. Pretty juvenile behavior from such "experienced" nurses.

    It's such a shame, and very hurtful to our industry. Sure - everyone needs to vent, but learn some more healthy - and less harmful - ways to cope. New nurses - and students - shouldn't have to pay for your unhappiness. The worst part of this whole phenomenon is that many students/new nurses are missing out on learning from your valuable experiences. Very sad.

    Anyway, I totally understand the desire for an experienced nurses forum. Experienced nurses have a different perspective. But perhaps you should nix the "exclusiveness" of it, and stop separating yourselves from the unworthy, less experienced students. That makes people lose a lot of respect for you.
    No one wants to "shut out" new generations of nurses. But occasionally, we would like a moment's piece when we don't have to put on the "Let's protect everyone from all bad feelings, unprofessional thoughts and utterances" face that stuffs all the true, good, bad, and often ugly inside....and eventially leads us to self destruct if we do not discuss. Especially if your SO is tired of hearing it.

    Do I feel an obligation to "progress" nursing? Not if it requires perpetually putting on a fake angelic smile, and acting like everything is absolutely perfect. There are days, when it is doing everything I can TO GET THROUGH THE DAY with professional demeanor, without having to "progress nursing".

    There is a point when we have to kick away the large amount of unusable things they discussed as theory in school and start dealing with reality.

    It isn't about students being unworthy - it is about being able to discuss real things, without seeing the "Oh, this scaring me", "Oh, that's so mean", "Oh, my. you did it wrong....in class the other day ....". Or the "I think that the BSN should be mandatory because my instructor says.." from someone who hasn't cared for a patient on his/her own yet.

    (PS. Could someone PLEASE send a memo to every instructor of every NS in the USA. Include a threat for them to beaten to death by used C-Diff bedpans if they EVER assign another student to do a paper on RN/BSN/ADN and suggest them to use nursing BB internet sources to do it with)

    And as far as "snooty attitudes", "Rolling eyes", and "tattling", students/new grads do quite a bit of that to older nurses also.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
    To the OP:

    Some of us go to less moderated forums, where some such discussion is considered acceptable. Of course, some people find such BBs difficult, because they only want "their" opinion uncensored, but have trouble dealing everyone else's uncensored opinions..

    Or there are BBs that may be more geared to experienced nurses that may be a comfortable. option.

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