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| No. 30 |
Aug 15, 2009, 01:14 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by rickkijo Thinking about how sad it is in the USA today that we provide free medical care for all these folks who have never worked a day in there life, but when it comes to the elderly who have worked everyday of their life can't even get their prescription medications or have to pay out large amounts just to get a little bit of medical coverage. Although the free medical care we provide to non working baby making machines, I call it the American Express Card that we provide to the folks who have never worked really isn't free you and I pay for their free medical care. I would rather pay for my parents medical care then for someone who comes in saying I don't have tylenol or motrin at home for my kids while pointing their newly put on fingernails or calling on their cell phones or having that pack of ciggs in their pockets, when my parents who have worked all their lives and should be living the best days of their life won't even turn on the air in their home because of the cost and not being able to afford medical care or medications!! If they had to pay a nice co-pay for non-emergancy visits to the ER then we could really see the people who really need emergancy care. Sorry just venting and wondering how everyone else feels about this sitution??
rickkijo; do you have any suggestions for possible improvements?
| | Advertisement Sponsored Links | | | | No. 31 |
Aug 15, 2009, 01:36 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA
I lived out of the back of my truck for years, trying to put cash away for school, and I did it (with the help of friends whom I traded work/cooking/babysitting/housework/construction for showers, etc while I was also working full time at two jobs). I got really sick of peanut butter and jelly. But you know what? Now I'm a nurse, and I have this awesome superpower- it's called saving money. I'm lucky I had any kind of support network, people who would give me a hot shower and pay me to help them out because they saw I was working my butt off.
It used to kill me when people would come to my clinic and balk at paying $12 for birth control pills but they'd tote their Coach purses and show off their diamond earrings, while I was eating leftovers. What does $12 cover? A movie for one? I think OCPs provide more than one night of fun, anyway. And a pap cost maybe $20. You should have heard the complaints.
Part of it is the instant gratification culture we live in.
On a public health level, people *should* have basic access to healthcare- it's called preventative, medicine. We keep people generally healthy to ensure the health of the population (ie vaccinations, etc). Americans in general are not used to having to wait for anything. How long is your hold time on the phone with the bank? How long do you wait for your coffee order before you get annoyed?
Same with healthcare. What's your standard? What should be the standard? Should we have a standard?
And for those who argue it's a right (I'm not arguing for or against, I'm just posing a question)....
If it's a right, is it a natural right? How so?
What kind of right is it?
We all want to restructure a broken system, but what is that new structure?
And I live in California, where the system is really in hot debate.
With an estimate of $11 billion going to "illegal immigrants" I wonder what the solution is... many of those undocumented people subsidize our cheap food via hard labor in conditions that most people would avoid like the plague. Go stand outside in Bakersfield in the summer for one hour with no water and then think about it. Should we require big Agriculture to provide a temp work visa healthcare access? Is it the fault of the state, of ICE, of the various larger corporations? Who is responsible?
Those are my questions. Ok, End rant. | | No. 32 |
Aug 15, 2009, 01:37 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA
Nope not from Canada, just worked all night and when it asked about a flag under profile I thought of CA as California. Sorry for any confusion.
| | No. 33 |
Aug 15, 2009, 01:43 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by star77 I lived out of the back of my truck for years, trying to put cash away for school, and I did it (with the help of friends whom I traded work/cooking/babysitting/housework/construction for showers, etc while I was also working full time at two jobs). I got really sick of peanut butter and jelly. But you know what? Now I'm a nurse, and I have this awesome superpower- it's called saving money. I'm lucky I had any kind of support network, people who would give me a hot shower and pay me to help them out because they saw I was working my butt off.
It used to kill me when people would come to my clinic and balk at paying $12 for birth control pills but they'd tote their Coach purses and show off their diamond earrings, while I was eating leftovers. What does $12 cover? A movie for one? I think OCPs provide more than one night of fun, anyway. And a pap cost maybe $20. You should have heard the complaints.
Part of it is the instant gratification culture we live in.
On a public health level, people *should* have basic access to healthcare- it's called preventative, medicine. We keep people generally healthy to ensure the health of the population (ie vaccinations, etc). Americans in general are not used to having to wait for anything. How long is your hold time on the phone with the bank? How long do you wait for your coffee order before you get annoyed?
Same with healthcare. What's your standard? What should be the standard? Should we have a standard?
And for those who argue it's a right (I'm not arguing for or against, I'm just posing a question)....
If it's a right, is it a natural right? How so?
What kind of right is it?
We all want to restructure a broken system, but what is that new structure?
And I live in California, where the system is really in hot debate.
With an estimate of $11 billion going to "illegal immigrants" I wonder what the solution is... many of those undocumented people subsidize our cheap food via hard labor in conditions that most people would avoid like the plague. Go stand outside in Bakersfield in the summer for one hour with no water and then think about it. Should we require big Agriculture to provide a temp work visa healthcare access? Is it the fault of the state, of ICE, of the various larger corporations? Who is responsible?
Those are my questions. Ok, End rant. 
Not bad.
Good post, good points
| | No. 34 |
Aug 15, 2009, 04:51 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by rickkijo Thinking about how sad it is in the USA today that we provide free medical care for all these folks who have never worked a day in there life, but when it comes to the elderly who have worked everyday of their life can't even get their prescription medications or have to pay out large amounts just to get a little bit of medical coverage.
What about elderly people who have never worked a day in their lives? I work with the elderly. All of them are on Medicare. A lot of the women were life-long housewives. A lot of them are against "goverment insurance", despite being on Medicare and (in some cases) the VA or TriCare. All of them are old enough to remember the battle for Medicare. It's a classic case of "I've got mine, now bar the door."
Thanks to Dubya's Medicare Part D, Medicare is not allowed to negotiating bulk drug discounts for Medicare patients. Wal*Mart and Target sell 30-day supplies of many generic drugs for $4 month.
I live 45 minutes from the Canadian border. Lots of Canadians shop here (no sales tax on clothes). Their national health plan has its problems, but the Canadians I've talked to wouldn't want to trade it for the American system.
I find it sad that the US government will gladly pay for foreign invasions, aircraft carriers, and F-18s, but not national health care.
| | No. 35 |
Aug 15, 2009, 04:58 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by WhoaNelly No, we need to attack our population/demand problem from the other end: Let the baby-making machines have one child, two at the very most - then, it's automatic sterilization right after the birth of the second child.
Government-mandated family sizes are working so well in China.
| | No. 36 |
Aug 15, 2009, 08:55 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by fuzzywuzzy If anyone has a "feeling of entitlement" right now, it's you! Look at the tone of your post and how you referred to basic human rights/needs in quotation marks. I'm guessing you HAVE health insurance. Are you going to school full time and working full time to keep a roof over your head or are you getting help and support from a parent or spouse? If so then you don't have much room to resent people for getting public assistance. A lot of posters on this thread seem to think that they're better or more deserving than other people and I don't know where that's coming from.
I know there are people who don't care, who take advantage of the system. But if not for that, they'd find some other way to act like scumbags. And you are going to have to pay taxes no matter what- if they take Medicaid away it's not like they're gonna give the extra money back to you so you can get your flat screen TV or trip to Hawaii... they'll just take it and spend it on something sketchy.
I am always amazed at how quick people are to make PERSONAL attacks at people that they do not agree with. For your information I work full time in addition to be being married (my wife works part-time, lass than 20 hours per week), and going to school full time. I do have health insurance because I WORK HARD for it. I came from a middle class family, but my parents haven't given me a dime for my college education. Please do not assume that I am dependant on public assistance or that I feel I am better than others.
My thought is that anyone can have insurance if they want it bad enough. The house keeping staff at the hospital I work at have the same insurance that I have (which is very good and less than $100/month for a family). The problem is a lot of people go into professions kniwing it will not provide insurance and they find jobs like housekeeping below them and won't do it even if it means they get insurance.
This is not always the case. I do think we need to help those who are disabled and are considered uninsurable. I just don't buy the "I can't find insurance" bit from healthy people. Those who want a socialized medicine will find out it isn't as good as it is made to sound. I also do not understand your demonizing saying I would spend my saved money on a "flat screen TV or trip to Hawaii". I think I would rather buy a house or save for my childrens education.
One more thought. You said "And you are going to have to pay taxes no matter what- if they take Medicaid away..... they'll just take it and spend it on something sketchy" Why as American's do we tolerate such people in office?
| | No. 37 |
Aug 15, 2009, 08:58 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by applescruffette Those are needs, not rights, and proper health is also a need.
So where does that leave us? Does the gov provide needs for us or do we do it ourselves? Housing, food, health care, etc.
| | No. 38 |
Aug 15, 2009, 09:06 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by Dalzac Man That was harsh! I went to school and I still had to beg for any kind of help for 4 years.
I do feel for you in your situation, but your is not typical. I think health care does need some help. The government taking over and providing socialized health care isn't the answer.
As I said above we do need to help the uninsurable. We also need to reduce costs in health care. Where is all of the money going? I know I am not getting a raise this year! Is it administration? Is it high tech expensive equipment? One increase has been the increase in private room hospitals. For infection control, privacy, and patient requests we have been doing many additions to hospital to increase the number of private rooms. That surely increases costs as hospitals are expensive to build, not to mention the extra staff required to operate larger buildings. American's also need to lose weight. Obesity is a major health care cost in America.
Any thoughts on where the increasing cost of health care is coming from?
| | No. 39 |
Aug 15, 2009, 09:43 AM
Re: Sad day in the USA Originally Posted by WhoaNelly Well, when there is so much talk about rationing healthcare, even potentially initiating a "duty to die" for our elderly, I have a bigtime problem with the baby-making machines. No, we need to attack our population/demand problem from the other end: Let the baby-making machines have one child, two at the very most - then, it's automatic sterilization right after the birth of the second child.
I know that sounds a bit Nazi-like, but I think it's much more practical than hastening the deaths of our elderly.
I strongly suspect that IF rationing did occur, those "baby-making" machines will be hit also. And there HAS BEEN NOTHING about a "duty to die" for our elderly in ANY bill, or hastening.
There was a provision, a very good one about permitting payment for MDs to discuss the ramifications of end life care, and formulate a plan with patients regarding THE PATIENT's wishes for end of life care. For those of us that have family members THAT SPECIFICALLY requested DNR status at end of life and then had their MD refuse to write a DNR order when they are dying, because it was "against their beliefs", and try to force intubation/vent on them, this would have helped them. My late father and also my late Grandmother could have made better decisions on what MD to trust their healthcare with, given their wishes.
Families often make Living wills, with absolutely no clue as to the medical ramifications of them. They deserve to be able to have a consultation with their MD to fully discuss end of life care....one that can last more than 5-10 minutes in a hurried hallway, as the staff is running for the Intubation tray and getting the code cart. One where the full medical ramifications of "having everything done" can be discussed in a calm matter.
No one wants to hasten the deathes of the elderly. But when a fully demented 92 year old, contracted in a fetal position, who cries with pain everytime they are moved, develops met. pancreatic cancer and the family insists on chemo and wants a whipple done..... it would be nice if we had some idea of the patient's wishes and whether s/he would have wanted that done.
I personally would love to see some rationing based on some lifestyle issues. Such as if you are a drinker and develop pancreatitis repeatedly. Three hospitalizations/three detoxs. Then if you come in complaining of pancreatitis symptoms, you have to test negative for alcohol use to get treated. And anyone that is noncompliant with orders (especially the NPO order....no sneaking in food, then complaining of pain and getting your narc shot), , if they are physically stable, show them the door.
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