DNP before NP cert

  1. I have my Master's Degree in Nursing Leadership/Management. My end goal is to become a doctorate prepared nurse practitioner. I am starting a nurse executive DNP program this fall. After I complete my DNP, I plan to complete a post-MSN FNP certificate program.

    My question is whether that will hinder my future as an NP? I imagine nurse practitioners usually complete their DNP degree with a medically-geared specialty concentration (i.e. geriatric, family, neonatal, etc.) and not with an administration concentration. I know I am perhaps educating myself, in a sense, backwards from the norm, but it makes most sense for my life and family at the current time.

    Feedback?
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  2. 17 Comments

  3. by   tknrosales
    Why dont you do the post-masters Np cert now? Then go on to the dnp after starting to work as a FNP? Most DNP programs focus on leadership or systems management, not so much as a clinical population, you do that in the NP track.
  4. by   IsabelK
    Most of the classes I took in the DNP program as an NP (I have the MSN in Adult Health, worked as an NP for 2 years before starting a DNP program) were the same as the Executive Leadership Track. The two differences: I took integrated behavioral health, the EL track took a leadership course. Capstones were focused differently, but the foundation classes were all the same. I'd say do it either way--you'll still be Dr. Nurse.
  5. by   PsychGuy
    I think you're losing money by not doing the FNP first. You're sacrificing years of work and tuition will be more expensive later compared to now. Your end goal is family practice, yet you're creating an obstacle by doing the DNP thing first. Pay attention here; the DNP is NOT a medically-oriented degree. Frankly, I fail to understand what it has to do with "nursing practice" as well. It won't teach you nor facilitate your clinical competency.

    If you want the DNP then get it. If that type of stuff appeals to you then I support you, but if you want to be a FNP then do that and work on the DNP later is your spare time. With your management degree you should be aware of some microeconomic theory particularly opportunity cost or the value of forgone opportunity. Think about that. What's the incentive for a DNP?
  6. by   IsabelK
    Quote from PsychGuy
    I think you're losing money by not doing the FNP first. You're sacrificing years of work and tuition will be more expensive later compared to now. Your end goal is family practice, yet you're creating an obstacle by doing the DNP thing first. Pay attention here; the DNP is NOT a medically-oriented degree. Frankly, I fail to understand what it has to do with "nursing practice" as well. It won't teach you nor facilitate your clinical competency.

    If you want the DNP then get it. If that type of stuff appeals to you then I support you, but if you want to be a FNP then do that and work on the DNP later is your spare time. With your management degree you should be aware of some microeconomic theory particularly opportunity cost or the value of forgone opportunity. Think about that. What's the incentive for a DNP?
    Um get the DNP in your spare time? I worked full time as an NP and did the DNP at the same time. WHAT SPARE TIME?

    Oh, wait...this is like having a battle of wits with an unarmed person....one who has never gotten a DNP.
  7. by   PsychGuy
    Quote from IsabelK
    Um get the DNP in your spare time? I worked full time as an NP and did the DNP at the same time. WHAT SPARE TIME?

    Oh, wait...this is like having a battle of wits with an unarmed person....one who has never gotten a DNP.
    Excuse me? You worked as a NP, and when you weren't working, i.e. your "SPARE TIME," you worked towards your DNP. You quite clearly affirmed what I suggested the OP do. I'm really glad to see that DNP was so helpful for you.
  8. by   IsabelK
    Quote from PsychGuy
    Excuse me? You worked as a NP, and when you weren't working, i.e. your "SPARE TIME," you worked towards your DNP. You quite clearly affirmed what I suggested the OP do. I'm really glad to see that DNP was so helpful for you.
    Mmm....well, since you mention it, yes, it has been. New job, better pay, recognition of the fact that I am Dr. K. DNP Capstone done in my particular piece of nursing...Nope, wasn't done in my spare time. I did things like sleep and play with the dog in my spare time....
  9. by   Jules A
    Quote from IsabelK
    Mmm....well, since you mention it, yes, it has been. New job, better pay, recognition of the fact that I am Dr. K. DNP Capstone done in my particular piece of nursing...Nope, wasn't done in my spare time. I did things like sleep and play with the dog in my spare time....
    If you got more money as a direct result from your DNP you are lucky because in the facilities where I work it doesn't get you anything but "personal enrichment".
    Last edit by Jules A on Jul 8, '15
  10. by   RNRy
    Truly, I think I'm stuck. I know I want my doctorate degree. Period. I definitely want to teach. Part of me wants to proceed in management. Part of me wants to be a nurse practitioner, though I'm afraid that field will become saturated. It would be easier for me and my family if I waited until my partner is done with school. Then, I can go part time at work and focus on NP if that's the career progression I choose.


    Sent from my iPhone using allnurses
  11. by   Jules A
    Quote from RNRy
    Truly, I think I'm stuck. I know I want my doctorate degree. Period. I definitely want to teach. Part of me wants to proceed in management. Part of me wants to be a nurse practitioner, though I'm afraid that field will become saturated. It would be easier for me and my family if I waited until my partner is done with school. Then, I can go part time at work and focus on NP if that's the career progression I choose.


    Sent from my iPhone using allnurses
    You make good points and I do think if you want to teach your DNP will definitely open more doors for you. Not so as a NP at this time in my experience and I also see the market becoming saturated in the near future.

    The lack of money was a factor in my decision. Other than the poster above who got more money practicing as a NP for getting their DNP I personally have not known anyone who has gotten more for having their DNP compared to masters level NPs who are practicing as NPs. One of my bosses literally laughed out loud when I asked if he would pony up some more money if I got it.
  12. by   IsabelK
    Quote from Jules A
    You make good points and I do think if you want to teach your DNP will definitely open more doors for you. Not so as a NP at this time in my experience and I also see the market becoming saturated in the near future.

    The lack of money was a factor in my decision. Other than the poster above who got more money practicing as a NP for getting their DNP I personally have not known anyone who has gotten more for having their DNP compared to masters level NPs who are practicing as NPs. One of my bosses literally laughed out loud when I asked if he would pony up some more money if I got it.
    I admit this does happen the majority of the time, still. But I also know that even those people in my cohort who got the DNP as NPs rather than through the Executive Leadership Track (nurse leaders, educators, etc) are starting to ask for and receive more money. It's not going to happen overnight but I do see things beginning to change slowly. It also helps when the DNP educated NP is a good negotiator (I'm not--I asked my husband how to handle the negotiation piece) and when they start leaving organizations that don't recognize the education and abilities they do have. This is starting to happen with several of the organizations in my area. And one of the reasons I am leaving my current organization: they did laugh when I asked for more money. They also flat out told me the day I got back from my defense that I can't be Dr. K even though I reminded them that psychologists, podiatrists, etc are "Dr. So-and-so". <shrugs> That last one might sound a little like sour grapes, but I earned it and the only requirement if I choose to use it according to the state I'm in is that I identify that I am not a physician, which is fine. I'm not a physician, but I am a doctor.
  13. by   Jules A
    Quote from IsabelK
    I admit this does happen the majority of the time, still. But I also know that even those people in my cohort who got the DNP as NPs rather than through the Executive Leadership Track (nurse leaders, educators, etc) are starting to ask for and receive more money. It's not going to happen overnight but I do see things beginning to change slowly. It also helps when the DNP educated NP is a good negotiator (I'm not--I asked my husband how to handle the negotiation piece) and when they start leaving organizations that don't recognize the education and abilities they do have. This is starting to happen with several of the organizations in my area. And one of the reasons I am leaving my current organization: they did laugh when I asked for more money. They also flat out told me the day I got back from my defense that I can't be Dr. K even though I reminded them that psychologists, podiatrists, etc are "Dr. So-and-so". <shrugs> That last one might sound a little like sour grapes, but I earned it and the only requirement if I choose to use it according to the state I'm in is that I identify that I am not a physician, which is fine. I'm not a physician, but I am a doctor.
    My hat is off to you and your colleagues!

    Unfortunately what I have seen in my area is the few places who actually embrace the DNP at this time are largely the well known teaching hospitals who have historically paid terrible no matter what your discipline. I guess it can be very seductive to stay at the big name teaching hospitals where the atmosphere seems almost cult like to me and so many get sucked into the glamour and ego portion of working for one of the Giants so much so that they are willing to work for what is imo disgraceful, insulting wages. I literally make $100,000 a year more than a dual certified NP with more experience than I have who works for one of the well known teaching hospitals. Trust me their benefits aren't that good. We truly need to start discussing our wages, supporting each other and insisting on being treated like the professionals we are, imo.
  14. by   PsychGuy
    There's a thread now about PA salary and comparisons to the name cache of working at an academic institution. Heck, we're (NPs) making double what our master's instructors made and those of us getting bonuses could make triple. I'd just assume sit in my office all by myself and make a good living than have my name involved with university this or that, and I couldn't care less about getting my name on papers.

    I have considered, for fun, making YouTube videos of me sitting in an overstuffed armchair in front of a bookcase -wearing a cardigan of course- discussing varying DSM diagnoses and clinical pearls. Truth be told, I really just need a more time consuming hobby.

    Quote from Jules A
    My hat is off to you and your colleagues!

    Unfortunately what I have seen in my area is the few places who actually embrace the DNP at this time are largely the well known teaching hospitals who have historically paid terrible no matter what your discipline. I guess it can be very seductive to stay at the big name teaching hospitals where the atmosphere seems almost cult like to me and so many get sucked into the glamour and ego portion of working for one of the Giants so much so that they are willing to work for what is imo disgraceful, insulting wages. I literally make $100,000 a year more than a dual certified NP with more experience than I have who works for one of the well known teaching hospitals. Trust me their benefits aren't that good. We truly need to start discussing our wages, supporting each other and insisting on being treated like the professionals we are, imo.

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