[SmilingBluEyes]

[quote=Hellllllo Nurse]Yes, that is exactly what you are doing.

As I've stated before, I believe that if every nurse had a BSN, then we would have a bunch of BSNs being treated badly.

I believe that the issues leading to "Nurse Abuse" are for more complex and multi-facted than just entry level education requirements.




I agree with you on this. It is indeed more complicated than just the educational issue. BUT I do believe we need to be baccalaureate or higher to start on the road to recognition as a true profession. I have really changed my opinion on this over the last couple of years, I realize. I have always been pro-ADN, and still am, but I can see where we need to advance our entry level in order to be considered the profession on the level of PT, Pharmacist or OT, Dietary or other medical professionals. But yes, it' s very complicated....why nurses get abused is not just due to the many entry levels existing into practice now.

[catcolalex]

until nurses stop fighting with each other, and start fighting together as a whole, the profession will not improve. How many times has an ER nurse badmouthed an ICU nurse or vice versa, or an ICU nurse badmouthed the floor nurses, or management etc. until all that stops good luck with the professional advancement. One only needs to look at how we treat each other to see how professional we are. how can we expect others to treat us as professionals when we dont act like it?

[eternity1]

As someone who has a BS in Exercise Physiology ("what's that?" you say), and
a Massage therapist, who also has several years experience in rehabilitation, but is not allowed to work/get paid as a 2-year degree prepared PT assistant... I have BEEN here before and it looks like I'm about to get into the thick of it again. I am starting a BSN program in Jan. I will only have to take the core Nursing classes b/c of my previous BS. As an Exercise physiologist, I got no respect from many PT's or OT's -or PT assistants for that matter. Neither did I receive respect from Master's prepared EP's. I am entering the nursing profession as a means to enjoy more hands on patient care that also has some versatility and pays well. Am I making a huge mistake?!

[Spidey's mom]

Originally Posted by catcolalex

until nurses stop fighting with each other, and start fighting together as a whole, the profession will not improve. How many times has an ER nurse badmouthed an ICU nurse or vice versa, or an ICU nurse badmouthed the floor nurses, or management etc. until all that stops good luck with the professional advancement. One only needs to look at how we treat each other to see how professional we are. how can we expect others to treat us as professionals when we dont act like it?

Just as in any profession, being rude to each other is not professional. I agree with your post - just don't want to point the finger at nurses only.

Deb - you really crystalized some thoughts I've been having lately. About going on with my education but NOT getting a BS in nursing. It wouldn't make an iota of difference for me as a staff nurse or in increasing my pay. So, getting a Bachelor's in something else is looking appealing. Not to leave nursing - I'd still be a nurse but just have some other direction I might take it. Gotta think some more about that.

I don't think having a BSN is the answer to nursing being seen as more professional.

Each of us as individuals have to do that. You can't be taken advantage of unless you allow it.

steph

[lossforimagination]

I am entering the nursing profession as a means to enjoy more hands on patient care that also has some versatility and pays well. Am I making a huge mistake?!


You said it..... but I can't in all good conscience recommend nursing to anyone.

[eternity1]

Originally Posted by lossforimagination

You said it..... but I can't in all good conscience recommend nursing to anyone.

Maybe if I enter the professional already cynical- it won't be such a letdown

[SmilingBluEyes]

Please do not enter nursing cynical!!!! And I am sorry if we appear so, honestly. Understand, venting is normal and this is an appropriate place for us to do so. Better this than take it out on loved ones or our patients.

As for me? Well, as a not-new nurse, I welcome fresh ideas, new people, I YEARN for them. I LOVE seeing new people come to work with me and can see some of them BURSTING with enthusiasm and new ways to do things.

My advice to new or want-to-be nurses? Just enter "advised" and prepared. That is my BEST advice to. Oh and I welcome you!

[SmilingBluEyes]

Originally Posted by stevielynn

Just as in any profession, being rude to each other is not professional. I agree with your post - just don't want to point the finger at nurses only.

Deb - you really crystalized some thoughts I've been having lately. About going on with my education but NOT getting a BS in nursing. It wouldn't make an iota of difference for me as a staff nurse or in increasing my pay. So, getting a Bachelor's in something else is looking appealing. Not to leave nursing - I'd still be a nurse but just have some other direction I might take it. Gotta think some more about that.

I don't think having a BSN is the answer to nursing being seen as more professional.

Each of us as individuals have to do that. You can't be taken advantage of unless you allow it.

steph

Steph, I took a break from my RN-BSN program, (my Mom said what an idiot I am, that about helped me decide I am doing right, roflmao!). I see it as total waste of my money and time. I really was bored and can't' stand the thought of having to take more of my personal time from my family to do MORE clinicals, hours and hours of them. BLECH......I am not lazy; I love to study, but I am in NO way interested in doing community health and other clinical hours. Not at this point in my life, probably never. I have too much else going on as team mom for the kids' basketball, cheer, and soccer teams and homeshooling them, not to mention, being a military wife. My life cannot stop for this junk.....

I really want to study more liberal arts or bio sciences, as I said before. Given my druthers, I would study foreign languages and biology. I think these would bring MUCH more to my practice and stimulate my mind so much more than the drivel I get in my RN-BSN. It's really indoctrination, if you ask me. And professors drumming into our heads the "only professional nurses have BSN's"----well, I find that so self-serving and so very ivory-tower. NOT helpful to our profession at ALL! Maybe I am too old to be indoctrinated? I do not know........ah I digress, so sorry.....

Do I know all a BSN-prepared RN knows about nursing? Well, that would depend on the BSN nurse , I suppose. WHO KNOWS IT ALL? And who knows much when she is more book-educated but inexperienced? I still say, ALL baccalaureate studies should be welcomed and embraced, not just BSN, if we are to really unite. Education is the key, and there is more than ONE way to get it! So many RN's enter nursing with ADN's but other bachelor's (or HIGHER!) degrees. They are just as educated as the BSN, really, just in other things, actually likely bringing MUCH more with them in the way of educational experiences. Why NOT embrace this? JMO....I know....

[TechieNurse]

Just a quick review of my career and my 2 cents:
I went to a 3 year, hospital affiliated ADN program.
Worked for two years Med-Surg. (almost another requirement, isn't it?).
Then, worked agency, Neuro ICU, doctor's offices etc. while I finished up my Bachelors degree.
After getting my degree and went into the business world. for over 10 years.
Now, I'm back in a hospital setting as an autonomous manager.

I can tell you that for breadth of clinical experience, I thought my ADN program was excellent.
I think to work in a clinical, patient contact setting, any level of education for a nurse would suffice. I think experience is also critical.
However, because I wanted a 'regular' schedule (no nights, weekends or holidays), it was a necessity to get my degree.

Do I see a difference in the way I'm treated? Not by clinical staff, but without a doubt, there is a difference in how I am perceived in the business world.
Also, as difficult as it was to work full time and raise my son alone, I've never regretted getting my degree.

Nurses are an interesting cross section of people.
Some have a 'calling', all they want to do is help people. It seems tacky to demand better compensation etc.
Some are just working for extra money (think part timers) and may have the flexibility to change jobs quickly.
Some work becuase they have to (think primary caregivers for children)

Because we all have different ideas of what nursing is and isn't and because we all have different motivators and goals, it is extremely difficult to unify us.

I think there is a shortage of "bedside" nurses, but I do see many nurses working in non-bedside positions, even non-medical ones. No shortage of them.
I think the trick of easing the shortage of bedside nurses is to make bedside nursing more appealing. For a lot of people (but not everyone), that means more pay.
More pay usually means a higher level of education is required, but we're saying that we want to make bedside nursing attractive, to mean that means offering better pay without the nurse having to do anything else (like go back to school).

We can't grow as a profession when we're in crisis (think Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs). Ease the crisis, then work on the self-actualization of the profession...

[boulergirl]

You said it..... but I can't in all good conscience recommend nursing to anyone.

It is comments like this that make me nervous.

I was talking with a co-worker last night and she wanted to know why I wasn't going to school to become an LPN or RN. She told me I was wasting my time continuing on in my current job as a nurse's aide in assisted living (I work nights, and I'll admit, it's getting boring). When she asked me that, all I could think was the barrage of complaints I've heard on these boards about the rigors of nursing school and the horror stories from hospital nurses. I don't know...