Ethics Violation-Would you remain silent or challenge the system? - page 2

Today I was labeled a "whistleblower and tattletail because I, along with numerous other students, witnessed a table of individuals cheating on an exam in our Anatomy and Physiology class which is a... Read More

  1. by   VickyRN
    Quote from reebok
    Im not saying that cheating is okay. But I will say that reporting them makes you no better. Ask these questions first.

    Prioritize: Is someone's life at stake? Will they eventually harm a patient?
    Could the college's reputation suffer from this?
    Yes, a future patient's life could very well be at stake by an unethical nurse. The same student who cheats will also cover up medication errors, falsify documentation, and will also attempt to hide his or her mistakes. Lack of integrity is a very serious issue when patient's lives are at stake.
  2. by   kukukajoo
    Reebok- All I have to say is that you sound like someone who has cheated in the past and possibly been caught by someone honest. Maybe not, but gee whiz, your attitude really stinks!

    Rules are rules for a reason and not for people to break- blatanly or not. BUT when someone breaks them as BLATANT as these idiots do, then they certainly deserve to be caught for their own stupidity if nothing else! Every criminal knows that.

    AND Cheating PERIOD is the same- shows a total lack of morals and also that a person has such a low opinion of themselves to think they can't make it on their own brains. I feel sorry for those that would even consider cheating!

    Quote from reebok
    Could it be that the purpose of you reporting the cheating was b/c there is a limited amount of space for acceptance into the nursing school and you wanted to increase the odds of you entering by expelling others.

    Human Anatomy&physiology is a pre-requisite course. I would be sympathetic about your situation if the severity of them cheating could eventually cause harm to the college's reputation and future risk for patient problems. For ex: Cheating in an actual NURSING COURSE w/ a clinical is much more important. Dont waste your time worrying about others. As long as you make sure that you are doing the right thing you will be okay. If the professor doesn't care why should you.

    Im not saying that cheating is okay. But I will say that reporting them makes you no better. Ask these questions first.

    Prioritize: Is someone's life at stake? Will they eventually harm a patient?
    Could the college's reputation suffer from this?
  3. by   kukukajoo
    Oh and cheaters tend to be liars. Would you want this person on the floor with you and make a HUGE error, and then have them cover it up and finger YOU and YOU lose your license and cred for this idiots fall!?!? Trust me, it's happened!
  4. by   Mom of 4
    I'd be a little concerned about someone working for or with me that felt the way the negative post expressed. I'd suggest that the question of nursing ethics comes into question even in the world of academia. Will the cheaters be the nurses whose research is plagerized or fraudulant and in fact effects the treatment of patients? The best education for the "cheaters" would be to expell them if that's what school policy suggests or disciplinary action with publicity to dissuade others from turning to dishonesty. I hope the professor wasn't tenured and can be redirected in his career since it appears he's not a role model for students. Best of luck to you...maybe you could take these posts to the Dean or if you are studying near to a hospital with an Ethics Committee you may gain some support there.
  5. by   crackerjack
    Very good!! Bravo to you

    When I was in nursing school, I had a fellow student approach me a few times offering to pay me to write a care plan for him (I was getting 96-100 on all mine and he was struggling). Initially, I thought he was being a smartass and just joking because he was 'one of those' who would do that just to let you know he didn't approve of your doing well when he wasn't, as if it were some sort of freak luck thing. After a couple more times it was sounding less and less like a joke and more like a genuine intent to cheat and involve me in his misdeeds, as much as he tried to make it sound jokular. As soon as he did this the third time, while at clinicals no less, I approached my instructor and reported him. She was not pleased to say the least. She had a long, serious word with him, where I'm sure he assured her he was just being a goof and meant nothing by it. He remained in the program for one more semester before he failed out, all everyone else's fault, of course. He had plans to go to a different program where things were ''much better'' and I happen to know it isn't but oh well! Anyway, I felt good that I'd reported him and it didn't bother me in the least the rest of the time he was in the program and treated me like crap.

    One more.....MIGHTY FINE JOB GIRL!
  6. by   Jolie
    Vicky gave excellent advice on how to approach this problem while taking steps to protect yourself.

    To the poster who questions whether the OP may simply want to get some of the competition out of the way by seeing the cheating students dismissed prior to admission to the actual nursing program: If these students can't hack A&P without cheating, how are they going to get thru the actual nursing program without cheating? Pre-reqs exist for a reason, and that reason is to weed out those who are likely to fail at the next level. If students cheat their way into nursing courses, only to fail 1-2 semesters down the road, they have taken up valuable space in the nursing program that should have gone to competent, deserving students. That harms us all, both financially, and in the quality of nurses who graduate.
  7. by   SmilingBluEyes
    The very limited slots people vie for need to go to folks who do not cheat! Think about that.
  8. by   DeLana_RN
    Yes, you did the right thing! As you found out, it's not always easy or even welcomed. Especially after this happened (professors' response, harrassment by the cheaters) you need to take it higher as others have suggested. What about the other students who volunteered you? Are they now backing out or standing behind you? Try to get as many of them as possible to go with you when you report the cheaters and the professor.

    I'm proud of you. You belong in this profession!

    DeLana
  9. by   reebok
    Quote from VickyRN
    Yes, a future patient's life could very well be at stake by an unethical nurse. The same student who cheats will also cover up medication errors, falsify documentation, and will also attempt to hide his or her mistakes. Lack of integrity is a very serious issue when patient's lives are at stake.

    I will respond to you b/c so far you have had the best answer or reply to my controversial statement. I agree with you. But for a student who cheats on a A&P test alone does not mean that he will automatically cover up med-errors or falsify documentation and the student who earned his grade wont. You could look at it in a different way. That cheater may be more likely to double, triple check when administering meds or often seek help from other nurses to avoid certain mistakes.

    My question for you is Can you honestly say that you've never cheated on a test? Not the whole test maybe 1 answer. from pre-k to bachelors degree.

    And if you are a person with that much integrity. Certainly you've never made a med error or falsified documents or covered up any mistake throughout your whole nursing career. Every nurse has made a mistake. And admitting up to it at the right time is when ethics is involved. What I meant by prioritize: It's a pre-req.,professor doesn't care. In the actual Nursing school it matters. There are M.D.'s who have made straight A's their entire life and have never cheated but fail when it comes to ethical delimmas. Trust me a pre-req. test is not the best determination for ethical standards. I would hope a criminal record would be weighted more heavily.
  10. by   UM Review RN
    Quote from reebok
    I will respond to you b/c so far you have had the best answer or reply to my controversial statement. I agree with you. But for a student who cheats on a A&P test alone does not mean that he will automatically cover up med-errors or falsify documentation and the student who earned his grade wont. You could look at it in a different way. That cheater may be more likely to double, triple check when administering meds or often seek help from other nurses to avoid certain mistakes.

    My question for you is Can you honestly say that you've never cheated on a test? Not the whole test maybe 1 answer. from pre-k to bachelors degree.

    And if you are a person with that much integrity. Certainly you've never made a med error or falsified documents or covered up any mistake throughout your whole nursing career. Every nurse has made a mistake. And admitting up to it at the right time is when ethics is involved. What I meant by prioritize: It's a pre-req.,professor doesn't care. In the actual Nursing school it matters. There are M.D.'s who have made straight A's their entire life and have never cheated but fail when it comes to ethical delimmas. Trust me a pre-req. test is not the best determination for ethical standards. I would hope a criminal record would be weighted more heavily.
    Honey, if you can't take a failing grade because you either weren't able to get an A or you didn't study, you have no business being a nurse.

    Cheating is just one symptom of not being able to cut it, at whatever level.

    And no, I never did cheat. I was the nerd on the end of the front row keeping my paper covered.
  11. by   kukukajoo
    Heck NO I have NEVER cheated- at ANYTHING.

    Your reasoning that cheaters would double or triple check is flawed. If they are already in a pattern of taking the easy way out I can assure you that in most they do they will take the easy way out.

    EVERY SITUATION YOU ENCOUNTER IN LIFE is a determination of ethical standards- don't you get it??
  12. by   BSNtobe2009
    Talk about a lazy professor! God forbid if he actually had to take additional time out of his day to, GASP! (dare I say it?) Grade papers between classes! OH THE DRAMA!

    Seriously, I'm all for staying out of the politics at work and school, but in this case, it would have been hard for me not to out them in front of the entire class!

    I have no tolerance for cheating, and you did the right thing. There is no way, as competitive as nursing is, I would let a single student get the edge due to dishonesty, and you did the ENTIRE ADMISSIONS system a favor...what if one of those girls got in while a non-cheater didn't?

    You did the right thing, and I wouldn't care what the others thought.
  13. by   BSNtobe2009
    Quote from reebok
    Could it be that the purpose of you reporting the cheating was b/c there is a limited amount of space for acceptance into the nursing school and you wanted to increase the odds of you entering by expelling others.

    Human Anatomy&physiology is a pre-requisite course. I would be sympathetic about your situation if the severity of them cheating could eventually cause harm to the college's reputation and future risk for patient problems. For ex: Cheating in an actual NURSING COURSE w/ a clinical is much more important. Dont waste your time worrying about others. As long as you make sure that you are doing the right thing you will be okay. If the professor doesn't care why should you.

    Im not saying that cheating is okay. But I will say that reporting them makes you no better. Ask these questions first.

    Prioritize: Is someone's life at stake? Will they eventually harm a patient?
    Could the college's reputation suffer from this?
    If I reported a cheater and that person looked at me and said, "Did you report me to give yourself a better chance into the nursing program?"

    I could look at them dead in the eye and say PROUDLY, "You bet I did, because only ETHICAL people should be admitted into the nursing profession!"

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