[kriseh]

Originally Posted by GilaRN

It is pretty hard. However, do not look at these people as "normal." Anybody who allows somebody to smack them around time after time has complex phychosocial issues. Many of these people do not think or feel like us, and changing beliefs and behaviors that are so ingrained can be nearly impossibe. Much like attempting to convert a christian to islam or visa versa. Some of these behaviors are as deeply rooted as any religious belief.

and
"I see these victims similar to drug addicts--they have to WANT change. No matter what you do for them if they don't WANT to leave their abusive s/o they won't. "

I'm sorry, but these generalized statements are ridiculous! I have been in an abusive relationship before and it was awful. I DID want to change, but when you are with an abusive man, alot of times it gets worse when you leave and it's easier to just deal with what you have now. Also, with physical abuse comes emotional.
They usaully don't start out abusive and then when you fall in love with them, they turn on you and are awful to you and you think "why does this person I love not love me, what's wrong with me". So, you may try harder to please them. I knew I was too good for him, but I wanted to prove to him I was (which, of course, would never happen).

Yes, you have to have some issues to be in that kind of relationship and with it brings even more issues, but I was a normal person with an ability to realize it was bad and to want out. I can't even begin to tell you how much WORSE it got when I left him and how long it took for him to leave me alone. That may be what's really weighing on these women's minds.

I am so glad I'm out now and will never allow that to happen to me again, but most of these ladies are not "drug addicts" or "unable to think and feel like us"- they are women just like many of us, but in a terrrible situation that seems hopeless and endless to them.

Let try compassion and not judgement, especially if you don't have any idea of what's really going on!

[crb613]

I would like to ask those of you that have been in these abusive relationships a few questions please...If you had a place to go & financial support would you have left? My daughter is in one of these marriages.....I am furious to say the least....I don't get it.....she was not raised in an abusive home, was never put down, as a matter of fact she was more the princess type.
She has left a couple of times...came to my house in a different state....then goes back & I become the bad guy when all I do is try to help & keep her safe. I really just do not get it....when some one tries to kill you or hurts you.....how in the world can you even think of living with them or trusting them.....and why would you turn on your family & choose the abuser over the people that really love you, & have & would do anything to help you??????
I am so mad & her for staying in this mess & even more for keeping the kids in it......if I did not care for myself (which I don't get) I would definitely put my children first!!!! I am furious.....and since the last time she left & came to my house (Christmas)then went back......I have not heard from her. I am some how trying to run her life and she is mad at me of all people! All I can figure out & I detest to even think it....she evidentially likes the drama or she would leave because she has the means & support to get out. Thanks for letting me vent!

[Angie O'Plasty, RN]

Originally Posted by crb613

I would like to ask those of you that have been in these abusive relationships a few questions please...If you had a place to go & financial support would you have left? My daughter is in one of these marriages.....I am furious to say the least....I don't get it.....she was not raised in an abusive home, was never put down, as a matter of fact she was more the princess type.
She has left a couple of times...came to my house in a different state....then goes back & I become the bad guy when all I do is try to help & keep her safe. I really just do not get it....when some one tries to kill you or hurts you.....how in the world can you even think of living with them or trusting them.....and why would you turn on your family & choose the abuser over the people that really love you, & have & would do anything to help you??????
I am so mad & her for staying in this mess & even more for keeping the kids in it......if I did not care for myself (which I don't get) I would definitely put my children first!!!! I am furious.....and since the last time she left & came to my house (Christmas)then went back......I have not heard from her. I am some how trying to run her life and she is mad at me of all people! All I can figure out & I detest to even think it....she evidentially likes the drama or she would leave because she has the means & support to get out. Thanks for letting me vent!

Maybe--- He's threatening anyone who helps her.

Here's a good resource to help people understand what may really be going on and how to help the abused person protect herself:

http://www.ndvh.org/

http://www.ndvh.org/educate/fandf-educate.html

[Angie O'Plasty, RN]

http://www.ndvh.org/educate/abuse_quiz.html





How is your relationship?

Does your partner:

• Embarrass you with put-downs?
• Look at you or act in ways that scare you?
  
• Control what you do, who you see or talk to or where you go?
• Stop you from seeing your friends or family members?
• Take your money or Social Security check, make you ask for money or refuse to give you money?
• Make all of the decisions?
• Tell you that you’re a bad parent or threaten to take away or hurt your children?
• Prevent you from working or attending school?
• Act like the abuse is no big deal, it’s your fault, or even deny doing it?
• Destroy your property or threaten to kill your pets?
• Intimidate you with guns, knives or other weapons?
• Shove you, slap you, choke you, or hit you?
• Force you to try and drop charges?
• Threaten to commit suicide?
• Threaten to kill you?

If you answered 'yes' to even one of these questions,
you may be in an abusive relationship.

For support and more information please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE (7233) or at TTY 1-800-787-3224.

[Angie O'Plasty, RN]

At one time, long ago and far away and in a relationship with someone else, I could answer "yes" to each and every one of those questions.

If you think you are being abused:

The reason that I tell you is to let you know that I've walked a mile in your shoes. There is escape. There is healing. There is a better life for you, too.

[gr8rnpjt]

Originally Posted by crb613

I would like to ask those of you that have been in these abusive relationships a few questions please...If you had a place to go & financial support would you have left? My daughter is in one of these marriages.....I am furious to say the least....I don't get it.....she was not raised in an abusive home, was never put down, as a matter of fact she was more the princess type.
All I can figure out & I detest to even think it....she evidentially likes the drama or she would leave because she has the means & support to get out. Thanks for letting me vent!

Chances are, when times were relatively good between them, she told him everything you did wrong to her in her life, and he has a running dialogue that comes out in a tidal wave before and after she goes to see you. Whether you know it or not, her life was not as perfect as you saw it. I am sorry to be blunt and hurtful, but there are always two sides to every story Yours may be more correct, but hers is the only one that counts in this situation. If he is not welcome in your house, you can be sure he reminded her of everything that you do that makes her mad. And she went home to him and the first thing he asked is what happened and she told him everything you did that she disagreed with. She told because it guaranteed her a warm welcome home, and it reinforced to him that he has the upper hand. He will catalogue everything in his memory bank and use it against you the next time you try to interfere when they are fighting. He will remind her of your shortcomings and that he is always there when she comes back from a visit with you to comfort her for a day or two. Then two days later is buisiness as usual and he doesn't care because he won that battle. She is getting what she wants, he is getting what he wants. I understand your frustration more than you know. But that is the dance, and they both know it so well...

[gr8rnpjt]

Originally Posted by GilaRN

It is pretty hard. However, do not look at these people as "normal." Anybody who allows somebody to smack them around time after time has complex phychosocial issues. Many of these people do not think or feel like us, and changing beliefs and behaviors that are so ingrained can be nearly impossibe. Much like attempting to convert a christian to islam or visa versa. Some of these behaviors are as deeply rooted as any religious belief.

I resent this type of thinking and I hope you do not work in a capacity that puts you in the vicinity of abuse victims. These women are more normal than you think. They are our neighbors, our daughters, our sisters, and our mothers. This kind of thinking is just the type of behavior that keeps victims down and perpetuates the abuse.

[rph3664]

Originally Posted by Angie O'Plasty, RN

http://www.ndvh.org/educate/abuse_quiz.html





How is your relationship?

Does your partner:

• Embarrass you with put-downs?
• Look at you or act in ways that scare you?
• Control what you do, who you see or talk to or where you go?
• Stop you from seeing your friends or family members?
• Take your money or Social Security check, make you ask for money or refuse to give you money?
• Make all of the decisions?
• Tell you that you’re a bad parent or threaten to take away or hurt your children?
• Prevent you from working or attending school?
• Act like the abuse is no big deal, it’s your fault, or even deny doing it?
• Destroy your property or threaten to kill your pets?
• Intimidate you with guns, knives or other weapons?
• Shove you, slap you, choke you, or hit you?
• Force you to try and drop charges?
• Threaten to commit suicide?
• Threaten to kill you?

If you answered 'yes' to even one of these questions,
you may be in an abusive relationship.

For support and more information please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE (7233) or at TTY 1-800-787-3224.

I really like this list because it is gender neutral. Men can certainly be abused by women (although women are more likely to be mentally abusive, which can be worse) and most people don't realize that abuse is as rampant in the gay community as it is among straight people. There was a fatal case of DV in my town a few years ago involving a lesbian couple; the bigger one would get drunk and beat up the smaller one, and eventually killed her.

All people who come to my hospital, whether admitted or not, are asked, "Do you feel safe going back to the place where you are living?" This is their way of DV screening.

[scattycarrot]

To the OP, unfortantley, you can't 'get through to them' and really, its not your place to. Thats hard but its true. We are here to offer non-judgemental support and advice. Offer the services of Domestic Violence Support groups and networks but if somebody decides that they don't want help, than there is nothing you can do. One of the hardest things to accept as an ER nurse is that you have minimal influence over somebodies life in the few hours you spend with them and that, as soon as they walk out the door, your words of advice and wisdom will often(not always!) be forgotten as they enter back into the hard reality of their lives. However, they will likely remember your compassion. I am not saying that you shouldn't bother to try and help but rather just learn to not be despondant when your advice is not heeded. You only have so much time, so much influence and you cannot fix the evils of the world.
And, I am not talking about cases where the victims life is in obvious danger. That is a different ball game.

[GilaRN]

Originally Posted by kriseh

and
"I see these victims similar to drug addicts--they have to WANT change. No matter what you do for them if they don't WANT to leave their abusive s/o they won't. "

I'm sorry, but these generalized statements are ridiculous! I have been in an abusive relationship before and it was awful. I DID want to change, but when you are with an abusive man, alot of times it gets worse when you leave and it's easier to just deal with what you have now. Also, with physical abuse comes emotional.
They usaully don't start out abusive and then when you fall in love with them, they turn on you and are awful to you and you think "why does this person I love not love me, what's wrong with me". So, you may try harder to please them. I knew I was too good for him, but I wanted to prove to him I was (which, of course, would never happen).

Yes, you have to have some issues to be in that kind of relationship and with it brings even more issues, but I was a normal person with an ability to realize it was bad and to want out. I can't even begin to tell you how much WORSE it got when I left him and how long it took for him to leave me alone. That may be what's really weighing on these women's minds.

I am so glad I'm out now and will never allow that to happen to me again, but most of these ladies are not "drug addicts" or "unable to think and feel like us"- they are women just like many of us, but in a terrrible situation that seems hopeless and endless to them.

Let try compassion and not judgement, especially if you don't have any idea of what's really going on!

I stand by my statement. Your situation may have been different; however, many of the abused people I have seen deny any problems and go as far as to place blame on themselves for the abuse Most refuse to press charges and will actually defend the actions of the abuser.

Where in my post did I pass judgement? You need to understand that many people become very frustrated and simply cannot understand why abused people do not extricate themselves from the situation. Even more frustration stems from the fact that many of these abused people will go to great lengths to protect the abuser and condone the abuser's actions. However, if people could realize that many abused people have developed a very different way of thinking and a different behavior, then we could move beyond the frustration and begin to develop a plan that may actually help. Realizing that this type of thinking exists and understanding the thought process is actually a good way to define empathy IMHO, and the first step in developing an effective plan that can help these people.