[HM2Viking]

I have been reading Jeffrey Sachs' new book. Common Wealth Economics for a Crowded Planet.

Anyway given the somewhat vehement opposition to taking the country in a better direction I found the following information intriguing. In comparing US Economic performance to the Nordic Countries or Countries who follow a social welfare model the following data was intriguing.

P 262
In terms of wealth and per capita income, the social-welfare states again defy the stereotype that high taxation leads to lower living standards. On average the social-welfare states have a higher per capita GNP than the free market countries...The poorest 20 percent of households in the social-welfare countries take in around 9.6 percent of the national income, as compared to only 7.3 percent of the national income in free market countries.

(That means the average household in the social welfare countries brings in about 24,465 vs. 17,553 for a free market country.)

Broadly based strategies for prosperity have yielded superior economic performance. The social welfare countries have very high technical innovation and patent creation. (Pull your cell phone out of your pocket. If its a Nolia or Ericsson its from a scandinavian country.)

From page 263

Free Market R&D 1.8% GDP

Social Welfare R&D 3.0%

Advantage Social Welfare model.

World Economic Forum Technology Average Rank (1 best)

Free Market 16

Social-Welfare 6

Advantage: Social Welfare Model.

Maybe just maybe we can learn something from our scandinavian neighbors about how to build an economy that has a broad based prosperity model.

[CHATSDALE]

the scandinavian countries are denying immigrates entry into their country unless they have a high education or marketable skills so that they will not become a dreg on society
maybe we could learn something from our scandinavian brothers

[HM2Viking]

Elsewhere in the same chapter Mr. Sachs point out just how much more as a percentage of GDP is spent on direct foreign aid by the Scandinavian countries than we do in the US. They carry their own ethics and standards about caring for their citizenry abroad to needy countries.

Immigrants as a rule (both legal and/or undocumented) are not eligible for public assistance in the US for at least 5 years by law. Immgration policy has been addressed ad nauseum in other threads. Undocumented Immigration is driven by the wholesale destruction of the agricultural economy of South and Central America by the NAFTA/CAFTA accords AND the endless need for cheap labor in the agricultural sectors of our economy. There have actually been numerous studies conducted that found that immigrants are both net contributors to our society AND use public services at a lower rate than native born Americans.

To bring this back on thread the social-welfare states have both higher rates of innovation AND (much) lower poverty rates than the US. The central point of my op was that managing our economy for broadly based prosperity was a desirable change based on evidence from the world stage.

[ZASHAGALKA]

I read an article about "common wealth" in Time magazine. It was quite evident to me that is a code phrase for 'world income tax'.

http://www.time.com/time/specials/20...2057-1,00.html

No thank you. It will never pass in America. Not this decade. Not in 50 yrs. It's not about the tax even. It's about the principle. Americans know that a 'world income tax' would be little more than an American income tax. Look at the U.N. WE provide far more funding for it than any other member nation.

No thank you. Just the idea of a world income tax would be enough to tank an election. Obama supports it. He has supported legislation with that as a goal. You won't hear him talking about it in the next several months. Why not? He wants to win and this issue is a big loser.

My created wealth is mine. I dismiss the notion that my hard efforts should be shared, regardless the efforts of others and regardless of my free will, out of hand.

~faith,
Timothy.

[VivaLasViejas]

When I hear the term "common wealth", I can't help making a connection with Communism.

I don't mind sharing what wealth I have, but I do mind being compelled to share it and dictated to as to whom I must share it with.

[ingelein]

I dont think anyone should be forced to do the right thing, its trying to get some folks to understand that doing the right thing, is simply just that, the right thing.Maybe it would be a start to just STOP corporate welfare and the bail out of Wall Street. Also maybe we could share the funds we spent/wasted on the war, on something that would benefit all, like health care. How much is the grand total now a Trillion?

[ZASHAGALKA]

Originally Posted by VivaLasViejas

I don't mind sharing what wealth I have, but I do mind being compelled to share it and dictated to as to whom I must share it with.

Amen. That bears repeating.

~faith,
Timothy.

[ZASHAGALKA]

From the book referenced by Viking:

"the recognition that we share responsibilities and fates across the social divide will need to be extended internationally so that the world as a whole takes care to ensure sustainable development in all regions."

Sounds like a call for a world income tax.

In fact, what does the author do for a living? He works for the U.N. in the very dept that would be charged with spending the World Tax of 0.7% GNP:

http://www.nationalledger.com/cgi-bi...e=22&num=18845

"Jeffrey Sachs, who runs the U.N.’s “Millennium Project,” says that the U.N. plan to force the U.S. to pay 0.7 percent of GNP in increased foreign aid spending would add $65 billion a year to what the U.S. already spends. Over a 13-year period, from 2002, when the U.N.’s Financing for Development conference was held, to the target year of 2015, when the U.S. is expected to meet the “Millennium Development Goals,” this amounts to $845 billion. And the only way to raise that kind of money, Sachs has written, is through a global tax, preferably on carbon-emitting fossil fuel."

~faith,
Timothy.

[Spidey's mom]

Originally Posted by VivaLasViejas

When I hear the term "common wealth", I can't help making a connection with Communism.

I don't mind sharing what wealth I have, but I do mind being compelled to share it and dictated to as to whom I must share it with.

Here it is . . .repeated.


steph

[HM2Viking]

The central point remains that vast inequality and poverty in the developing world leads us as a nation to foreign entanglements and wars.

Arguably the roots of terrorism and political instability are nourished by vast inequality and povery. Robert Heinlein in Starship Troopers made this very point when he asserted that all wars are caused by population pressures.

The point of my original post was simply this: That the free market system is failing in the US. We must ask how and why we can do better in building a broad based prosperity for the US. (I think that the social welfare countries with a 5% poverty rate vs the 17% in the US are safer and more prosperous than our country.) If we take a look at what is happening in the third world where vast inequality and poverty are rampant that has led to social instability. If we continue down the path of ever increasing inequality in our own country we will reap similar results.