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Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies



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No. 40
from canoehead
Old May 23, 2007, 05:38 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
rgroyer- In your ER a child under two would have drowned, and the outcome would be the same. Of course they would be well sedated with the Compazine and Benadryl, so breathing wouldn't be an issue.
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No. 41
Old May 27, 2007, 06:35 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Lol, thanks alot canoehead I was angry when I wrote that I meant though the child should have gotten at least 250 if not 500 of Lr or d5w, and I gues the reason the docs in my er give benadryl with the compazine is to reduce eps symptoms I dont know but all of them order that on everyone lol, If this was an adult a liter or 2 would have been good lol good day!
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No. 42
from carachel2
Old May 28, 2007, 09:42 AM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Just coming in at the tail end of this and have not read all of the posts. But I wanted to say I gave my 52 lb 6 year old 12.5 mg Phenergan (supp) after vomiting all day. I stayed right beside her because she had never had Phenergan before and I wanted to see how she would react. She was SO sedated that she barely even roused from her sleep to vomit. SCARY ! If I had not been right there to log roll her on to her side I have no doubt she would have aspirated many many times. Despite the meds she threw up about 3-4 more times. I will never allow a Phenergan Rx for her again.

More recently we were in the ER for r/o appendicitis and they used Zofran = NO problems at all.
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No. 43
Old Jun 05, 2007, 06:55 AM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Can someone tell me why Zofran is so expensive? I think they finally came out with a generic but that was still very expensive. I had a doc who refused to prescribe it because of the expense and insisted I try phenegran when I knew Zofran was the only thing that has previously worked.
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No. 44
from Nursekat64
Old Jun 06, 2007, 01:47 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
I am so very sorry for the loss. When children die the world stops for the parent.
I have worked in a pediatric ER for 15 years and phenergan supp. were used many years ago, when that was all there was to give. Now we only give zofran.
I am currently working in a adult ER but we see many peds patients, and with my experience and when I am there I get all the peds patients.
Many caregivers are uncomfortable with handling pediatric patients and I believe that there should be a PALS certified caregiver available at any given time.
I would venture to say that this child was in hypovolemic shock, and had PALS guidelines been followed the outcome could have been different.
Again I am so very sorry for the loss.
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No. 45
from Kidrn911
Old Jun 06, 2007, 05:25 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Well I work in a peds ED, I have actually worked in two separte ones in two different cities. The drug of choice is Zofran for vomiting. The only time I ever gave phenergan was to a teen with Migraines. Zofran is sooooo much safer, and has less side effects the phenergan.
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No. 46
from katfishLPN
Old Jun 07, 2007, 09:50 AM
Updated Jun 07, 2007 at 09:53 AM by katfishLPN

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Originally Posted by Nursekat64 View Post
I am so very sorry for the loss. When children die the world stops for the parent.
I have worked in a pediatric ER for 15 years and phenergan supp. were used many years ago, when that was all there was to give. Now we only give zofran.
I am currently working in a adult ER but we see many peds patients, and with my experience and when I am there I get all the peds patients.
Many caregivers are uncomfortable with handling pediatric patients and I believe that there should be a PALS certified caregiver available at any given time.
I would venture to say that this child was in hypovolemic shock, and had PALS guidelines been followed the outcome could have been different.
Again I am so very sorry for the loss.
I agree that there should always be a PALS certified caregiver on any unit that admits Peds. When my son was hospitalized he was on a med/surg unit in a small hospital and I really don't know if any of the nurses were PAL certified. I doubt it though. I think they did a fine job and I never left his side except very rarely to go to the bathroom. But that is what I was thinking is that if they are going to accept peds patients and it is not a peds unit they really are obligated to have someone who is certified available to take those patients. In my opinion. Also of course every ER should have at least one PALS certified caregiver avaiable on each shift, more than one would be better though!
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No. 47
Old Jun 20, 2008, 04:39 AM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Originally Posted by tridil2000 View Post
even if there was an error in the dosage of phenergan, whether it was the order itself, or the nurse's error, i truly believe this child's demise was a result of lack of fluids. dehydration kills children. they simply can not handle a lot of volume loss bc of their size. the child should have received iv fluids promptly and before any other intervention.

it is the pals standard of care.

my sympathy to you, your friend and her family.

trish
pals cert
So it sounds like the Triage nurse is at fault for not recognizing that the child should have been bolused quickly and been evaluated more quickly. Very sad, very scary. I'm so sorry for the pain and sadness and I hope they will take legal action because this was a preventable death and calling attention to it will help prevent similar events in the future, I hope.
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No. 48
from lupin
Old Jun 20, 2008, 03:17 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Um, it doesn't sound to me like the triage nurse had anything to do with it. Our standing protocol for vomitting states that for peds vomitting, IV may be started and labs sent, but any boluses or meds are up to provider discretion. In my ER when we triage, with children or any patient, we can talk to the doc and tell them what we see and ask to start boluses, but that order is still up to the doc. The triage nurse may have recognized the bad signs and talked to the doc or nurse assigned to the patient but if no order was given we can't just start medicating at our own will (scope of practice and all). I only know of one doc that I work with that might not have started the bolus until he had seen the patient, but without looking at the chart and seeing the presenting symptoms, orders, and nurses' notes I can't really say for sure who would be to blame if anyone would be at all. Usually for little guys we give ODT Zofran to kids for vomitting. They don't have to chew it, less sedating side effects, and generally kids seem to respond to it better. However, at my hospital, the admin has restricted phenergan use IV because of some incidences where someone didn't push the drug correctly or didn't dilute it or didin't verify that a site hadn't infiltrated and one or tow pts' ended up with tissue damage from the phenergan. Our max dose is 12.5mg IV diluted in 5-10 cc NS given over 5 minutes. I'd rather give ZOfran any day.
But any time a child dies, we all want to know why. It seems so senseless to lose a child. Older people, well, they've lived and had families, memories, that sort of thing, but with any child death I think it is human nature to want to rationalize, understand, even blame our way through it. My heart goes out to that family.
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No. 49
from justme1972
Old Jun 20, 2008, 04:36 PM

Default Re: Phenergan Supp given to toddler; child dies
Originally Posted by thanatos View Post
First of all, I am extremely sorry for your friend's loss.

A few things regarding phenergan and peds:

1) We used to give it all the time to kids under 2. We would even cut a 12.5 in half (not the best practice because the medication is not equally distributed throughout the suppository).

2) I thought it strange that my child's pediatrician would not prescribe phenergan for n/v because she was < 2 years old. Yet we gave it all time in the ER.

3) We now have a policy in the hospital that Phenergan is not to be given to toddlers younger than 2. By the way, I never saw a negative outcome from it. The worst case I saw was a ~ 9 y.o. who experienced some dyskinthesia.

4) Here is the link to the pharmaceutical label stating that Phenergan is CONTRAINDICATED in children younger than 2:

http://www.wyeth.com/content/ShowLabeling.asp?id=127

5) What is the purpose in starting a hep lock on a dry kid? That part makes absolutely no sense. If you are going to go to the trouble to start a line, you might as well give a 20ml/kg bolus and see how the kid responds.

6) As far as the suppository being a 50mg one, our Phenergan supp's are all the same size. They are different colors (I think).

Again, my condolences.
I'm going to post again on Monday, but in school they are teaching us that you never give Phenergan to a child under the age of 2 right now and for the life of me, I can't remember what drug they are saying is better...works like Phenergan but minus the sedative effect.

I research and get back

My condolences to the family...you never take your kid to the ER for something like vomiting and expect to go home minus one child.
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