[westcoastgirl]

I would like to hear from other NPs as well as any PAs here on the forum.

the administration is shoving an employment contract in front of our faces that does not address pay except as "I agree to work for $____ per year at ___FTE".

there are the standard incentives and other details, but I am very concerned about the pay. One of the administrators is a proven liar and has recently "shared" payscale information that is clearly wrong to the tune of $10k - $20k below market rates for mid levels. It is beyond frustrating this administrator is also in charge of the contract signing.

Can any of you share information regarding contracts and especially what clauses there were to ensure fair pay?

[core0]

Originally Posted by westcoastgirl

I would like to hear from other NPs as well as any PAs here on the forum.

the administration is shoving an employment contract in front of our faces that does not address pay except as "I agree to work for $____ per year at ___FTE".

there are the standard incentives and other details, but I am very concerned about the pay. One of the administrators is a proven liar and has recently "shared" payscale information that is clearly wrong to the tune of $10k - $20k below market rates for mid levels. It is beyond frustrating this administrator is also in charge of the contract signing.

Can any of you share information regarding contracts and especially what clauses there were to ensure fair pay?

I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying that they are not paying what is agreed on in the contract or are you saying that they are offering a number that is under what other companies pay for NPPs? Two very different concepts.

David Carpenter, PA-C

[westcoastgirl]

there are two related issues.

A. fair pay. we were assured a market survey would be done by the end of 2007 to reflect this. Well it was and it was not at all accurate.

B. the contract. The contract does not reference the survey, and didn't even include when pay raises would go into effect.

We are worried that by signing the contract, it would imply some sort of tacit agreement with the ridiculous figures presented in A, the "survey" data.

In some of our near competitors' contracts, both the terms (CME, vacation, license fees) and pay (with clear figures for seniority, experience, etc) are included in the same contract.

Given the nefarious track record of our administrator we are very concerned, justifiably.

[core0]

Originally Posted by westcoastgirl

there are two related issues.

A. fair pay. we were assured a market survey would be done by the end of 2007 to reflect this. Well it was and it was not at all accurate.

B. the contract. The contract does not reference the survey, and didn't even include when pay raises would go into effect.

We are worried that by signing the contract, it would imply some sort of tacit agreement with the ridiculous figures presented in A, the "survey" data.

In some of our near competitors' contracts, both the terms (CME, vacation, license fees) and pay (with clear figures for seniority, experience, etc) are included in the same contract.

Given the nefarious track record of our administrator we are very concerned, justifiably.

By signing the contract, you agree to the terms of the contract. If it has salary lower than you think that it should or other terms that you disagree with (ie cme etc) then don't sign. I have occasionally seen contracts that say something on the order of pay will be x or above the 50% of survey y whichever is greater. However, a practice would have to be fairly stupid to sign that.

I guess I still don't know exactly where you are going with this. You state that competitors contracts are included in the contract. This really has no place in a contract. A contract is an agreement between two parties to essentially exchange services. In this case its about exchanging your work for their pay + benefits. All of the other things you are discussing don't belong in a contract.

They may be stating that they will base your future raises on a "survey". In that case you have reason to be leary of referencing the survey into the contract. In that case you would have to honor any "raises" that come from this. It sounds like what you are really referring to is a bargaining agreement which is traditionally agreed between a union and an employer. It covers how raises and other benefits will be assessed.

Ultimately for any given contract you have the option of either accepting, declining or make a counter offer. Any item is open for negotiation. However, if they present it as a take it or leave it, if you challenge it you have to be prepared to walk away. I cannot emphasize this enough. If you push this and then cave, you will be fatally weakened in any future negotiation (in my opinion). Options include soliciting other employment in order to increase their offer. It really depends on the situation.

Without more specifics on the situation and how the survey works in the contract, its hard to give any other advice.

David Carpenter, PA-C

[westcoastgirl]

David you have offered good advice above.

I think you have indeed answered my question. We can argue for the specific $ amount on the contract, but if the contract does not specifically mention any surveys then by signing it, it does NOT mean we agree to all sorts of future annual "survey data" the clinic shows us.

I don't want to share more details on the internet, but yes the mid levels are indeed prepared to walk away. Some of the doctors too.

[core0]

Originally Posted by westcoastgirl

David you have offered good advice above.

I think you have indeed answered my question. We can argue for the specific $ amount on the contract, but if the contract does not specifically mention any surveys then by signing it, it does NOT mean we agree to all sorts of future annual "survey data" the clinic shows us.

I don't want to share more details on the internet, but yes the mid levels are indeed prepared to walk away. Some of the doctors too.

Exactly. You are only agreeing to what is in the contract. If the contract states that you are agreeing to raises according to the survey then its binding. Otherwise you can't be held to anything you didn't agree to (normal disclaimer - not legal advice since I'm not a lawyer and legal advice is against the TOS). Also pay attention to the time frame of the contract. Generally there is a time period for re-evaluation of salaries (at the least). For example if you sign a two year contract for x amount then you can't expect a raise after one year. In my previous position there was an evaluation every year and a raise based on the evaluation. If the salary had fallen below the mean we had the opportunity to bring that up (never had to). The new salary was then issued as an addendum to the original contract.

If you have any PAs in your group then you might have them get an AAPA salary survey. This is generally considered the most accurate salary data. It will give you something factual to argue with anyway.


David Carpenter, PA-C