[Jolie]

To the OP,

When I read your initial post, I was certain that you were either being misled by your hospital leadership about the state law on vitamin K (and eye prophylaxis), or you were misunderstanding it. I now know better.

As to your initial question about what would we do in your scenario: My answer is nothing. Although there is clearly a state mandate regarding these treatments, I would defer to hospital administration, and not touch the baby, the vit K syringe, or the erythromycin ointment with a 10-foot pole!

What a mess we make when we turn healthcare over to lawmakers!

[Elvish]

Remind me to stay put when I have my next baby.
Where I am, if mom doesn't want baby to get VitK, Emycin, or HepB, we just document that she declined and move on. Some nurses get their knickers in a bigger wad than others, but I personally have WAAAAY bigger fish to fry. And really, the human race obviously didn't die out before we started doing all this stuff to these babies.

[HappyNurse2005]

Well, i would first use good ol' Google to look up and see if it is truly a state requirement.

Then, i would have them sign a ama/refusal of treatment form. State requirement or not, we cannot do anything to them against their will. So I wouldn't do it. If you do it against their will, its assault.

[OzMW]

[quote=IndigoCarmine;2836410]Thanks so much for all your responses.

I'm in New York State where Vitamin K is mandated, unlike vaccines which can be refused. Seems that the law was based on this study (the link is to an abstract. There's a pdf file with the actual article on site). At the time of the incident, Nursing Admin came to the unit brandishing copies of both the hospital policy and the state law. It's in NY State Public Health codes. Peds did speak to the parents then literally washed her hands of it, refusing to even document that she had discussed the issue with them.

(that's fine. It was documented that she spoke with them elsewhere)

quote]

And people wonder why parents come armed with lawyers letters and get all antsy about stuff...unbelievable...so would I......

[OzMW]

Originally Posted by Jolie

OK, I read these links, including the article which summarizes New York State's "research" on hemorrhagic disease in the newborn, and "justifies" the policy of forcing vitamin K on all newborn infants, regardless of parental consent. It is downright scary! This "research" includes infants with DIC and intraventricular hemorrhage as examples of disease processes which "justify" this mandate. Do these researchers not know or not care that these infants were likely critically-ill premature infants who received vitamin K, and developed life-threatening complications of prematurity completely unrelated to their vitamin K status? They also included babies who experienced hemorrhage whose vitamin K status could not be determined. Isn't that convenient to their agenda?

The link on eye prophylaxis states that it is to be administered immediately upon delivery, and advocates the use of silver nitrate! Just how out-dated and barbaric is that?

I seriously question the qualifications, experience and mind-set of Mary Applegate, MD PhD Medical Director of the Bureau of Women's Health, and Frederick J Heigel, Director Bureau of Hospital and Primary Care Services.

Like I said earlier- a load of crappola! Despite all the vitamin k in the world some kids will get bleeding disorders- research my ar**e!!!! This stuff makes me wanna puke........and its those parents who refuse this, because they've informed themselves with "real" research and facts;that are then treated like criminals. Far out...anyone got Dr Applegates email addy - we could email and ask for clarification....oops...the study is that old shes probably dead!!!!

[cherokeesummer]

Originally Posted by Belinda-wales

Treating normal labors as though they were complicated can become a self-fulfilling prophecy.(Rooks)

Oh I agree, and I don't go in with that thought, I'm a pp nurse so I have nothing to do with the labors but this is what I've learned from the nurses around me.

[cherokeesummer]

Originally Posted by Jolie

OK. I didn't read the link yet.

This is sounding like a case of heavy-handed legislation written and passed by people with no medical knowledge or consideration of scientific evidence. (Huge surprise there, right?)

There is absolutely no medical or scientific reason to mandate that vitamin K be given within the first hour of life. And anyone with experience in L&D or a birthing center can attest that this is the very time frame during which its administration(and erythromycin ointment, for that matter) is likely to interfere with bonding.

What boneheaded legislation.

I'm beginning to see the parents' point!

Yeah I agree...ours is never given in the one hour frame, usually they don't come to admit nursery til 45 mins to 1 hour of life anyway,then we get them assessed and first bath and then comes the meds, so they are usually 2.5 hours old by that point.

[OzMW]

Originally Posted by cherokeesummer

Yeah I agree...ours is never given in the one hour frame, usually they don't come to admit nursery til 45 mins to 1 hour of life anyway,then we get them assessed and first bath and then comes the meds, so they are usually 2.5 hours old by that point.

How come this isn't done in the delivery suite in front of the parents? So do the parents not get to see the first bath? The parents and the baby are actually separated so admission procedures can be done??

[danissa]

We give Vitamin K within 6 hours post delivery, as per protocal, and if consented as I said before. Don't see the hurry for giving it in the first hour.

[Elvish]

Originally Posted by OzMW

How come this isn't done in the delivery suite in front of the parents? So do the parents not get to see the first bath? The parents and the baby are actually separated so admission procedures can be done??

Oz - this depends on the facility. Some facilities are strictly rooming-in, which as I'm sure you know means mom & babe don't get separated at all and there is no nursery except for sick babies. So in this case all is done at bedside.

Other places it can be done in LDRP room or in nursery. Depends on parents' choice. Most of the time parents choose to send baby to nursery for bath, shots/drops (I don't know why).

The place where I delivered my son (would NOT go back knowing what I know now) would not allow baby to be bathed in room c mom, and would not allow baby to go to mom's PP room unless he'd been bathed already. He's considered biohazard. (And this stuff coming out of my vagina is.....what?) I didn't know any better then, but hoo boy. When I found that out it twerked me and I won't be delivering any future babies there.

I really have a problem when hospitals treat families as if they baby is not theirs but the hospital's. In any case, we have 2 hours to do the Emycin drops and 6hrs for the VitK per our p&ps.