[calliesue]

Ok I wrote a response to a poster in Dubai talking about how women over there do not have due process and she should try to get out.
After watching the news tonight I might have to amend that to get out of Texas.
Yes my great state of Texas has determined that the Eldorado kids should not have been removed from the compound. It appears that sex with a minor is ok after all . Who knew?
It is a great day for any patriarchal male who wants to have sex with someone young enough to be his grand daughter.
Texas says you can keep them isolated and brainwashed until such time as you are ready to impregnate them.
Yeah religious freedom! Yeah Texas !
Anyone have an emesis basin?

[czyja]

I think the situation in Texas may be rather more complex than you suggest.

While this religious sect is clearly pretty wacky by any measure and while I think there certainly are instances of sexual abuse in the sect, it is a little tough for me to believe that all 400 of those kids were in immediate danger. The court in Texas wisely agrees.

Additionally, I think it harms the children to have them separated from their siblings and mothers they need to return to their families. And they should receive regular visits from social services to ensure that they are safe.

[WitchyRN]

Originally Posted by calliesue

Ok I wrote a response to a poster in Dubai talking about how women over there do not have due process and she should try to get out.
After watching the news tonight I might have to amend that to get out of Texas.
Yes my great state of Texas has determined that the Eldorado kids should not have been removed from the compound. It appears that sex with a minor is ok after all . Who knew?
It is a great day for any patriarchal male who wants to have sex with someone young enough to be his grand daughter.
Texas says you can keep them isolated and brainwashed until such time as you are ready to impregnate them.
Yeah religious freedom! Yeah Texas !
Anyone have an emesis basin?

IMO, this group is a cult, NOT a religion. Those kids don't belong with their mothers, because the mothers themselves are brainwashed, often through sexual or domestic abuse. Have you seen what they do to the young teenaged males? In many cases, they kick them out on the street with no further contact with their families. This is done so they won't be "competition" for the old goats that want themselves a young bride.

Polygamy is illegal, period. For that alone, those kids need to be removed. I was shocked too but only to a point. In this society, often it's more about the parents and their "rights" and less about the safety of the child in question. Sad.

[bethin]

Originally Posted by calliesue

Ok I wrote a response to a poster in Dubai talking about how women over there do not have due process and she should try to get out.
After watching the news tonight I might have to amend that to get out of Texas.
Yes my great state of Texas has determined that the Eldorado kids should not have been removed from the compound. It appears that sex with a minor is ok after all . Who knew?
It is a great day for any patriarchal male who wants to have sex with someone young enough to be his grand daughter.
Texas says you can keep them isolated and brainwashed until such time as you are ready to impregnate them.
Yeah religious freedom! Yeah Texas !
Anyone have an emesis basin?

I stopped watching the news stories of this because it sickened me.

Last I heard, in Texas, it was legal to have sex with a minor if they were at least 16 (or was it 15?). Just cause it's legal doesn't make it right though.

[Katnip]

Isn't incest illegal? Since nobody can track most of the lineage of these kids, I'd say the odds of those men committing incest is very high.

[scorpiostudent]

The child services people went way overboard and took four HUNDRED children from their parents as well as atleast one girl that was not even a MINOR, based on a phone call that proved to be a prank call. Not every mormon of this specific denomination is automatically a child molester or a victim of brainwashing and abuse just because you don't understand why they chose their beliefs. In fact, if I am not mistaken, this was the general philosophical base of the mormon church prior to them changing to be in line with US mainstream beliefs about a century ago.

As far as polygamy being illegal... first, its only illegal because of religious implications in our government and I'm suprised that it has not been challenged (assuming its because there are not enough polygamists that want to take it to court). Forgetting their religious preferences for a moment, having multiple adult family members who love you and eachother should not / cannot possibly be a reason to take children from a home. That all being said, most of them were not legally married, just thought of themselves as the wife/husband of eachother, and I dont think that would stand up in court. If it would, then my highschool boyfriend that I had a "wedding ceremony" with when I was 17 or the lesbian and gay marriages that are not accepted by law, would have to be accepted by law, right?

I'm not saying their living situation is ideal or that I would chose to live that way. What I am saying though, is that they took a single hunch from an unreliable source, overreacted based on their own prejudices ("omg a cult!?!?!") and instead of looking at each individual situation, jumped the gun and took children from their homes without taking the steps necessary for a thorough and fact based investigation. Not to mention that these kids were not even asking to be saved, but begging and crying for their parents and thrust into a society that they are completely foreign to and taken from everything and everyone that they know and love.

Its a very bad road to start on when they can take children from their home because they don't understand the lifestyle, or based on unverified information from unreliable sources or based on possible issues with others who share the same religion, etc.

[scorpiostudent]

One more thought... they did not even interview everyone prior to doing this and many did not even know what was going on. How would you feel if you were ripped from your home without warning and nobody even asked you what was going on or tried to find out if YOU were safe before ripping you from your home?

If there is child abuse or a child molestor (or multiple) then they need to go to jail, the families need heavy counceling and the adults of the society need to understand that further contact with them could lead to them losing their children... The primary goal of child services is supposed to be to help the families conform to healthy and safe situations and to keep children with their families. If there was any way at all that they could resolve this situation without tearing children from their homes, they are supposed to start there. Removal from the home is supposed to only be the LAST RESORT if all else fails or if the kids are in immediate harm which cannot be mitigated while the counseling and interviews and changes are made (which 2 yr olds obviously are not). They never even got the chance to conform before being ripped from their homes. I think Child Services was just looking for headlines and it backfired.

[*LadyJane*]

Well, Jenlaana, at least the people from the government didn't surround the "compound" with tanks, armed soldiers and heavy arms. You've got to admit that at least they didn't kill a bunch of peopleIand many children) like they did at Waco.

And yes, because of people's personal feelings about this group's lifestyle, many people overreacted and stormed in creating a great big mess. It's just too bad that so many minority groups get considerate, careful treatment and this group gets treated like criminals before they get their due process. We'll see how long it takes for them to get their children back.

[Hopefull2009]

When children don't even know who their mothers or fathers are and the women aren't even referred to as mothers but 'caregivers' within the facility, to me that is sick.

Child molesters think that children seduce them...if you have ever seen an interview of one, you'll see that they actually believe that.

Therefore these cult members will do anything to justify their sick behavior. It's also against the law to lie to police officials regarding your identity and many of these children don't even have birth certificates because their births were never reported to the state of Texas.

They are also committing welfare fraud. People don't realize that these types of cults survive because these women are claiming benefits as "single mothers" and receiving substantial amounts of welfare, food stamps, medicaid, etc. That is how one man is able to have 7 or 8 wives and none of them work...when you have welfare feeding everyone, you don't have to.

Any child living in a cult was in danger.

The court made a grave mistake...this cult purposely has created identity confusion by design to make it very, very difficult to even MAKE an individual case against each family....because you can't even identify who belongs to who!!!!!

[calliesue]

Gay and Lesbian marriage? Huh? What do the choices of two consenting adults have to do with adult sponsored child abuse? Just because you call yourself a religion doesn't mean you aren't a cult. No I am not talking about the mormon church. I am talking about FLDS polygamist . The Amish people separate themselves from mainstream society no one is advocating taking their children away . guess its cause they are not forcing young girls to "marry" old men and kicking young men out of their homes. They are not breaking the law. While polygamy used to be legal so did slavery. The catholic church used to outline the proper width of the stick you should use to beat your wife with. My point is this while you can wrap it up in a cloak of righteousness if you want to polygamy is a filthy rag of oppression used against women and girls . Seems like a lot of religion is . If you as a consenting adult want to put yourself there that is sad, but ok , your right as an adult. What choice do these children have ? They have now just lost there one shot at having a life where they might some day have a real choice about what happens to them in their lives.