[AngelfireRN]

And again I say, we are not ridiculing them. Egads, woman, take a powder. What's next, starting a New World Order? You don't seem to like any of the rules that are in place, admittedly don't follow some, and think that you comport yourself as someone who DESERVES respect?
My parents taught me that respect is not deserved, it is earned. You have not, in my opinion, been deserving of respect on this thread. You have expressed contempt of us all for venting and tried to tell us all how and what we should think and do. You have lined out your whole career to shore up an already flimsy facade. Silly me, after the beating you took on here, I thought you had lightened up and decided to join in for the gaeity. I see, however, that the tiger has not changed its stripes. How is it in that ivory tower?

The mods put it best....if you don't like what goes on in a thread, no one is twisting your arm. You don't have to read it. You also have no right to chastise us for letting off steam. If you want to start your own thread about us evil ones who like to talk about patients, go right ahead. I will choose not to read it, and I will have decorum enough not to challenge you and try to tell you what your beliefs should be.

If you don't choose to start your own thread, and you don't see fit to join in the spirit of the ones you read, please, stay silent. Do us all a favor. Don't be a killjoy. Take some of that respect you think you deserve and spread it around.

Like the New Radicals said....You get what you give.

May not be as profound as some you could come up with, but it works for me.

[jlsRN]

I think sick people still have a responsibility to be decent, considerate members of the human race. Illness isn't a license to by a demanding tyrant. Ill people, also, have a social responsiblity to the rest of humanity. To say otherwise is to dehumanize them, in my opinion.

Adult patients should be mature enough to understand that the world does not revolve around them, and that nurses are very busy caring for more than one patient, some of which might have critical needs.

To abuse the calllight system with trivial requests is self-centered and infantile.

[quezen]

I have to relay this story my husband told me about a stay in a German hospital (just because I am relaying it does not mean I am agreeing with it, don't get all up in arms!). The room had four beds. Three were taken up by men in their thirties and forties. The fourth bed was a demanding old retiree. He called the nurse for everything. That nurse came in after he called her to cut up his food and told him that he was there to have his heart checked, there was nothing wrong with his hands and he could cut up his own food! (The nurse can get away with stuff like this in Germany-they are considered "essential employees'"by the government of the country and have some protections we don't have in our 'corporate' society.)
The men in the room told that old man to cut it out and quit terrorizing the nurse. He called her a few more times for trivia to get even with her. One of the men, not my husband, went over to his bed and took the nurse call light and securely taped a water bottle cap over it and put it where he could not reach it. They told the guy, if you REALLY need something tell us and we will call, but what you are doing is not right and we want you to stop it.
When the nurse found out later, after hours of peace and quiet, of course she had to remove the tape, but she did get a good laugh out of what those guys did to 'protect' her!

[JustaPatient]

Originally Posted by quezen

I have to relay this story my husband told me about a stay in a German hospital (just because I am relaying it does not mean I am agreeing with it, don't get all up in arms!). The room had four beds. Three were taken up by men in their thirties and forties. The fourth bed was a demanding old retiree. He called the nurse for everything. That nurse came in after he called her to cut up his food and told him that he was there to have his heart checked, there was nothing wrong with his hands and he could cut up his own food! (The nurse can get away with stuff like this in Germany-they are considered "essential employees'"by the government of the country and have some protections we don't have in our 'corporate' society.)
The men in the room told that old man to cut it out and quit terrorizing the nurse. He called her a few more times for trivia to get even with her. One of the men, not my husband, went over to his bed and took the nurse call light and securely taped a water bottle cap over it and put it where he could not reach it. They told the guy, if you REALLY need something tell us and we will call, but what you are doing is not right and we want you to stop it.
When the nurse found out later, after hours of peace and quiet, of course she had to remove the tape, but she did get a good laugh out of what those guys did to 'protect' her!

That was cool of them to have done for her.

[JustaPatient]

One of my teachers in college works at a psychiatric facility (I am a psych major). She told me some stories of people who have MILD anxiety (she classified it as such). These people do not want to work, they claim they cannot because of their anxiety. When she told me this story I looked at her and told her those people annoy me. You see I have:

ADHD
Depression
Anxiety
and Neurofibromatosis which causes me to have many docs
appointments and potential surgeries which I have had 2
since the beginning of the calendar year (one in January one in February).

With all of that I am a full time student, and have 2 part time jobs.


NOW I REALIZE FOR SOME PEOPLE WITH ANXIETY IT IS DEBILITATING I am not saying that is not the case. She was telling me this story because she wanted me to see how strong I was to be "better" (read more functioning) then these other people.

[queenjean]

My standard response to a trivial request (something like "I need the head of my bed raised...when that button is right next to the call button) is "I'm going to let you do that."

Of course, I make sure they know where it is. Sometimes I think family and pts need to know that they *can* do those things--I've had family call to ask for the nurse to give mom a sip of water--but I think honestly they think that they might get in trouble, because they aren't sure if mom is supposed to be having water, or maybe we are measuring it and they don't understand that we do that at the end of the shift, etc.

Last week I had a family member call me to raise the head of the bed, but she honestly didn't know if she was allowed to do that.

I find the "I'm going to let you do that." typically works. If they complain, I usually follow with a "I'm sorry, but part of my job is to prepare you for home and encourage you to perform your own self care. If you need the nurse to perform simple tasks like this for you, your doctor may consider sending you to a nursing home for rehab instead of discharging you to home."

Or "Doing things like {insert activity here} for yourself is an important part of your recovery. It's part of your PT/OT/plan of care. Let me know if you need anything to help you do this for yourself."

Or, when all else fails: (with a smile and a laugh) "Oh, you must be confusing "hospital" with "hotel"! Sorry, but unless your arm falls off, that's something you are going to have to do for yourself!" I've said this before to many a pt; always with a smile and a teasing, good natured laugh, and they've always gotten the message. Now, I think since I will and do sincerely help anyone who needs it, pts typically get the idea. I'm not going to say this to someone unless I know they have been educated in what they can and cannot do, and they are just being silly and lazy at this point.

[squeakykitty]

Originally Posted by Recuerdo

This thread is making me so, so sad.

The person who was a nurse during the '50's....conditions were bad then and nobody complained. No one would dare.

The nurses of the 21st century....conditions are bad and now, much of the time, still nobody complains. Why not? Corporate management intimidation. Now, hospitals are a competitive business and the customer is always right. Different reasons...same result.

Nursing is the way it is because we have allowed it to be that way. IMO, that is nothing to self-righteously chirp about so proudly. I think it stinks for both the nursing profession, and the patients.

I have done this job since 1974 and I am still doing it.

By behaving like idiots, we have created the nursing shortage. Maybe if we lived in a society where personal responsibility was valued more than it is, people would take better care of themselves, care more about others, recognize real and necessary boundaries, and not treat those who try to help them like garbage.

Under no circumstances should a nurse ever take physical or verbal abuse from anyone. All working people are, by law, entitled to the proper breaks, and to reasonably clean and ergonomic working conditions. I don't care if they're nurses or not...it is both romantic and naive to believe and hold on to the old idea of sacrificing your life and your health because you think you are giving "service".

In a moral society, which we do not have, each person is responsible for his own life and health. Doctors and nurses can help, but they are not ultimately responsible. WE ALONE as individuals determine the outcome of our treatment. Health care professionals are just there to help.

There is nothing more destructive than that "Look how tough I am and how much I have done" attitude. It has been like a cancer in both the nursing and the medical profession for far too long. It's insane and violent in a subtly and sneaky and manipulative way. It still exists, even in corporate medicine. It is useless, egoic, immature behavior and it needs to stop.

I will celebrate its death, which I hope comes soon.

I couldn't have said this better myself. There is a nursing shortage, so I don't know why nurses can't work together for change, instead of having to put up with abuse.

[squeakykitty]

Originally Posted by jlsRN

I think sick people still have a responsibility to be decent, considerate members of the human race. Illness isn't a license to by a demanding tyrant. Ill people, also, have a social responsiblity to the rest of humanity. To say otherwise is to dehumanize them, in my opinion.

Adult patients should be mature enough to understand that the world does not revolve around them, and that nurses are very busy caring for more than one patient, some of which might have critical needs.

To abuse the calllight system with trivial requests is self-centered and infantile.

I couldn't agree with this more. There is no excuse for people to act like the northbound end of a southbound mule. Besides, they probably act like one even when they are not sick.

[neonatal3]

I enjoyed your comments, QueenJean,about ways to decrease unreasonable patient requests of nurses such as patient education toward goal of self care. As you say, some patients and families may not be clear on what is safe for them to do themselves?

Unfortunately, even after patient education about self care, some patients continue to constantly ask nurses to do things they could do for themselves. I agree with jlsRN that "adult patients should be mature enough to understand that the world does not revolve totally around them and that nurses are busy caring for more than one patient". Tough situation!

To help improve working conditions for nurses,maybe medical facilities need to do more patient education with "reality checks"? Maybe medical staff need to teach patients what the reality of medical priorities of their care by nurses is such as giving medications and treatments on time? Perhaps medical staff also need to educate patients about what the reality of personal care priorites they can do themselves is in order for them to remain as independent as possible?

[queenjean]

Oh, you are totally right, there is some sort of culture of entitlement that has developed in our society. I find myself feeding into at different times and have been trying to actively avoid that. Not being frustrated with the slow, silly college student who is taking forever at the ATM because she's on the phone. Being understanding when the local food coop is out-again-of the one item that I specifically came there to purchase. That sort of thing.

Sometimes there is nothing you can do to make someone realize that the world doesn't revolve around them. More specifically, that YOUR world doesn't revolve around them. It frustrates and angers me, those people doing their dance of anger and entitlement on my time; usually I end up just pssing them off and letting them stew; what else can you do? It's certainly not for want of trying. In my busy 12 hour shift, I'm not going to change the attitude of every completely egocentric ahole.

That's when it's nice to have vent threads, so I can say something like: did you SERIOUSLY just walk up to the desk to inform me that you are suing me for abuse because I won't let you eat because you are NPO with a diagnosis of dehydration secondary to pancreatitis? Well, you just go right ahead with your little lawsuit AND your noncompliance--eat that cheeseburger and fries your girlfriend just brought you. But guess what, your pain meds and antiemetic are only ordered every 4 hours, and the doc left a specific order that we were NOT to call him for any additional orders if you experienced nausea and pain due to your noncompliance. See, the last few (oh, maybe 10) times you were here you pulled his, and DrY is sick of it; so are we. Maybe you'll just FINALLY leave AMA and drive your puking self to another hospital. Please, be my guest. When your name was called up for admission, we drew straws; and when I lost, I cussed like a sailor at the unluck of it all and then pulled the AMA paperwork to have ready for you, all before you even got to the floor.