[Spidey's mom]

Hello . . . I came across three articles that piqued my interest due to the recent thread about men in nursing and why some leave. They are more geared towards men in society in general and whether there is a wave of new thinking. I've posted the links in case anyone is interested. If not, nevermind.

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/080...rush080803.asp

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...5E7583,00.html

http://www.theamericanenterprise.org...cle_detail.asp


What do the guys think?

steph

[hbscott]

Even though I left nursing a few years ago (I am currently an information systems engineer in radiology) I still love the profession enough to review the various nursing literature (and bulletin boards) to keep my finger on the proverbial pulse of nursing. In a previous post on the many variations on a theme in regard to "men in nursing" I wrote:

"I left nursing for a job that paid more, had better hours, provided better working conditions, and offered me a brighter future.

I left nursing because I grew weary of the passive aggressive behavior I witnessed daily in nursing practice as nurses turned on each other for one reason or another.

I have been in health care for 23 years. I started out as a naval hospital corpsman and worked in the proverbial trenches as an EMT and Surgical Technician before I came into nursing.

I have an Associate's of Science in Surgical Technology, a Bachelor's of Science in Nursing and a Master's of Science in Nursing Education. I am also certified as a Nurse Educator and Oncology Clinical Specialist. I am published in the American Journal of Nursing and various other periodicals but in spite of my achievement I got no respect.

Until I left nursing.

Where are the men? They are out there with other men and women working hard looking for those jobs that give them in some measure personal satisfaction and financial well being.

I didn't find that in nursing.

For those of you who stay in nursing I wish you well and the best of luck. No job is perfect but I can say that I found work outside of nursing that is fulfilling and certainly leaves me in a better mood when I come home to the wife and children."

As you can see from the above remarks I didn't leave nursing because of just one issue but rather a collection of grievances that compiled over the years.

However looking back, it seems the 90's was so about "male bashing" (amongst other things) that perhaps that my negative experience in nursing was exacerbated by a political correctness that became more mean spirited and hypocritical over time.

And yes I work with females in my current field and I respect them immensely and value their contributions as engineers. For me working with women was never the problem but rather the negative stereotypes I endured (failed physician, homosexual) and a nursing culture that refused to accept men.

HBS
http://hometown.aol.com/hscott61/myh...e/profile.html

[cheerfuldoer]

hbscot....glad you found your "passion" in life, and enjoy what you do today.

Sorry to hear you didn't "fit" in the world of nursing because I happen to enjoy working with men more than women. Women bicker too much, form their own cliques more, expect a "rank structure" just because they've been on the job "X" number of years more than so and so. Women also envy each other more, and like sticking it to each other more when they get the chance. I need to find a job where I can work with more men and less women.

Anyway........I'm happy for you.

[hbscott]

Thanks for your kind words cheerfuldoer. My passion has always been helping people and I thought nursing was the perfect profession to advance this endeavor from the foundation that had already been laid by my previous work experience. Looking back I could have made some different choices and perhaps I would have had less frustration laboring as a nurse.

Nevertheless what is done is done and I am happy now working as a information systems engineer in radiology. I do wonder how many Master's prepared nurses end up as I do (male or female) leaving nursing because the culture of nursing can be so frustrating to deal with.

HBS

[Gldngrl]

Steph-
Thanks for the links, made for interesting reading. MMB

[hbscott]

Here is another response to the original post from a friend of mine. She isn't a member of Allnurses.com so it was easier for me to post her reply than to have her sign up and post her reply. The important thing is that these bulletin boards are read and do have impact on the daily activities of nursing practice.

"[" ...The goal is to resocialize boys, freeing them from male stereotypes, and, ultimately, to promote genuine equality between the sexes-which for the reformers means sameness. But decades of research in neuroscience, endocrinology, genetics, and developmental psychology, strongly suggest that
masculine traits are hard-wired. There are exceptions, but here are the rules:Males have better spatial reasoning skills, females better verbal skills. Males are greater risk-takers, females are more nurturing. Boys like action, competitive rough-housing, and inanimate objects, and they are the one group of Americans who do not spend a lot of time talking about their
feelings..."]

I think this brief paragraph really does reflect current thinking.
Unfortunately, I think little consideration is given to the "exceptions." The "exceptions" have essentially been used to set a standard for all. Whatever happened to the "uniqueness" of the individual? We will never learn. Black and white is "in." Why does everyone HAVE to fit into one of
only TWO groups?

I must confess though,I don't understand why the original author chose these three articles to somehow elaborate about men and nursing.

Is the author saying that men are NOT equipped to dally in this field?"

HBS

[Dplear]

Even though I am a nurse...I am manly. I ride a harley...I swear... I do drink occaaionally and not "girly" drinks either I drink Tequila naked 9no salt or lemon). I own guns and I do construction around the house and I drive fast. I don't even use a hair drier for my hair. I have also been known not to even iron my clothes before going out (gasp!!!!) I am teaching my boys how to shoot and they will learn to drive a motorcycle and they are taking karate. I have also told them never to pick a fight but if they get in one I will not punishthem for defending themselves. I will get mad if they do not defend themselves. I have also taught them to defend those younger than them and to defend women and weaker ones. To stand up for injustice and not back down. Basically what it take to be a Man. I am PROUD to procalim I AM NOT A METROSEXUAL BABY I AM ALL MAN.

Dave

[gwenith]

Ummm Dave - your avatar - Is that a real picture of you???

[chigap]

Dave--

Are you for real? I thought it was a joke and got a good laugh out of it, but now I'm wondering.

[Spidey's mom]

"I must confess though,I don't understand why the original author chose these three articles to somehow elaborate about men and nursing.

Is the author saying that men are NOT equipped to dally in this field?"

HBS"
***************************************


Hi - I am the one who posted these articles. I am NOT saying men are not equipped to dally in this field.

The reason I posted these articles was after reading the thread about men in nursing and all the responses from the men on this BB, it seemed interesting to me to read about men in society in general. What is expected of them by society? How does that affect their going into nursing?

Some of the men were alluding to the cliquish, backstabbing, gossipy nature of women in nursing. Some were talking about how the curriculum is geared in a way that doesn't take into account a male point of view.

I guess I just thought these articles were an interesting addition to a debate about the roles of men and women in society in general and maybe nursing in particular.

I hope Dave wasn't joking . .sounds like a reasonable plan for raising boys to me.

steph