Do Nurses Earn Big Money? You Decide. - page 27

by TheCommuter 88,501 Views | 364 Comments Senior Moderator

Am I the only one who becomes at least mildly irritated whenever a random individual finds out that someone is a nurse and proceeds to say, “You’re rolling in the big bucks!” To keep things honest, I’ll recall a few... Read More


  1. 1
    Quote from eroc
    Here we go again....
    Eroc probably has more expereince in the business side of things, than you will compehend.
    I understand as a floor nurse I what limitations are there, I also understand what it's like to promote people, and fire people. At 23years old I had over 500K invested in my first business, all though my on doing, nothing was given to me. And learned a vast amount in the 15+ years since then. It's as if you think your talking to child with "big dream's"... lmao. I've heard the same lines you have stated over and over throughout the years. Your thought are not uncommon in ANY field.
    I am very comfortable outperforming everyone I am surrounded by. I chose Nursing.... as my starting salary will be less the my last endeavor. It's more like a personal goal to prove to myself how easy it is to get a college education...and Nursing is something I have been interested in for a while now, as I as very interested in the body (That is me in my avatar) ,and like helping people that can't help themselves.
    I understand that might not be what you wanted to believe, but I understand Business first and foremost. So while this will be a career, it is not something I was forced to do.....honestly some people just look for more challenges in life.
    I have a vast knowledge of many different aspects of life, and how to work around them....as I have done in everything I have ever set out to do. So yes, Eroc understands what you trying to accomplsh. Eroc will be a much better Manager or DON than he will be a floor nurse....because after running the enitire show, managing over 40+ people at a time, he knows what he is good at.... because of his experience.
    I truely understand everyone can't be a top earner, or even lead people. Only a few can or will

    While you have continued to try talk down to me...and which you deserve to, IF we are talking about skilled nursing practice.... but we are not talking about skilled nursing practice. We have been debating the same things that go on in EVERY career field. I have refrained from blasting you, like I am capable of, out of respect. (and knowing this is the intenet)
    I know I will only have a few "backers" or people that agree with me. That makes perfect sense to me. My last Professor in school had made it to the PhD level just to prove it to herself...but before that, she was a DON for 20 years, and was very successful at it. We had many talks where we saw things exactly the same way when it came to the business side of nursing. Because we both had EXPERIENCE with running a business.
    Once again I will back down from you if you want to talk skilled nursing...that is something I will show you more respect in.
    I honestly believe people that want to succeed, just don't know the vastly different ways to do so. (I actually love that..because it makes it easier on me) Let me give you best tip I can, don't ask yourself "what would my collegues do to succeed?"...think to yourself "what is it no one else doing that would add overall value to myself?" You simple statement of 'Eroc saying that me and my collegues don't go above and beyond' clearly shows me you are not compending what I'm trying tell you...if you and you other collegues are all going above and beyond...then you are average amougst your peers.
    I hope you comprehend....as I have move passed your thinking long ago.
    ----------------------------------------|

    No offense Eroc, but you are really starting to scare me. Weird. Why continue to take things so personally? What I am saying--why I even used your name--was in reference to some things you had previously stated. Why you choose to see that in a negative, "talk-down" way, is on you.

    Nonetheless, my points have zero to do with YOU PERSONALLY OR HOW WELL you think you can perform.

    They have to do with quantifying nursing functions in such as manner as YOU SEEM to BELIEVE happens. People in nursing may or may not get promoted or given increases in salary based on excellence in practice and things you speak of--as if any of that was anything new.

    It doesn't roll the way you are used to thinking. It doesn't roll the same way as whatever business you had.

    Nurses aren't considered the ones that bring in the bucks to the hospital. They are considered an expenditure rather that as a profit or directly related to proceeds. The hospital does NOT directly make a profit based on what they do in the same quantifiable sense as most other kinds of business. Do effective and excellent nurses make a difference? Can they make a difference for a hospital and how it is rated? Yes! That fact, however, has yet to get back in terms of monetary compensation to nursing. The gains from excellent nursing practice is difficult if not impossible in many ways to quantify.

    Darn. Please, chill, and discuss the issue as it is related to nursing, and stop taking crap personally. I was responding to your perceptions/projections about nursing--based on what you have repeatedly stated. I meant nothing personal. Are you serious with that? Nevertheless, you implication implied repeatedly that apparently a lot of nurses don't go above and beyond in their work, thus they get crap for increases over time.


    Sigh. Step back and think about it. If you would like, I will ask a moderator to take any reference to you out of my previous post; b/c you seemed to have missed the main point by focusing on YOU. Seriously, it wasn't about you, period. Sorry for the confusion on that.

    The issues I raised was on quantifying what nurses do, and how they grow in what they do, and how that translates to value, which could then somehow be means for compensation. Oy and vey.

    Nurses aren't bringing in quantifiable widgets. What nurses do, each minute to hour of each day or night involves a process, whereby and for which, even as they excel in performing the process, they do not, over time, get fair "leveling" up of monetary compensation. When hospitals do have nurse levels; they often make the leveling up process all about really capricious politics, and they go out of their way to limit the upper levels--even then, often the pay isn't much better for increased expertise, committee work, years, teaching/precepting, or the amount of times you are given charge nurse responsibility. Excellent nurses end up refusing charge b/c of the way things functions. They are slackers that don't know how to show added value. They are people that have been burned once to many times by the sub-professional management and administration of nursing. And why does that kind of handling exist? B/c bottom line, nursing is still considered to be a huge expenditure and not a true discipline/profession of added value to an organization. They speak these words, but you will be hard pressed to find many organizations putting their money where their mouth is in this regard. One specialty hospital I worked in did this. You didn't make a starting pay like nurses starting at other hospitals did; but the leveling process was not in anyway limited or blocked. But this was a non-profit specialty hospital. In fact, it ran, in many ways, like the military; but there was room for growth, and they had probably the most objective prognostic indicators of evaluation and progress I have ever seen ANYWHERE. This one hospital in a major metropolitan tri-state area, and I have worked at many hospitals within the area and have close affiliations with many a colleague who has worked as much if not more--as well as many travel nurses.

    The key is to change the mentality of nursing from it being view as a blue-collar position to a true profession; and that means baseline, undergrad and up education. On top of that, people in nursing need to get wise and demand, yes, I said demand, even in this economic climate (and mind you, I am quite Conservative in many ways)--demand that the science of objective evaluation be employed in nursing consistently and ethically, w/o favor, across the board. The key is to keep the prognostic indicators and systems of evaluation as objective as humanly possible, and to continually be improving upon objective metrics in this regard.

    Finally, nursing must look to find objective measures for quantifying added value in function. People have been trying to do this for decades and decades and decades and decades in nursing. It's very hard to do, and people become discouraged working the process.




    No offense Eroc, but the more you respond, the more I become certain you don't understand what the art and science of nursing is about. I don't care at this point if you feel like that is talking "down" to you. Nurses ADD value all the time--hour and hour--day and night in and out, and they get little in terms of long-term compensation. After a while some get burned out and stay in it to survive, whilst others continue to have a continued compassion and focus on the patients and families. They are true heroes, and while administration gives them a mere card and perhaps a free pretzel for nurse's day each year, their patients know they when far above and beyond--and deep in these nurses' guts THEY KNOW they far above and beyond--whether it gets recognized or not, and often it does not. Of course there are those nurses that know how to play the game and be seen only in the prettiest light around mgt and nurse administration. A good number of those are backstabbers in order to get ahead too. I'm so sickened by even talking about the shameless antics I've seen in nursing. Perhaps part of the reason this may occur more than rarely is that nurses in general aren't regularly appreciated and compensated for going the extra mile for their patients and families, etc. Many of us have ALWAYS put our patients first. Guess what? Admin/mgt doesn't care unless it adds to their bottom line, and when it seems costly to do things right or pluperfect FOR THE SAKE OF THE PATIENTS, they avoid it or flat out deny doing such--the nurses with a mentality to go beyond are far from always considered valuable for putting their patients first.

    You've got one thing right. I do know what I am talking about, and I have seen it more times than you can fathom. The ethical/moral nurse becomes sickened and more over it. The less than ethical/moral nurse rationalizes the behavior, and/or decides, "It I can't beat em, join em," and thus gets the "every nurse for her/himself" mentality. Either that or they become so jaded from it, they end up seeing nursing as "only a job" that pays their bills. And that, Eroc, is very, very sad.

    And I can vouch for having worked with and under managers and administrators that did/do understand what the art and science of nursing is as well. Too many sadly DO NOT and never will. IMHO, we don't need more managers/administrators like the latter.

    For decades I've seen these folks with advanced degrees or attached business degrees, and really they still never got a clue what nursing needs to be about, and administration was glad for it; b/c they really didn't want people in the role of manager that could relate to the nurses or to the patients for that matter--Only when it gets some attention--negative or positive, and it could reflect negatively or positively on their potential promotions. EYUCK! The bottom line mentality has and is killing nursing.
    Last edit by samadams8 on Dec 2, '12
    Esme12 likes this.
  2. 0
    When you guys quote each other, I think that broke a record for allnurses.com

    My Unit that I contract on will not pay overtime now unless it goes over 80 hours in one week(Bi-weekly pay period).

    This means that you can do 4 twelves one week(+) without OT, and the next week you are ranked by OT for cancellation. I hate how some place can change so quick from a great place to work, to a profit driven mess

    I can only be canceled once per Pay Period, but the Scrooges found a loophole in my scheduling charge codes last week, and now are calling me in for 4 hour "cover" shifts.

    When I came here they bragged that I could sign-up for OT days, but it usually never gets printed- lol, guess it was the truth- they only said I could "sign-up," not that I would ever get the extra shift. Nurse Recruiters are beginning to act like Used Car salespeople

    I've learned to get everything in writing, but now you got to make sure "It is what it is."

    There is some justice. The new staffing company cancels me constantly, and I still get paid. I told them 3 times (only two women in the staffing room that I get paid regardless after one cancellation). So, unless the ED requests me by name, and they call back- I get a PDO! Funny

    To make it hilarious, when they call back after canceling(90%), after I've notified my agency- It's "call-pay." I think these guys were Government Accountants prior to this job. I have never made more for less, and worked less for more.

    I brought it to the attention of a Nursing Supervisor who said,"I've told them twice in planning for this Change- now I'm done- their still saving overall- so enjoy it. Glad you like it here in our ED."

    I feel really sorry for these staff nurses, Agency is raking it in here, if they are non-cancel by contract- but, since most are from a local staffing agency, that's what they base their decision on I guess.
    Last edit by BostonTerrierLoverRN on Dec 2, '12 : Reason: Formatting
  3. 0
    Quote from samadams8

    You won't see this a lot in the hospital setting. Maybe in LTC, but not in hospitals.
    I have a relative who is a director at a top 10 hospital and she has an ASN. And my old boss at the top 10 hospital I worked at has an ASN. So no it can happen in the hospital setting too.

    I have more examples but those stick out the most.
    Last edit by DoeRN on Dec 2, '12
  4. 0
    I stopped at a local Subway restaurant prior to going to work yesterday evening. The 'sandwich artist,' a young man in his late teens or early twenties, asks me, "Are you getting off work?"

    "I'm on my way to work," I answered.

    "Are you a nurse?" he asked. "I see you're wearing those scrubs."

    "Yes," I said.

    "Are you an RN?" he further inquired.

    "Yes," I responded.

    "Oh!" he smiled. "I'm planning to study nursing! I bet you like making that thirty bucks an hour!"

    "It's not too bad," I admitted.

    That's not my actual pay rate (of course), but the young man didn't need to know the specifics of my compensation anyway.
  5. 0
    @ [COLOR=#003366]samadams8[/COLOR]

    You refered to me many times in your previous post. And this is the internet. scared....lol

    I feel really sorry for you that you feel the way you do about nursing.



    Answer me this....who should I take advice from? Someone who is clearly bitter? Or the ones that are happy and successful?
    Which do you think makes more sense?
    And the higher degree from ASN to BSN is a joke. That whole thing is to benefit colleges and universities. And the nurses promoting it are doing more harm to the the field than good.
    Citing other people's research....AKA thoughts leaving out realistic varibles to match their biased thoughts (seen this considerably in Nursing research)....doesn't not make you appear smarter. Well, maybe to the masses...simply meaning the less you are capable of comphending, the more people there are to agree and be confused a long with you. Not seeing beyond what you have been conditioned to believe. I see you are set in your thinking, which is not the way to change things in your life. Neither is complaining with no action...simply you are your own worst enemy. But your tired, so go ahead telling your yourself these things, along with the countless people that agree with you. You will have plenty of support, I am sure of it.
    I've been trying you how to help yourself...but you suck on what everyone else is doing. And a clear indication is applying turning down a Charge postition, because "your burned out", which is it?

    I understand your need to hold on to your feelings. Good luck to you. I will regress, it seems you are in enough distress with your struggles.
    Last edit by eroc on Dec 2, '12
  6. 0
    Last thing I want to add is I have seen all the things you describe...and see MOST nursing struggle with your same problems.
  7. 0
    [COLOR=#000000][/COLOR]
    Quote from eroc
    Lastthing I want to add is I have seen all the things you describe...and see MOSTnursing struggle with your same problems.


    LOL. I am not bitter; that is what you do not understand. Again, you make this something personal without really trying to understand what has been said.
    You're desire to take things personally has some how blocked your ability tocomprehend what I am saying.

    There are millions of nurses out there in America. Do you truly believe that out of say 1,000,000 nurses, only 0.001, if that, are worthy of compensationand proper pay gradation for their efforts in the field over many years?

    You are not seeing how nurses are compensated in the long run. You'll see it when and if you see it. Perhaps you will forge ahead with your eyes wide shut to it. I don’t know, but I hope not.

    Again, I'm not talking about starting salaries; but I do again refer you to the specialty hospital I referenced in my previous post.


    Finally, you so misunderstand my position, I hardly know where to start.

    This field in many ways has been good to me, and I have stayed faithful to my patients and families over the years. They have always been what is most important to me, not the administrative machine or any of the capricious gaming.I have been able to go to bed with great satisfaction and peace in what I have done—in spite of a lot of idiotic nonsense in how nursing is managed and can tend to function.

    What I have given and received from nursing moreover comes from things of an intrinsic nature. What is frustrating, hands down, is the way nursing is often managed. FRUSTRATING--please note the word.
    There is a HUGE difference between frustrated and resentful or bitter. Those terms are your subjective interpretation—much of the subjectivity in nursing, again, is part of the problem.

    In 20+ years, in an area that can see a fair amount of lawsuits and such, I have never even been named in a suit.
    Now, being named in a suit doesn't necessarily mean there is some presumption of guilt or responsibility. But the point is, as time and experiences progress, the statistical probability of being named, particularly in certain areas, becomes more probable.

    Listen, a conscientious nurses has to often produced an enormous amount of thought, energy, and care, in the midst of various highly stressful situations NOT to make a mistake. That's how easy it is to make one. You really need to grasp that this, in those kinds of circumstances, is no small task.

    Some days, you will need to give yourself a big smile and thank the Lord above that you did not make a mistake, or that you caught a mistake you made, or that a patient wasn't injured. My point is, some days getting out without causing harm, b/c of the stress load and all that is going on, and b/c of back-to-back offshifts, etc., without hurting or potentially hurting someone is a major success--much less running around thinking, "I'm Batman, Ironman or Superman."LOL T

    here are NO BATMANs, IRONMANs, or SUPERMAN NURSES. That’s something that must be understand as counterproductive, since nursing is and always should be a team-based profession.

    The divas and super-nurses, often legends in their own minds, do more to undermine nursing than help it.

    Excelling and caring greatly as nurse are not at all the same thing as the super-nurse/diva complex. Of course many of these types know that it is problematic to demonstrate these behaviors openly too often, so what they add to the behavior is the whole subversive undermining of others. Again, they kill the very spirit and soul of nursing for their own gain.

    All of us nurses with decent experience have seen the super nurse thing in newer nurses. Shoot, in a all probability, many of us went through such a phase to some degree or another at some point. Reality humbles people--hopefully--at least people that have the ability to appreciate wisdom. You get over it, but you also know it when you see it in the newer nurse or the PGY-1 medical resident. Hopefully they will get over themselves in time.

    Many a nurse goes in, and better yet, stays in nursing for a very lengthy period of time, consistently bringing in his or her "A" game. It has nothing to do with fair, overall compensation, which is sad. That was/is my point.

    You've got to go into this field with some humility. It has the ability to humble you right quick, as my southern relatives would say.
    Last edit by samadams8 on Dec 2, '12
  8. 0
    Quote from Kunzieo
    I think nurses get paid very well for the amount of education that they have. Not in many other professions can one make 60k their first year out of school. Sometimes I look at my union contract and think "I am part of what's wrong with healthcare in America." Double overtime, triple time holidays, large shift differentials, weekend bonuses, extra shift bonuses, and God help us if we don't get a raise every year... Don't get me wrong, I love these perks, but I do think nurses are more than adequately compensated. So yes, I guess to answer the question- nurses can make a good amount of money. Maybe not the "big bucks" but decent enough, I'd say! Hiding now, please don't hate!
    Not everyone gets paid like you...me? No triple holiday pay, no large shift differentials, no large extra shift differentials, any over time is state mandated, we get $4/hr to be on call with no extra pay for when me get "called in", after over three years I still DONT make more than 60k/yr (try less than $50k BEFORE taxes, I see a lot less) and I live in California in an area that has a high cost of living. People working at Costco only make a few dollars less an hour than me; and they don't have 4yr degrees with multiple specialty certifications working with people's lives. I accept it because I love my job, but I do not make a lot of money.

    We live well because we live VERY modestly and my husband works. He had a slip disk and has just returned to work after almost a month (self employed so no disability pay). Paying bills with MY nursing income is going to require using savings...
    Last edit by HeartsOpenWide on Dec 2, '12
  9. 0
    Quote from eroc
    @ [COLOR=#003366]samadams8[/COLOR]

    You refered to me many times in your previous post. And this is the internet. scared....lol

    I feel really sorry for you that you feel the way you do about nursing.



    Answer me this....who should I take advice from? Someone who is clearly bitter? Or the ones that are happy and successful?
    Which do you think makes more sense?
    And the higher degree from ASN to BSN is a joke. That whole thing is to benefit colleges and universities. And the nurses promoting it are doing more harm to the the field than good.
    Citing other people's research....AKA thoughts leaving out realistic varibles to match their biased thoughts (seen this considerably in Nursing research)....doesn't not make you appear smarter. Well, maybe to the masses...simply meaning the less you are capable of comphending, the more people there are to agree and be confused a long with you. Not seeing beyond what you have been conditioned to believe. I see you are set in your thinking, which is not the way to change things in your life. Neither is complaining with no action...simply you are your own worst enemy. But your tired, so go ahead telling your yourself these things, along with the countless people that agree with you. You will have plenty of support, I am sure of it.
    I've been trying you how to help yourself...but you suck on what everyone else is doing. And a clear indication is applying turning down a Charge postition, because "your burned out", which is it?

    I understand your need to hold on to your feelings. Good luck to you. I will regress, it seems you are in enough distress with your struggles.



    BTW, your whole response is without insight and substantive basis. What's more it's incredibly assanine.

    The higher degrees have some benefits, but mostly, they are necessary for the advancement of the profession.

    Do you realize in becoming a physical therapist, the baseline education has now become doctoral?
    It's moving this way for OT as well.

    Yes, nursing has DNP programs--and has always has various PhD programs, but really, what percentage of it's work force is even bachelor's prepared, much less masters or greater?

    I'm saying that it what it is; but by comparison, the nursing profession, across the board, is woefully behind.

    I don't doubt the money benefit for colleges and universities. That's not the point.


    In terms of research, exactly to WHAT "realistic variables" are you referring?

    I am not my own worst enemy; that's again, presumptuous, inaccurate, and frankly, totally irrelevant.

    What is it now you are saying about charge nurse? Dude, I have been in nursing management. You, again, aren't getting it.

    You are just not ready to receive it. Perhaps you will be humble and respond back in such a manner when such time arises.

    Until then, it's like explaining color to a person born blind.
  10. 1
    Quote from TheCommuter
    I stopped at a local Subway restaurant prior to going to work yesterday evening. The 'sandwich artist,' a young man in his late teens or early twenties, asks me, "Are you getting off work?"

    "I'm on my way to work," I answered.

    "Are you a nurse?" he asked. "I see you're wearing those scrubs."

    "Yes," I said.

    "Are you an RN?" he further inquired.

    "Yes," I responded.

    "Oh!" he smiled. "I'm planning to study nursing! I bet you like making that thirty bucks an hour!"

    "It's not too bad," I admitted.

    That's not my actual pay rate (of course), but the young man didn't need to know the specifics of my compensation anyway.
    I personally think it is rude to ask people how much they make or to make comments about someone else's pay.
    redhead_NURSE98! likes this.


Top