Ethical Debate: Organ Transplants - page 4

3rdShiftGuy had a great ethical question in the 17y/o organ transplant tragedy that somewhat went unanswered. I think it would be a great thing to debate and discuss, but to avoid confusion and hurt... Read More

  1. by   LLDPaRN
    Originally posted by ktwlpn
    I don't believe an alien(legal or illegal) should be permitted to buy themselves an organ transplant-getting an organ while tax paying citizen of this country dies.....Furthermore-all those folks on death row could really give something back to society by becoming donors-forget the electic chair or the lethal injection-strap them to the gurney and wheel them to the OR.....And while we are at it let's do away with "life sentences" and make them all donors...Crisis solved....
    I agree with this as well. In fact, in Europe, people have to "opt out" of being donors rather than "opt in", as we do here. I'm thinking that maybe we should adopt that system here. Everyone is an organ donor by default unless you choose to opt out (due to religious reasons or whatever). I think it's going to be many years before a truly viable artificial heart will be developed. At this point, LVAD's (left ventricular assist devices) are only used as "bridge therapy" for those waiting for hearts. Granted, living donors are now being used for kidneys and livers but overall, the US still has a massive shortage.

    I'll be curious to hear what other people think of the "donor by default" idea

    Laurie
    Newly minted MSN
  2. by   cactus wren
    Actually, isn`t the rate of Hep C sky high in incarerated individuals? Don`t think I`d want a kidney from them....But , the idea if everyone being a potential donor, unless you opt out is an excellant one...Especially those folks who insist it`s not "COOL" to drive a Harley with a helmet....
  3. by   sunnygirl272
    Originally posted by cactus wren
    Actually, isn`t the rate of Hep C sky high in incarerated individuals? Don`t think I`d want a kidney from them....But , the idea if everyone being a potential donor, unless you opt out is an excellant one...Especially those folks who insist it`s not "COOL" to drive a Harley with a helmet....
    hm...good point about the hep....

    yes..let's make it donor by default...i like it...
  4. by   tiger
    Originally posted by cactus wren
    ...But , the idea if everyone being a potential donor, unless you opt out is an excellant one.......
    and if you do choose not to be a donor--you will not be able to recieve an organ(should you ever need one). i think that is fair.
  5. by   sunnygirl272
    Originally posted by tiger
    and if you do choose not to be a donor--you will not be able to recieve an organ(should you ever need one). i think that is fair.
    oooh..another a good idear........
  6. by   Tweety
    Originally posted by fergus51
    Are you all putting illegal aliens in the same boat with legal immigrants? Personally, I see no difference in legal immigrants and Canadian born (or American born) citizens. If they came here legally and work legally and pay taxes, they are contributing as much, and sometimes more, than any other citizen born here. I do have a problem with illegal immigrants getting transplants here.

    That said: Americans and Canadians DO go to other countries to get organs, specifically the live donor organs like kidneys. They go to Asia and buy them. Not any better than illegal aliens taking ours IMHO. It is immoral and taints the whole organ transplant issue.
    Good point. That was mainly my question. Should say a king from Saudi Arabia be allowed to put himself on our list. He's not a citazen, but the organs will safe his life. Should we have an open door to American organs?
  7. by   SandyB
    I got problems w/illegal immigrants being on the list. If you are here legal, fine, get on the list.

    I dunno about someone like the king of Saudi Arabia.....it gets pretty complicated there...if we did put someone like that on the list....can we add some of the citizens of Saudi as donors too? Dunno how that would work but would be more fair. Too much giving and no getting gets on my nerves and make me feel we are taken advantage of.

    And I like the not willling to donate; not able to receive....pretty much where I sit for myself. I'm not comfortable w/being a donor-so I decided years ago I would not let myself receive one. I'll just plain go DNR and hospice.
  8. by   bestblondRN
    I was recently involved in a case of a brain dead woman whose family gave permission for all vital organs (including heart and lungs) to be donated. No tissue, no corneas. Interestingly, in the OR, the transplant team took only the liver, pancreas and kidneys. Heart and lungs appeared to be in good shape, so I asked the transplant coordinator why the heart and lungs were left and the reply was very vague--something along the lines of there not being time to do all the crossmatching and getting the organs where they would need to go. Now......we live within a 4 hour DRIVE of a number of large cities. This team was FLYING and I can't believe that there was no one within a 4 hour flying radius to accept those organs, especially when there are places doing heart-lung transplants within a 60-90 minute drive of the hospital. Maybe I'm wrong, but if the opportunity was there to procure those organs, why wasn't it done? Does anyone with more experience along these lines have any idea why it may have gone this way? It has bothered me for weeks now as to why it wasn't done!
  9. by   Q.
    See, and this is why I'm in favor of cloning. Cloning for organs. It's sad because there really are enough organs to go around but not enough to donate. But I can see why: the system is sick and twisted and tainted.

    And BestBlonde's story is creepy. Anyone who is "educated" on transplants care to comment? It seems we have a quite few nurses on this BB who espouse this but rarely offer any information.
  10. by   hoolahan
    Best Blone, if that is true, that is a SIN!!! To think that people are in those hospitals just waiting for a donor. I admitted a pt to home heath just yesterday who was in the hosp NINE MONTHS getting IV milrinone until he got his transplant. He shared time with many many others who were on that unit waiting for hearts. And please, the typing and xmatching is done long before the actual harvesting of organs, I mean hours prior, isn't it? That was the way it was done when I last participated in a harvest in an ICU.

    That just makes me so angry!!!
  11. by   semstr
    Laurie, MSN, sorry girl, but that is not done in all European countires, only in Austria and Belgium.
    But we have Eurotransplant here, located in Leiden in the Netherlands and all the dates and facts of people needing organs or tissues are in the computers there (not all countries are there, but most of them) and when a organ comes, it doesn't matter where someone is from.
    I worked dialysis for a while and we had kidneys from Italy, form Germany and from Norway.
    Who cares? As long as the patients get their organs, and the list is checked in the right way, I don't mind at all, who gets the organs first.
    What I do find revolting, is paying for organs. We have qiute a few of very rich Arabic patients and they like to buy whatever they need. Untill now, I don't know of one, who got his/ her organs earlier, because they paid for it.
    But it might be, that I simply don't know about it.
  12. by   caroladybelle
    I believe that the time limit from removal of life support from donor to organ reimplantment and returned to functioning in a recipient is a total of four to six hours for heart and or lungs . Really a very narrow margin when figure including removal, the entire reimplantment and reanimation (?) of organ, travel time etc.
    Very little of that time is allotted to travel - or so is my understanding. Heart & lung combos are fragile and survive viably a very short time outside a living host.

    As I posted on another thread many countries have varying laws regarding death - in those where brain death is not considered death, few heart and/or lung transplants can be done d/t organs not being viable long enough - many Japanese were coming to the US for transplants as organs were not available in Japan for this reason - not aware if this is still true or not.
  13. by   Lausana
    Originally posted by MishlB
    Healthcare SHOULD NOT be based on whether someone is a citizen of this country
    Apparently this thought is mutual, and why I get RIPPED off to provide myself and child with healthcare out of each paycheck let alone when we actually need something, I don't have the option of hopping the border and taking myself to an ER and getting free care because "I'm there".

    I absolutely LOVE the idea of those incarcerated being asked to donate. Even after eliminated diseased organs, think of how many would still be available

    If we had more people willing to donate and were able to give to our own citizens with organs to spare, sure give them to anyone in need. But sadly, we don't. I feel it's neccessary to give American citizens organs from American citizens. Citizen being the word.

    I'm curious to see how other countries feel on the subject, if they do their own transplants, do they on foreigners etc. (besides our Canadian/Dutch mentioned above friends of course!) Guess it's time to head of & surf the web.

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