[Indy]

I have a question. Who can tell me why the CNA seceded (sp?) from the ANA, and how this developed?

[lindarn]

Originally Posted by Nancy2

It was not meant to be "snobby". I chose to go to college and become a professional for many reasons, none of which involved being in a union or associated with teamsters. If I had wanted to be represented by teamsters, all I had to do was go to truck driving school. As for the "steelworkers", the unions made it so difficult for the companies to turn a profit that the whole industry has practically been outsourced overseas. Healthcare cannot be outsourced and that is a pretty big draw for unions who have lost sooooo much $ due to decreasing membership. I am not fooled by their retoric. I have been a professional and a patient advocate for 20 years and would never give power of attorney to a union to speak on my behalf with my employer. If unions get into hospitals and do what they did to the steel industry, the government will have to take over hospitals and that would truly be sad!!!!Not to mention scary!

So, you went to college because you didn't want to be considered lowlife blue collar worker? Do you have your BSN. or are you an ADN or Diploma grad? I have news for you, the rest of the medical professional world went to a Masters as entry into practice, and now are going to a DOCTORATE AS ENTRY INTO PRACTICE. The public may think that nurses are wonderful, but ask them if we should make $70- 87, 000 year, like they do. Nurses ARE blue collar trailer trash compared to the rest of the health care professionals. Like it not. Every time I hear people say, " where did you get your nurses' 'TRAINING', I could cringe. Dogs and monkeys are trained, nurses are educated. But that is the publics perception of us. Since that is what they think of us, we might as well use labor tactics that work, just like the rest of the blue collar world does.

New grads are leaving the profession in droves over working conditions, respect, pay, and benefits. There is no incentive to remain in a hospital as a bedside nurse. What, exactly do you plan on doing to encourage new nurses to stay at bedside nursing? I am all ears. At least the CNA and California nurses are putting their money where their mouth is and effecting change in a big way. Who cares what anyone thinks? I would rather have staffing ratios, higher pay, and better benefits, other workplace improvements, that have ALL BEEN OBTAINED BY CNA, than continue the way we have!!

The Nancy Nurses of the nursing profession have prevented nurses from aligning with the labor organizers who know how to negotiate with hospital big wigs to get better contracts for nurses. The negotiation team that we had in Spokane with the Washington State Nurses Association were worse than awful. They were weak, wishy, washy, and easily pushed around and intimidated by the male hospital negotiaters. We got nothing, and continue to get nothing year after year. I left 4 years ago and will never go back.

The younger nurses leave after 5- 6 years, nationwide, in disgust and disallusionment. How do you plan to improve the working conditions and pay to encourage the young nurses to stay in the profession? How do plan to encourge experienced nurses to not seek easier employment in out- patient surgery centers, doctors offices, etc? Or going back for Masters Degree, ARNP, and CRNA degrees to obtain better pay and working conditions that are in their control. Do you plan on accomplishing all of this by yourself? You must have delusions of grandeur.

If nurses are not paid well enough to be rewarded for the hard work they do in a hospital, they will seek out easier employment outside of the hospital, and the cycle will continue to fuel the exodus out of the hospital, and continue the practice of hospitals crying wolf about the "nursing shortage".

Hospitals will seek out foreign nurses to fill the staffing voids, and continue to drive down wages and working conditions, and our profession will continue to be de- skilled and dumbed down with lesser educated individuals amd will continue to encourage young nurses to leave for greener pastures. Has it occurred to anyone, that maybe that is exactly what the hospitals have in mind? Just some food for thought.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

[explorer]

Originally Posted by lee1

Has anyone joined this National Nursing Organization yet?? They say that they have over 60,000 members.
They want to provide a National Nursing Union however at some point in the future to help nationalize standards for nurses

Do they have a web site?

[VILLA]

Originally Posted by lindarn

So, you went to college because you didn't want to be considered lowlife blue collar worker? Do you have your BSN. or are you an ADN or Diploma grad? I have news for you, the rest of the medical professional world went to a Masters as entry into practice, and now are going to a DOCTORATE AS ENTRY INTO PRACTICE. The public may think that nurses are wonderful, but ask them if we should make $70- 87, 000 year, like they do. Nurses ARE blue collar trailer trash compared to the rest of the health care professionals. Like it not. Every time I hear people say, " where did you get your nurses' 'TRAINING', I could cringe. Dogs and monkeys are trained, nurses are educated. But that is the publics perception of us. Since that is what they think of us, we might as well use labor tactics that work, just like the rest of the blue collar world does.

New grads are leaving the profession in droves over working conditions, respect, pay, and benefits. There is no incentive to remain in a hospital as a bedside nurse. What, exactly do you plan on doing to encourage new nurses to stay at bedside nursing? I am all ears. At least the CNA and California nurses are putting their money where their mouth is and effecting change in a big way. Who cares what anyone thinks? I would rather have staffing ratios, higher pay, and better benefits, other workplace improvements, that have ALL BEEN OBTAINED BY CNA, than continue the way we have!!

The Nancy Nurses of the nursing profession have prevented nurses from aligning with the labor organizers who know how to negotiate with hospital big wigs to get better contracts for nurses. The negotiation team that we had in Spokane with the Washington State Nurses Association were worse than awful. They were weak, wishy, washy, and easily pushed around and intimidated by the male hospital negotiaters. We got nothing, and continue to get nothing year after year. I left 4 years ago and will never go back.

The younger nurses leave after 5- 6 years, nationwide, in disgust and disallusionment. How do you plan to improve the working conditions and pay to encourage the young nurses to stay in the profession? How do plan to encourge experienced nurses to not seek easier employment in out- patient surgery centers, doctors offices, etc? Or going back for Masters Degree, ARNP, and CRNA degrees to obtain better pay and working conditions that are in their control. Do you plan on accomplishing all of this by yourself? You must have delusions of grandeur.

If nurses are not paid well enough to be rewarded for the hard work they do in a hospital, they will seek out easier employment outside of the hospital, and the cycle will continue to fuel the exodus out of the hospital, and continue the practice of hospitals crying wolf about the "nursing shortage".

Hospitals will seek out foreign nurses to fill the staffing voids, and continue to drive down wages and working conditions, and our profession will continue to be de- skilled and dumbed down with lesser educated individuals amd will continue to encourage young nurses to leave for greener pastures. Has it occurred to anyone, that maybe that is exactly what the hospitals have in mind? Just some food for thought.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

WOW! I sense a lot of frustration in your posting with whats happening to the nursing profession. I have been in Oncology for 16 years. This devision of medicine is intense but apparently not as bad as nursing. This concerns me since I am entering the nursing program in May( career change). I have heard very minimal from a positive point of view from the nursing profession, so much so that I am wondering if I am making the right decision. I love patient care and know that I make a difference to the indiiduals that I interact with daily. But it seems that the nursing profession is becoming very cut throat and may not be right for me. Nurses perform a much needed service and impact in the lives of others in a multitued of ways. It is sad to hear that they are not recognized for their dedication and hard work. Unfortunatley, understaffing, longer hours and bad working enironment makes the situation worse. You can't blame anyone for wanting better working conditions. It seems like its a catch 22 situation regardless of how you look at it. I have heard so much about nurses eating their young, a topic which had me concern. Now I read this posting and it just intensified the feeling of uncertainty I started to expirience recently. I have worked with many nurses and I am aware of the issues concerning the profession, but fighting amongst yourselfs will set you back.Gain a united front and stand together on issue so that you can make a difference. The strength and power is there; it comes with the numbers and nurses outrank many other professions in numbers.. The profession would benifit as a whole. I am new to this forum and I joined to observe and seek advice from professionals in an occupation I hope to be a part of. I am just voicing my feelings and mean no disrespect to anyone. I just want to read some positive and uplifting advice. I am petrified at this point. Thank you all for listening.

[lindarn]

Originally Posted by explorer

Do they have a web site?

Yes, they do. We should all support them and their quest for a national nurses union. I haven't seen UAN do anything spectacular, and don't trust anything associated with the ANA. CNA is the only nurses union to do anything out of the ordinary that got front page news all over the country.

NSNA, the union for NY State, has obtained 100% employer paid health care for all the nurses organized with them, and it is non negotiable at contract time. NYSNA, and CNA should band together until NNOC gets its feet of the ground. NYSNA would take the eastern half of the country and CNA would take the west, and Alaska and Hawaii.

I don't know what the nurses in Hawaii were complaing about with CNA. From what I remember, when I worked and lived in California, the Hawaii nurses were coming over to the mainland (California) in droves, because the pay and working conditions were the pits in Hawaii. I wish that they would come to Washington. Anyway, I have checked out their website. See for yourself, and what their goals are. It sounded good to me.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

[lindarn]

Originally Posted by Indy

I have a question. Who can tell me why the CNA seceded (sp?) from the ANA, and how this developed?

CNA seceeded from ANA for one simple reason. In 1994, when "care re -design" took over safe nursing units and patient care, nurses were laid off all over the country, mandatory overtime became the hospitals way of staffing the units, and ANA did nothing to stop it.

To make matters worse, the boards of nursing looked the other way as hospital pretty much took people in off the street, and made them, nurses aides. Unlicensed assitive personnel on the front lines of patient care, and health care went to hell in a handbasket. Even today, medication aides, are passing medications to the elderly in nursing homes and assistive living faciities, and making huge mistakes. How can the ANA and the Boards of Nursing allow individuals to pass meds, under the pretext that it is just like a family member giving them thier meds? They are selling our professional practice to the highest bidder.You figure it out.

In summary, all of these very unsafe practices were instituted by the hospitals and insurance companies, against the complaints by the nursing profession, and ANA did nothing. Whose side were they on? Not the nurses. Not the patients.

Therefore, I believe that CNA, and the California nurses, decided that since ANA was not on their side when they needed them, and was not there for them when they needed them. They decided that they did not need ANA. Why should part of their dues go to an organization that so poorly supported the staff nurses in California, and essentially, abandoned them, as they had abandoned the rest of the nurses in the US.

Other state nursing assocciations have also seceeded from ANA. Maybe someday maybe all of the state nursing associations follow through as CNA did, seceed from ANA, as CNA did. They will lose all of the money from the dues that now only goes to the state organizations that are separate from the ANA. ANA will finally get what it deserves. An association that is only supported by a handful of staff nurses and management. And no money. Maybe then they will finally listen to the staff nurses. And the state nursing associations, with the money they used to give to ANA to work against the staff nurses in the US, will be used to lobby for legislation that supports and protects the staff nurses and patients.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

[suebird3]

Originally Posted by BadBird

Never heard of them.

I never heard of them, either.....only read about them here. But....guess what?!?!?!?! Their fliers finally got down to about 40 miles SW of Chicago yesterday.

Yup, got a flier regarding a bill being put through Illinois Legislature......on April 15th! Kinda late, eh?

I will wait on this one!

[Sherwood]

The NNOC was formed by the California Nurses Association in order to organize nurses beyond the borders of California. Many unions are accusing the NNOC of being "union raiders" see www.stopunions.com/flyers.htm for a message from the Ohio Nurses Association accusing the CNA/NNOC of being "interlopers"
Recently the National Labor Relations Board Counsel General made a ruling that will seriously affect the CNA, possibly causing them to return thousands if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in dues money. It seems that the Neutrality Agreement the CNA and the SEIU made with Tenet Healthcare was deemed "unlawful assisstance to the union". One Los Angeles area hospital has already announced that based on this NLRB decision they will no longer recognize the CNA as the bargaining agent for the Registered Nurses at that hospital. They will also cease deducting union dues from Nurses paychecks beginning May 13th, 2005. See www.stopunions.com for more information.

[RN4MERCY]

Originally Posted by Sherwood

The NNOC was formed by the California Nurses Association in order to organize nurses beyond the borders of California. Many unions are accusing the NNOC of being "union raiders" see www.stopunions.com/flyers.htm for a message from the Ohio Nurses Association accusing the CNA/NNOC of being "interlopers"
Recently the National Labor Relations Board Counsel General made a ruling that will seriously affect the CNA, possibly causing them to return thousands if not hundreds of thousands of dollars in dues money. It seems that the Neutrality Agreement the CNA and the SEIU made with Tenet Healthcare was deemed "unlawful assisstance to the union". One Los Angeles area hospital has already announced that based on this NLRB decision they will no longer recognize the CNA as the bargaining agent for the Registered Nurses at that hospital. They will also cease deducting union dues from Nurses paychecks beginning May 13th, 2005. See www.stopunions.com for more information.

Why would TENET want to give "unlawful" assistance to a union? God knows they don't need any more trouble with the law; they probably spent millions of dollars they made from doing unnecessary heart surgeries on union busters. Do you think that was some form of retribution on their part? By the way, CNA is an invited guest throughout the country, anywhere that nurses practice in an environment that is a barrier to true patient advocacy. "Interloper" is hardly the correct word. Let's discuss ideas instead of slinging mud at, or trying to shut down the messenger. Dr. Patricia Benner describes advocacy power as the kind of power that stands alongside and enables. The posts by lindarn are thoughtful and right on! The California Nurses Association has a vision for healthcare. What's in it for you anyway, to be a barrier to our constitutional right to association? Do you want to stop unions so you can get rid of that nagging little voice in your head that's telling you, "maybe I'm on the wrong side?" You could be a tree that bears good fruit! Nurses in many states have chosen to disaffiliate with the ANA for good reasons. If nurses choose to form an alliance with like-minded visionaries and empowered patient advocates to protect professional practice and improve patient care they deserve all the help we can give them. We're all better off because of them. Lead, follow, or get out of the way! www.calnurses.org

[Sherwood]

The unlawful assisstance to the unions I refer to is the Neutrality agreement that the CNA and the SEIU demanded of Tenet Healthcare a couple of years ago. This "neutrality agreement" gave the CNA access to the hosptitals that they otherwise would not have had. This deal was coerced from Tenet when they were already in deep trouble. So this "unlawful assisstance" was a deal cooked up and demanded by the unions.
After much legal wrangling what many including myself have been saying all along. THIS DEAL WAS AND IS ILLEGAL.
The vision for Nursing and healthcare that the CNA is spewing is neither benificial to Nurses or the public the CNA so badly claims it is fighting for. It is purely self serving rhetoric used only to fill the coffers of the CNA/NNOC who's leader is not a Nurse. Rose Ann Demoro is a former teamster who started off as a grocery store cashier.

Sherwood