[bollweevil]

Originally Posted by Noryn

I think you missed my point. I didnt say it wasnt hard--in my other post I even admitted it was too much for me and I am a RN. My point was the work/pay ratio. These aids work for like 8 dollars an hour and bust their butt, RNs around here get about 20-25 dollars and also bust their butt. Lpns about 13-15. So yeah us RNs do have hard work but at least we make a decent amount of money.

Some nurses are making twice that much. Your pay is way too low, but if you are happy, right on.

[Suesquatch]

Originally Posted by bollweevil

Some nurses are making twice that much. Your pay is way too low, but if you are happy, right on.

Depends on where you are, bollweevil.

[Noryn]

Originally Posted by bollweevil

That's a great idea to work side by side with her and show her how to do it. Rudeness should not be tolerated, door slamming, cursing, shouting, none of it belongs on the job, especially toward our bosses.

I wonder, forgive me for thinking it, is it possible our memory has faded a little, Noryn? Maybe you really did do it all and get out on time but did you do it all from the start or was that after doing the same assignment for a while? Did you get a meal break and/or rest breaks or did you donate an hour a day to the job for free? Just asking, no insult intended. I find that some of my own memories are beginning to develop some fuzzy edges. I noticed it with my parents and in-laws when I was a new mom and they were telling me how to be a good parent. Their memories of how they raised us just weren't so clear.

Your post confuses me . I dont think I ever posted I was able to do it all and get out on time. But to answer your question, I think, like I said it was just too much. I couldnt give the care I wanted to give, I was behind once I started. Did I get a full 30 minute break? Depends, right before I quit no I didnt as there was noone to cover for me. Did I get rest breaks? No.

Did you mean to quote me?

[Noryn]

Originally Posted by bollweevil

Some nurses are making twice that much. Your pay is way too low, but if you are happy, right on.

My point is, regardless of who are you in long term care--aide, lpn or rn your work is hard. But at least as a RN you get paid halfway decent. In my state though the median pay for RN I think is around 21-22 dollars an hour.

[ingelein]

Originally Posted by Noryn

Your post confuses me . I dont think I ever posted I was able to do it all and get out on time. But to answer your question, I think, like I said it was just too much. I couldnt give the care I wanted to give, I was behind once I started. Did I get a full 30 minute break? Depends, right before I quit no I didnt as there was noone to cover for me. Did I get rest breaks? No.

Did you mean to quote me?

At the risk of being a bud-insky, I think Bollweevil was quoting CapecodMermaid, the OP.


Originally Posted by CapeCodMermaid http://allnurses.com/forums/images/b...s/viewpost.gif

I'm a relatively new DNS, but I've been a nurse for 25 years and have had every nursing job there is to have in LTC and then some. How do all y'all deal with disrespectful staff? I don't mind a spirited discussion but I am mighty tired of nurses saying "How do YOU know?" Mind you I've been a nurse longer than they've been on the planet. They complain about everything, feel 'entitled' as new nurses, and are so rude it's unbelievable. One of them today was complaining and said she was over worked because she had 33 patients on a 2p-10p shift. I explained to her that she had no sick people, no IVs, no trachs, no dressings...she said 'Why don't YOU try it'. I told her that I had worked on a true sub acute floor and had 30 patients for meds, treatments, 5 IV's with antibiotics every 4 hours, 2 fresh trachs, 3 central lines for TPN, 2 people at life's end from AIDS AND I had to do my own MDSs. She said "You did that and got out on time?" Yes I did I told her. "Then you must be a better nurse than I am and besides it was probably 20 years ago." I was speechless. I wanted to tell her I AM a better nurse than she is and it wasn't that long ago. Instead I told her if she was going to speak to me in that tone of voice, she could leave the office. She slammed the door on the way out. I am at my wit's end on how to deal with these totally unreasonable fresh nurses. Any advice?

[delta32]

CCM I have read thru all the posts on this tread. With each responce that you were given you have come across rude and condescending. While you may have handled 30+ patients years ago. things are not the same anymore. You seemed to have escalated the situation rather than listen to the nurse when she spoke to you. Your superior attitude is not going to win people over either.

[chip193]

I've read this thread with great interest. To give my background before I get onto my soapbox, I'm in a leadership role, at night, in a busy emergency department. In my past life, I served in all sorts of leadership roles in the EMS world. So, for the past 19 years, I've been leading people.

You may have noticed that I choose the word leadership over the word manage. People hate being managed. People like being led. Part of being a good leader is knowing the difference between the two and allowing people to develop.

Managing is focus on what the person is doing wrong and how to punish for what has been done wrong. Leading is having the employee make the right choices based on the framework that you have provided for them.

The folks that work with me do the right thing because it is the right thing to do. They take exceptional care of the patients, they make sure the families are informed, they explain delays, and they are always looking to go the extra step to make sure that everything is taken care of. Why? It is the culture that the leadership team has created. Our leadership is never too busy to talk to a staff member. If we cannot answer the staff member’s question on the spot, we make sure that we get the right answer and let the staff member know what the answer is.

As for doing clinical work – we do lots of it. When an RN went home sick last week, who picked up her assignment? Who watches over patients when the primary nurse gets a real sick patient? If a staff member has a question about a procedure or an assessment finding, who do they call on?

Yup, it’s our leadership team. I’ll admit, it’s fun to watch the Department Director transfer patients to the floor in a Talbot’s suit and heals, but it’s what we do. It is how we lead.

Part of leading is developing staff. Our Charge Nurses are probably the most empowered group of Charge Nurses that I have ever run into. When they come to me with a question about how to deal with a situation, the answer is usually “what do you want to do about it?” rather than a concrete “do this”. Why? It continues their empowerment and makes them able to replace me one day.

It seems that CapeCodMermaid is managing. It seems that rather than lead, she is looking to motivate through negative reinforcement. This was typical of the “Head Nurse” type of management that is still epidemic throughout healthcare.

I’ve never heard “I used to do that and more” or “I don’t see why you can’t do that” at my job. We focus on what can be done and fixing what needs to be fixed.

Does your staff have the equipment that they need to do their jobs? As silly as it may sound, our folks had problems finding thermometers. How did we handle it? We got more. There were reliability problems with our transport monitors. How did we handle it? Biomed now replaces the batteries quarterly.

Yeah, you may have taken 50 patients every night, with one hand tied behind your back, and had to do multiple dressing changes, tube feeds, and even answer the phone. Your staff doesn’t want to hear that.

You can’t start motivation and leading with the big things. You have to start with looking deep inside yourself and realizing that you may not have been doing things the best way.

I’ve heard many of my peers from other departments laments on the current state of the nurses. Many of them sound like CapeCodMermaid. They blame the lack of respect, lack of caring, lack of work ethic on the newest employees. We don’t have the same problems. It is our culture – the staff members hold each other to standards – and their standards are much tougher than the hospital’s! They come to our department and watch the staff and how they interact with each other. Usually, the comment is something to the effect of “my staff isn’t like that”. Then I will generally say something like “do you lead them to be this way? We do.”

But, what do I know. I’ve only been a leader for 19 years.

[ingelein]

I know I don't need to defend CapeCodMermaid, and this is really not a defense , BUT she has some REALLY great and innovative ideas when it comes to patient care issues, BUT when the "I am the DON and do not have to get my hands dirty anymore" attitude come out, thats when one loses alot of respect by staff nurses .A unit runs so much smoother when there is MUTUAL respect.

[CapeCodMermaid]

Zowie..a lot of opinions out there. First of all until any of you deal with the nurses I'm dealing with you won't get it. They have contracts and can do what the please knowing there really is nothing that will get them fired (don't scoff...it's unbelievable but true)
Secondly I am neither rude nor condescending when speaking to my employees. You are NOT me so you don't know what I am capable of and I am telling you that I could handle the 30 patients she had that night and take a dinner break and get my notes done and help the CNAs. As far as the not getting my hands dirty part...think again. I answer call lights every time I walk down a hall. I take people to the toilet. I do the treatments when the nurses are busy. I mop up the spills before someone falls...the staff nurses, I might add, usually walk by and call housekeeping.
Flame away but I am seeing it more and more that nurses are not as prepared to deal with things as they used to be.
I started out as an aide...I've been a staff nurse, a nurse manager, a supervisor, the MDS coordinator, the SDC, the assistant DNS and now the DNS. I can't help it if all y'all can't do what I do. I can't help if all y'all want to tolerate rudeness. The nurses do not want to listen to anyone. I try and try to teach them the best, safest way to do things and their attitude is "yeah....right....we already know that" Well if you already know why is it you can't write a skilled note? Why is it you can't use proper clean technique for a dressing change? Why is it that you check someone's blood pressure for a Metoprolol parameter find the pressure is 70/50...hold the Metoprolol but give Lasix and HCTZ. Why is it you demand that the CNAs treat you with respect but you feel no qualms about being downright rude to the ADNS and DNS? Why? Because everyone else has allowed you to treat them that way and they let you give the excuse "I'm busy"
I don't really expect any rational answers from any of you. Most of my staff tell me I'm the best DNS they ever worked for. Why? Because I'm out there every day helping them...trying to get their salaries raised...treating them like profession people with brains...

[Suesquatch]

Originally Posted by CapeCodMermaid

I don't really expect any rational answers from any of you.

Not fair.