[wincha]

Originally Posted by lizz

I respect people's right to oppose unions, but I don't always understand it. According to the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics union workers made, on average, $9,000 a year more than non-union workers last year. Union RN's made $7,000 more on average than non-union RN's. This is data from the U.S. Labor Dept. So ... people are often just shooting themselves in the foot when they oppose unions. But, if that's the way they want it ... so be it. I hope the lower pay check is worth it.

I really don't agree with unions in general. Recently our grocery stores striked. Why? Because they had to pay copays for their doc appointments. Also wanted higher pay to work at the checkout. The costs then come down to the consumer. Why should I have to pay for higher groceries so the workers who only have a high school degree should have a higher working wage? I only thing I see that could be good for unions is for better ratios and working conditions. However how does the "Food service union" help with this. This is the union that has come into St. Louis. Also the hospital where they have the union do not have better patient ratios. This hospital has always been a bad place to work and continues to be with the union. There are other hospitals that listen to the nurses and I work at one of those. The pay is pretty standard in this city across the board.
The cost of living is nowhere near CA also.

[MissPiggy]

Originally Posted by lizz

Geez ... that sounds like it might be illegal. We just had a case in California where a judge ruled that management could not restrict employees from discussing the union. This was an a union facility but still ... I wonder if any employer can get away with that.

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2005...1505185425.txt

They do here because nurses are so brainwashed to be anti-union. It is very frustrating, because if you are PRO union, you will have a difficult time getting hired. They are obviously afraid of SOMETHING.

[Sheri257]

Originally Posted by wincha

I really don't agree with unions in general. Recently our grocery stores striked. Why? Because they had to pay copays for their doc appointments. Also wanted higher pay to work at the checkout. The costs then come down to the consumer. Why should I have to pay for higher groceries so the workers who only have a high school degree should have a higher working wage?

You really think the grocery store passed those cost savings to the consumer? You don't think at least some of the cost savings went instead to the CEO's multi-million dollar salary or to the shareholder's?

I think it's a big leap to assume that the grocery is so generous that they lowered your bill. Cutting the health care costs is about delivering bigger profits for Wall St., not cutting prices for shoppers on Main St.

[Sheri257]

Originally Posted by MissPiggy

They are obviously afraid of SOMETHING.

If the unions come in and get the $7,000 more a year that union RN's make nationwide, then a hospital that employs, let's say 200 RN's ends up paying about $1.4 million more a year. Add to that better benefits and it gets even more expensive.

So yeah ... they're afraid ... cause they don't want to pay.

[wincha]

Originally Posted by lizz

You really think the grocery store passed those cost savings to the consumer? You don't think at least some of the cost savings went instead to the CEO's multi-million dollar salary or to the shareholder's?

I think it's a big leap to assume that the grocery is so generous that they lowered your bill. Cutting the health care costs is about delivering bigger profits for Wall St., not cutting prices for shoppers on Main St.

No I am not saying my bill would be lower but higher. The grocery stores are also local no multi million dollar CEO's or shareholders. All companies are raising their health care copays ect.. due to higher insurance rates and yes the CEO's of these health corporations are making the $$$.
But then again why should grocery store workers that only have a high school degree make an inflated salary just because they belong to the union?

[mercyteapot]

Originally Posted by wincha

No I am not saying my bill would be lower but higher. The grocery stores are also local no multi million dollar CEO's or shareholders. All companies are raising their health care copays ect.. due to higher insurance rates and yes the CEO's of these health corporations are making the $$$.
But then again why should grocery store workers that only have a high school degree make an inflated salary just because they belong to the union?

The top salary for a cashier at the supermarkets here is $17 an hour. Hardly outrageous for someone whose been on the job for years. The newbies start at just above minimum wage, and it will be years before they can move far enough up the totem pole to qualify for benefits. I have no idea what level of education these people have attained, I am sure your claim that they "all" only have high school degrees isn't true, because when you're talking about thousands and thousands of people, there is just no way you can make a blanket statement like that with any validity.

[caroladybelle]

Originally Posted by wincha

No I am not saying my bill would be lower but higher. The grocery stores are also local no multi million dollar CEO's or shareholders. All companies are raising their health care copays ect.. due to higher insurance rates and yes the CEO's of these health corporations are making the $$$.
But then again why should grocery store workers that only have a high school degree make an inflated salary just because they belong to the union?

Because they have families to feed, medical bills and if we do not pay them a living wage, they will end up on food stamps and subsidies that we finance via taxes.

Because they get treated like garbage by the public and by those that think that they should be paid a pittance since they have only limited education.

Because some of them have a higher education and cannot get a job due to economic cutbacks.

Because people should be paid well for working very hard in a difficult, demanding, thankless job...regardless of education.

(kind of like nurses and especially nursing aides).

Unions gain power among the workers for reasons, generally related to lousy treatment. If the workers were treated better, they would not go union.

[ali_gator]

Originally Posted by lizz

And 80 percent of the nurses in this state don't belong to a union and don't have to pay union dues to benefit from it, which is why lots of RN's want to work here.

In the end, California nurses have the last laugh.

It's called "free riding." I'm sure the nurses who pay their union dues and support the CNA resent this, and rightfully so.

[pickledpepperRN]

I'm very glad tens of thousands of us pay dues and worked for the safe staffing law. All patients and nurses in California benefit.
Either hospitals follow the law and respect their nurses or many nurses will quit or unionize.

[wincha]

Originally Posted by mercyteapot

The top salary for a cashier at the supermarkets here is $17 an hour. Hardly outrageous for someone whose been on the job for years. The newbies start at just above minimum wage, and it will be years before they can move far enough up the totem pole to qualify for benefits. I have no idea what level of education these people have attained, I am sure your claim that they "all" only have high school degrees isn't true, because when you're talking about thousands and thousands of people, there is just no way you can make a blanket statement like that with any validity.

For a job that only requires a high school degree? For a job where you check out groceries? Now if you move up into management thats a different story, more responsibilities higher pay I agree with this. Is this a CA person who thinks $17 isn't that much where they live?