ADN Nurses Being Forced to go Back to School?

[tnbutterfly - Mary]

New Rules Send Upstate Nurses (in S.C.) Back to School

Hospitals across the country are now mandating that nurses with associate degrees obtain a Bachelor of Science degree.The change went into effect July 1 for nursing staff at Greenville Health System. The organization anticipates 300 nurses will be required to sign a Memorandum of Understanding stating that they will return to school for a BSN degree within four years.

The change in education requirements for nursing staff is based on a recommendation from the Institute of Medicine. The non-profit advisory group wants 80 percent of all nurses to have a four-year degree by 2020.

"We hope for the patient, it will provide enhanced care," according to Judith Thompson, CEO of the South Carolina Nurses Association.

One rationale behind this is that since the role of the nurse in the hospital is changing and becoming more complex, more education is needed to keep up.

What do you think about making nurses with years of experience under their belts to go back to school or risk their jobs?

[DoGoodThenGo]

Nursing is governed by Provincial legislature in Canada, similar to the state BONS. Basically, the Provinces decided that the BSN is the minimum entry point for RNS. Nurses with X years of experience were grandfathered in.

Is it fair that many employers are being unreasonable? I'm not implying that it is. Just demonstrating for the sake of this discussion that's where things are heading. Employers don't care what nurses views are on this subject because the market is saturated.

Here is the thing, to hospitals (employers) they are not being unreasonable in their demands regarding the BSN. They point to all those studies from within the profession itself that equate better overall patient outcomes with BSN staffing. Am not here to start an argument and or stir those old pools but from where hospital administration/owners and more importantly those charged with running nursing services the message is clear.

While one has heard much wailing and grief about the BSN being pushed over associate degree nurses have yet (unless one missed it) seen anything from the latter's camp disputing the former's findings.

This is often where nursing goes off other healthcare professions such as medicine. Physicians work on solid science. You are free to disprove whatever theory or what have you but you need to produce equally firm evidence the previous conclusions reached were incorrect. Until then as the guy in the Sopranos says "get over it".

By and large the American nursing profession is pulling itself apart because of an unwillingness for those involved to come together and answer one basic question; is nursing still a "technical/vocational" profession or not.

It was not that long ago that any nurse who dared question a physician regarding a matter of patient usually got her head handed to her on plate. Those who did get away with it were usually well seasoned and experienced nurses whom physicians knew could "walk the walk and talk the talk". Today of course things are vastly different with even new grads supposedly being able to make decisions that previously just were not in the job description of staff nurses by and large.

As other posters have eluded to; the BSN is coming as entry into practice and or in the case of some hospitals for the continuing right to remain employed. This will likely hold true for the major urban areas at first with as usual places where people don't want to live/have declining populations either not so much or never.

Regarding those out of the way places there is something else ADN grads have to worry about; Philippine nurses. That country is cranking out BSN nurses by the hundreds IIRC and it could only be a matter of time before hospitals start going on about a shortage of "BSN" prepared nurses and being allowed to import. We have already seen places in ND start hiring Philippine nurses even over local graduates. Facilities claim not only is there a shortage but the nurses they do hire often do not stay. That is they arrive, work one or two years to get the magic number of experience then go back where they came from.

What nurses could and should do is begin battles on the state and even federal level to see to it that experienced nurses are grandfathered and or cannot be discharged for not going back to get the BSN. Funding also should be created to allow eligible ADN or diploma grads to return to school for their BSN with laws ensuring they have rights to return to their previous employer in same position (or similar) at same rate of pay and so forth.

[Cheyenne RN,BSHS]

Although the demand for nurses (of any degree) may be down and Obama-care finish off all the smaller hospital in the next decade or so, I think the glut of excess nurses will also decrease. BSN will likely become inevitable, however the type of work and pay scale won't change.

The test and license for both ADN and BSN are still the same. If the BON doesn't expect a difference, or do a different test with a separate license, why do we fight among ourselves? Maybe certification in an area of practice are a better test of nursing competency. Perhaps hospitals should value certified nurses that continue to study and re-certify and test.

Baby boomers will happily retire from nursing :) and then eventually become an even greater patient load. Geriatrics will be more prominent and ortho doctors will be as happy as a dead hog in the sunshine because all the baby boomers have 2 knees and an equal number of hips that will all need replacing to keep them young. (I hear Kaa-Ching from the cash register)

I went back for an a bachelors degree, I have used all my savings and have $30 thousand less as I look toward retirement. There is also the loss of precious hours and time that ended up used for study and doing papers and attending classes. I should have spent that time living life, sharing time with my kids and grandson, or even working more hours instead of less because of school work. The bachelors didn't teach me anything that made me a better bedside nurse and that is where the need will always be, in the trenches at the bedside. Things are changing but patient needs for one-on-one and hands-on care have not.

My 2 cents.

[DoGoodThenGo]

Small, independent community hospitals are going the way of the Dodo fast, at least in NYC. Despite all mayor de Blasio's bluster and even being arrested in protest, Long Island College Hospital still shut down.

In Manhattan, NYC there is not a full service hospital from basically Tribeca to the West Fifties on the West side of Manhattan. Supposedly NS-LIJ should be opening up their "Lenox Hill" UCC on part of the former Saint Vincent's campus but basically if you require emergency care get ready for a long and could be slow trip across Manhattan to the Eastside hospitals (Bellevue, Beth Israel and NYU). If you don't make it (and some have not and will continue not to) then it is basically too bad and too sad

[RNperdiem, RN]

Maybe the baby boomers won't be quick to retire. They will be busy paying off the student loans they had to take out to get the degree required to stay marketable in their same jobs.

[CrunchRN, ADN, RN]

As an older (I am ONLY 51!) nurse i wish they would have community college RN - BSN programs. That would be a lot more cost effective. In the interim I am holding out as long as I can because those dollars need to go for retirement. Luckily, I am not a hospital nurse so hopefully I can hold out long enough.....................

I am pursuing specialty certification in my field of practice though. My employer is paying for it and it makes a lot more sense for me. However, pursuing new jobs if/when I need to not having a BSN does limit the opportunities.

[Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN]

Maybe the baby boomers won't be quick to retire. They will be busy paying off the student loans they had to take out to get the degree required to stay marketable in their same jobs.

We already can't retire when we lost huge chunks of our 401K's and our spouses lost their jobs.

[roser13, ASN, RN]

We already can't retire when we lost huge chunks of our 401K's and our spouses lost their jobs.

You took the words out of my mouth, Esme. I've even seen threads complaining that the oldsters aren't getting out of the way fast enough these days:roflmao:

However, I will say that it's been my observation that nurses do tend to work at least part-time far longer than any other profession. Perhaps because we can, with all of the part-time positions available.

[nursel56]

Maybe the baby boomers won't be quick to retire. They will be busy paying off the student loans they had to take out to get the degree required to stay marketable in their same jobs.

And paying for family therapy due to strife related to spending children's college funds/retirement nest eggs on the degree.

[DoGoodThenGo]

You took the words out of my mouth, Esme. I've even seen threads complaining that the oldsters aren't getting out of the way fast enough these days:roflmao:

However, I will say that it's been my observation that nurses do tend to work at least part-time far longer than any other profession. Perhaps because we can, with all of the part-time positions available.

Think tale end Baby Boomers (those born in the early 1960's and reaching their fifties now) and perhaps the generation just after them will have a different idea of what "retirement" meant say versus their parents.

Am hearing more and more from those in those demographics that they will continue to work if possible close to or after their 70's. These are mostly those from the professional class and or those who run their own businesses/self employed and so forth but generally you all get the gist.

Leaving aside the financial considerations many simply *like* working. They feel it keeps their minds and bodies active rather than "sitting at home".

In order to completely cease working and retire people are going to need to replace three quarters or more of their income. Most do not have that kind of savings and or investments and indeed may still have significant debts even at 65 that will need to be sorted. No small number of late Baby Boomers either married and started families late in life or divorced and are starting over with that plan in their 40's and 50's. There is just no way unless one is *VERY well off financially they will be able to retire as their kids will be just going to college. Don't even get me started on all the parents and grandparents one knows who helped with student loans, house down payments and other funds to the "kids".

Everyone seems to think nurses are always up for an easy touch because they are never out of work and can always pull overtime if extra is needed. *smh*

[joanna73, BSN, RN]

Unfortunately, most people continue to work later than they've anticipated due to cost of living, under employment, and lack of savings. They just can't afford to retire and have a comfortable life.

I work with nurses who would love to retire and they can't. I will be one of them. I better stay healthy because I will need to work until I'm 70 for sure. All those grads counting on having employment because of all the retirees should think again.