[Tweety]

Originally Posted by NP2BE

My friend is a stay at home dad, but only until he finishes his BSN degree, thats not what I meant. I don't care who does what to be honest with you, but are you going to tell me that if my parents told me I should try to marry a nice girl some day and raise her kids and goto daddy & me classes and that was my goal from a young age, that would be a regular occurence, and a real option?????? Tell me, please, "yes NP2BE, that is a real option for boys today I am not talking about what Should be, I am talkng about what is.

It's not necessarily an option for females these days either, and most don't want to go that route anyway. Go to any high school today and pull the females aside and ask them what they are going to do with their lives. Very few of them today are going to say "my goal is to be a housewife" or "my goal is to marry rich". You won't find the males saying "I'm going to work and look for a gold-digging female to stay at home". Most guys want a partner and most need a partner to contribute.

It wasn't that long ago that females went to college to find husbands. Most parents of high school girls aren't encouraging them to make it their goal to as you say, marry a nice (guy) and raise their kids. Most parents are encouranging their daughters to have something fall back on. Times they are a-changing.

I do see your point. Not working and staying at home is more of an option for females than males, but I don't think many females anymore are making that their life's goal. Sorry Deb, while even though men aren't looked down upon for staying at home anymore, it's still not the norm and it's a bit of an oddity, and to be honest I've never met one whose done that. But I travel in different circles, wink.

[Energizer Bunny]

My husband is probably going to become a SAHD after we move after my graduation in two years. We are thinking of homeschooling and honestly, he'll probably be able to work out of home then. I think it would be the best for our family. I'm gonna go check out the thread about SAHD's now.

[Energizer Bunny]

Oh crud..I also wanted to say that IF he cannot work from home, we won't have any options...we HAVE to have the two incomes.

[Energizer Bunny]

Originally Posted by SmilingBluEyes

I disagree, period. I honestly argued the point in my prior post, if you read it. I say again: It is socially acceptable among mature adults who are busy minding their own business and realize families take many forms and sometimes roles are not "traditional" ..... And if others disagree or make gossipy comments, why should such a man care? If his kids are his focus and priority, believe me, he is way too busy to care. He has a LIFE. He is WAY too busy with daily activities involved in raising the kids to worry about immature backward-minded people who have nothing better to do than worry about others' choices and family lives. One question: DO YOU KNOW ANY at-home DADS? If not, try to get to know one. Maybe HE can fill you in on what it's like.

From this point, I guess, we will have to agree to disagree on this one. Peace out.

Deb...once again, I completely agree with you!!! It seems to me that these people that would be "looking down upon" the men that stay at home (whether the kids are grown or not) should be minding their own business and not butting their noses in. No one should have to defend their lifestyle to anyone else unless it is physically or emotionally hurting them. UGH!!! sometimes, it's so frustrating around here!

[PickMePlze]

Originally Posted by CNM2B

Deb...once again, I completely agree with you!!! It seems to me that these people that would be "looking down upon" the men that stay at home (whether the kids are grown or not) should be minding their own business and not butting their noses in. No one should have to defend their lifestyle to anyone else unless it is physically or emotionally hurting them. UGH!!! sometimes, it's so frustrating around here!

Personally, I admire men who stay at home and take care of the kids. Being a single mom, I understand how it is. Considering how EXPENSIVE day care is , especially for families who have more than one child, one stay home parent regardless whether its the mom or dad, while the other works is sometimes the best option financially. Day care fees is a killer.

[SmilingBluEyes]

Originally Posted by 3rdShiftGuy

. Times they are a-changing.

I do see your point. Not working and staying at home is more of an option for females than males, but I don't think many females anymore are making that their life's goal. Sorry Deb, while even though men aren't looked down upon for staying at home anymore, it's still not the norm and it's a bit of an oddity, and to be honest I've never met one whose done that. But I travel in different circles, wink.

The times are changing. This much I agree with you on.

But Tweety, you are wrong when you say women are "not making it their goal to be at home with their kids" anymore. Actually, the tide, after the HUGE women's lib movement made it almost shameful to do this, is turning back. The pendulum is swinging back the other way, slowly. I know many women at my work who would KILL to be in my position and they say it all the time. I stopped working fulltime, gave up the money and the bennies to stay home with the kids more. I did NOT like my kids being in others' care 10 hours a day, 4 days a week. I did NOT like missing out on all the "firsts" that the daycare providers and preschool teachers were good enough to tell me about. Additionally, there are men on base around me who are doing this in increasing rates, too, while their wives are the military spouses.

An oddity? So what. That is the same as a man choosing to be a nurse. THAT is considered an "oddity" by some, especially those outside nursing. But it's not stopping you, is it Tweety? And it should NOT. And I HIGHLY doubt you care a lot about what people may "say" about your career choices, either.

I am sorry, my friend, but I have to take small issue with your post. We can't have it both ways. We either accept ALL people and what they do and not worry what the "norm" is, or we hold prejudiced beliefs and in turn, hold ourselves back. Today's family is far from "beaver cleaver" traditional, so we are ALL "oddities" on those standards. I don't have to tell YOU that Tweety.

And try interviewing some of us women (not in high school) who TRIED the workforce right out of highschool and college, had kids and are either home now or fighting to be there. Then see if the "majority" want to work outside the home, REALLY. The answers MAY surprise you a bit. What is great is we have the CHOICE all along the way.

I guess what I mean to say is, all people, men and women should be able to choose freely their careers and equal pay for equal work, education and experience should be a given. I don't get why that is so hard for us to understand.

[Cherish]

Please don't use the military community as an explanation on this 'new' husband staying home thing. As an Army Veteran I have seen this, but not as a reason for the husband being home. In most military posts the community that surrounds them pays VERY minimal. So for the husband to work, while the wife is in the military is not an option because the PAY IS SOOO LITTLE IN THE COMMUNITY THEY ARE IN! and most COMMONLY vice versa.

It would be common sense for the husband to stay home since daycare pay in these communities would be the equivalent or more then the pay of working. So it would make sense for the husband not to work but take care of the kiddies. Case in point Ft. Hood, TX (which by the way has the most military soldiers and the largest base in the Free World) the closest city is Austin TX which happens to be an 1hr away. There are Temple and Belton but these are small cities, and you do not make as much in these cities as you would normally (I don't even call them cities by how small and nonexistent they are-sorry for people who live there). If your spouse is stationed at Ft. Hood its more likely then not that you will be a stay at home whatever because the jobs around these communities are sometimes not available also that they pay VERY little compared to what you may be used too.

Also, since you said that you live near a military base and this is common and that people don't talk about it. Maybe you weren't a soldier but the spouse because sorry to say it but the soldiers do talk about it (male and female). Male soldiers and female soldiers (not saying all) but sometimes poke fun at the soldier (female) who is married to a husband who doesn't work. Even though it really is none of there business. That is why most spouses that are married to military soldiers who want to make a career out of it, sometimes join the military, or divorce because of the family issue (military has one of the HIGHEST divorce rates and adultery). Not saying that just because the person is a stay at home dad or whatever that means they will divorce but that can strain financially (which everyone knows can help lean towards a divorce sometimes since finance leads to stress and so on and so farth).

Yes it is true that males and females, black, hispanic, and white should get paid the same. As a black female, according to the article, I get paid less than white females, I doubt if a white female and me were both equal in every way that she would quit because she knew she was getting paid more (Could YOU do that if you were a white female DOUBT IT!). Yes this is unfair, but I wouldn't expect the person to quit, just as some people are hired just because they are a certain race or gender (if there are not enough in the company, company will meet quota).

Back to the case in point, SOCIETY still is not used to males as stay at home figures (I don't mean for just going to school, I mean as in after highschool or college that the man stays home and NEVER works again). This is NOT my opinion on the issue just REALITY. As is the REALITY of white males and females, getting paid more than black or hispanic females.

[SmilingBluEyes]

Originally Posted by Cherish

Please don't use the military community as an explanation on this 'new' husband staying home thing. As an Army Veteran I have seen this, but not as a reason for the husband being home. In most military posts the community that surrounds them pays VERY minimal. So for the husband to work, while the wife is in the military is not an option because the PAY IS SOOO LITTLE IN THE COMMUNITY THEY ARE IN! and most COMMONLY vice versa.

It would be common sense for the husband to stay home since daycare pay in these communities would be the equivalent or more then the pay of working. So it would make sense for the husband not to work but take care of the kiddies. Case in point Ft. Hood, TX (which by the way has the most military soldiers and the largest base in the Free World) the closest city is Austin TX which happens to be an 1hr away. There are Temple and Belton but these are small cities, and you do not make as much in these cities as you would normally (I don't even call them cities by how small and nonexistent they are-sorry for people who live there). If your spouse is stationed at Ft. Hood its more likely then not that you will be a stay at home whatever because the jobs around these communities are sometimes not available also that they pay VERY little compared to what you may be used too.

Also, since you said that you live near a military base and this is common and that people don't talk about it. Maybe you weren't a soldier but the spouse because sorry to say it but the soldiers do talk about it (male and female). Male soldiers and female soldiers (not saying all) but sometimes poke fun at the soldier (female) who is married to a husband who doesn't work. Even though it really is none of there business. That is why most spouses that are married to military soldiers who want to make a career out of it, sometimes join the military, or divorce because of the family issue (military has one of the HIGHEST divorce rates and adultery). Not saying that just because the person is a stay at home dad or whatever that means they will divorce but that can strain financially (which everyone knows can help lean towards a divorce sometimes since finance leads to stress and so on and so farth).

Yes it is true that males and females, black, hispanic, and white should get paid the same. As a black female, according to the article, I get paid less than white females, I doubt if a white female and me were both equal in every way that she would quit because she knew she was getting paid more (Could YOU do that if you were a white female DOUBT IT!). Yes this is unfair, but I wouldn't expect the person to quit, just as some people are hired just because they are a certain race or gender (if there are not enough in the company, company will meet quota).

Back to the case in point, SOCIETY still is not used to males as stay at home figures (I don't mean for just going to school, I mean as in after highschool or college that the man stays home and NEVER works again). This is NOT my opinion on the issue just REALITY. As is the REALITY of white males and females, getting paid more than black or hispanic females.

I am sorry, but I am not sure what you are arguing here. First, I never used the military as a reason for a male spouse to stay home. I used my personal example and those I see around as things I see going on, only.

Oh and where I am, is there no lack of opportunity that is not such elsewhere. There is plenty of opportunity to work outside the home and there are daycares all over the place. Not all bases are isolated outposts in the middle of nowhere.

I live in Seattle-Tacoma, and while the economy is tough all over, there ARE opportunities here to work outside the home. And I am a veteran of 10 years' service myself, so I am not totally ignorant to what people/soldiers/airmen say. I was around all the "rough" talk for a lot of years, enough to grow a thick shell against it.

I am saying why do mature people CARE? If a man decides to stay at home (they changed the name of the WIVES club to the SPOUSES club, give you a clue?) who cares???? why would anyone care what gossip is if he or she is busy raising their family?? People really need to GROW UP! Who CARES what "society" says, really? I say buck the system and do what works for YOU. I guess its called growing a thick skin and doing what you believe is best and right for your own family.

The divorce rate in military mirrors that of our civilian counterparts, so I don't see a valid argument here. Our marriage has survived numerous deployments and a war. What is the point? A man should work outside the home to prevent a potential divorce? I guess I dont' get what you are saying here.

I still say if men choose to stay at home, bravo and I am sure they don't care a lot what others say. Would that others be so mature and able to pursue what works for them unfettered by ignorance and predjustice around them.

[Tweety]

Deb I pretty much agree with all you have to say. And I agree if a man says his life's goal is to find a working wife and stay and home and raise babies, while an oddity, he certainly should be free to pursue those dreams. But honestly how many guys have you heard with that goal in life? Now interview some dads who already have a wife and kids you'll get a different answer.

I'm not saying moms these days don't want to stay home with their kids. That is the desire of a lot of families. I agree that if you interview parentless people and parents, you will definately get two different responses. Many people are realizing for the betterment of their families it's best to sacrifice material gains and careers and have one parent at home, or working part-time.

But I also think high school and college females are realistic to know that it isn't always possible and they need to be prepared to work. Or that having kids is not the primary career goal they have. Many are prepared to be working moms, or stay at home moms until they are older, or whatever.

When I was at spouse's colledge graduation the other day clearly the overwhelming majority of the people getting Masters were females, and probably half the undergrads were female as well. Stats are even showing that females are now the majority of college students on many campuses.

I hope you didn't think that by calling househusbands an oddity I was implying they shouldn't have their freedom of choice or be judged. I think you know better than that. LOL

[Cherish]

I am not giving an opinion, and really don't feel as passionate about the issue as you are have posted from your REPLYs to everyone. I think everyone else is really not stating more or less there OPINION but REALITY. You are stating your OPINION, which is great, but if you look at the WHOLE picture, you will see that in REALITY society is not willing comforting the stay at home dad. NOW my OPINION would be I don't care if your a stay at home, mom, dad, dog, or cat, but that you take care of your family and finances, and that you enjoy life. THAT is what matters (but thats my OPINION; Society sees it another way and that would be the Reality of it). LOL....
THIS WILL BE MY LAST POST SINCE I DON'T WANT A DEBATE BECAUSE IT REALLY ISN'T THAT SERIOUS. SERIOUS WOULD BE THAT CHIMPANZEE's ARE ABOUT TO BECOME EXTINCT IN 50 YRS AND SO ARE a TYPE OF KILLER WHALES IN ALASKA, and BELUGA WHALEs. OR THAT THE EARTH WAS ABOUT TO FLY IN THE SUN.