[SBinGA]

I'll admit it. I'm not a nurse. I did want to be a nurse at one time, but now Im going the RT route. I researched nursing for a long time before making the decision NOT to become one. Considering the fact that most of you complain (on here at least) of not getting fair treatment, of getting cursed out by doctors/patients, of being overstressed, overworked and not getting they pay you feel you deserve, why oh why won't you join a union? Why do you come here to vent about administration or policies when it doesn't have to be that way? I want to know what makes you feel that you don't deserve to be heard.

Iron workers have a union, boiler-makers have a union, auto workers have a union. Not to sound holier-than-thou-, but most RN have more education than those that I've previously mentioned. So, why is it that you refuse to unite, and stand against a system that seems to disrespect you? I have to know.

SB

[Shaggyb2000]

I don't want to get beat up for not staying in lock-step with whatever the union bosses have decided to do. Getting buried under the in-zone of a football field is not the future I want.

[wildmountainchild]

I would definitely join a union. You can thank labor unions for your 40 hr work wk (as opposed to 140 hrs!). And also thank them for having a weekend, before labor unions people worked EVERY day of the week for up to 16 hours a day. No vacation, no sick pay, no maternity leave, etc, etc.

I feel that unions are maligned a lot of the time, BUT in the end, power comes in numbers, individuals rarely make sweeping changes happen.

I know of a lot of nursing unions. I guess I just don't know of a national nursing union. Which is too bad, because there are waaaay more nurses than there are doctors and the AMA (not techinically a union) has thwarted the health of this nation for a hundred years. If nurses came together under then same united banner that doctors have for so long as a political lobbying force, we would have had universal health care by now.

[Dolce]

I won't join a union for several reasons. First of all, unions are heavily political. I do not want my union dues going to candidates that my union supports but I don't personally agree with.

Secondly, I feel that if nurses want to be treated like a PROFESSION they should start acting professional. IMO unions are not professional. You mention boiler-makers and iron workers as members of unions and that is very true. Both of those occupations are trades, not professions. I believe one of the reasons nurses don't get the respect they would like is because they are viewed as vocationally-trained help instead of professionals.

I would like to add the caveat, though, that I am grateful for the benefits that unions have provided us and the pioneering efforts they have made to make the workplace safer.

[HM2Viking]

I won't apply for ANY non union position. As to the criticisms about political advocacy my point is that unions like any other organization are run by the people who show up to meetings. If you don't agree with a position taken by the union look in the mirror? Did you attend our meetings? Did you submit proposals?

Unions are small d organizations. If you don't bring your ideas forward then you have no standing to complain.

Professionalism is not incompatible with union membership. (See AMA, ABA etc. for examples of professional unions.)

In Solidarity....

[Blee O'Myacin]

Police officers have unions and they are considered professionals. They require a batchelor's degree for most departments and more than that if you ever want to move into a supervisory position.

I have a friend who is a physician in Australia. They are unionized over there and is shocked that it isn't compulsatory here as well. And these are the docs and we can universally agree that no matter where you are in the world, docs are considered *professionals*, unionized or not.

Despite the valid negatives that come along with having a union, I like that there are cut and dry rules that both the employee and management are held accountable for. "Shared governance" means nothing other than your professional life is at the whim of management.

Even union "bullies" need to play by the by-laws. And after reading a copy of the letter sent to upper managment by the union addressing the issue of "answering the phone with a smile in my voice" and the scripting of patient interactions being detrimental to patient care for all of the patients in a particular nurse's assigment, I'm quite comfortable having the union there if I ever needed it. I'm dying to see the response letter.

Blee

[mianders]

Originally Posted by HM2Viking

I won't apply for ANY non union position. As to the criticisms about political advocacy my point is that unions like any other organization are run by the people who show up to meetings. If you don't agree with a position taken by the union look in the mirror? Did you attend our meetings? Did you submit proposals?

Unions are small d organizations. If you don't bring your ideas forward then you have no standing to complain.

Professionalism is not incompatible with union membership. (See AMA, ABA etc. for examples of professional unions.)

In Solidarity....

The post made by Dolce was correct. Union dues do go to endorse canidates that a lot of people do not agree with. You can say showing up to meetings will change the status quo, but it has been my personal experience that it will not. Unions ALWAYS endorse Democrats. Unions and any other organization that have such a diverse population of members should not endorse one political canidate over another. Professionalism is not incompatible with union membership, but not voting Democrat is.

[diveRN]

No unions for me.

- Seniority blows: When it comes to getting the best positions, shifts, and vacation time, time in service should have no bearing.

- My union dues do what, exactly? No choice, no thanks.

- I can stand up for myself. If I screw up and get an ass chewing by some doc and/or patient, I'll take my licks... I have a thick skin, something I think relatively few nurses have. However, if I don't screw up and get an ass chewing just for doing my job, you can bet that doctor and patient will get an attitude adjustment followed by a formal complaint to the hospital administration. If you haven't practiced your, "excuse me and with all due respect doctor..." speech, that's your fault.

- As mentioned, unions are for the trades, not professionals. The AMA and ABA are NOT unions, they are associations. If these associations told their members to go on strike, they'd get laughed into oblivion. Do these associations provide a retirement to their members?

I have no issues with the AMA, ABA or groups like them, but I choose to take responsibility for my own career choices. If I don't think I'm being treated fairly, I'll address it, rectify it, or find another job. If I don't think I'm being paid enough, I'll go find another job. Compared to other lines of work, RNs probably have the largest number of career opportunities within a profession.

I believe if we're going to elevate how the public views RNs and the work we do, we need to be professionals and act like one. When was the last time you heard a doc whine about being treated unfairly, overwhelming paperwork, or having to see 40 patients in one day? I've heard them talk about it, but never whine.

[diveRN]

Additionally, I think unions foster mediocrity.

I have several teacher friends that belong to the CTA. They are dedicated, excellent teachers who often spend a significant amount of their own money and invest a lot of their own time into their kids. They don't get paid overtime for the additional efforts they put in, in fact one teacher's contract says she only has to work from 0730 to 1415, she gets a 1 hour lunch break and one period without kids. She's actually with her students only 5 hours each day and gets 3 months off in summer and 2 1/2 weeks at Christmas ... and that's established by contract. Oh yeah, and she doesn't have to pay into social security.

The one friend I'm talking about puts in far more time than that, without a doubt, but her contract says that she doesn't have to. According to her, there are a number of tenured teachers who only do the minimums... we're paying those teachers north of $60k a year for 25 hours work a week, 8 1/2 months a year.

Good return on the investment?

Another reason I'm down on unions is because I've heard the, "it's not my job" line too many times. As a new nurse, I worked at a hospital where the aids were union, but the RNs weren't. Post mortem care was NOT in their job description. The PCU with a 1:3 ratio was slammed one night when my palliative care pt finally expired. I had a full code trach/vent/PEG that was on the bubble so I asked an aid (who was doing her online training) to get the morgue litter and move the body downstairs. The answer I got? You guessed it.

From that point on, I vowed I'd never work in a union.

[Spidey's mom]

diveRN I couldn't have said it better.

I start my RN-BSN program shortly and the first class is Professional Nursing.

Nursing is, according to my text, is more accurately classified as an "emerging profession."

Characteristics of a Profession:

1. Authority to control its own work
2. Exclusively unique body of knowledge
3. Extensive period of formal training
4. Specialized competence
5. Control over work performance
6. Service to society
7. Self-regulation
8. Credentialing systems to certify competence
9. Legal reinforcement of professional standards.
10. Ethical practice
11. Creation of a collegial subculture
12. Intrinsic rewards
13. Public acceptance

"Unfortunately, nursing fails to have a standardized education for entry into the profession. Like many other professions, professional nursing requires that its members have intelligence, deep personal commitment, mutually shared valued, and specialized skill to make autonomous decisions to serve society."

Not to start a debate about our education . . . .


I don't see anything about union membership.



steph