DNP's failing the test???? DNP's failing the test???? - pg.5 | allnurses

DNP's failing the test???? - page 6

Wow, so the DNP's are taking part of the USMLE exams. Likely a version of step 1. "By this fall, the National Board of Medical Examiners (NBME) will begin offering part of the United States... Read More

  1. Visit  rnhunter profile page
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    That is very interesting. How will this work for those in other specialties? such as ACNP, PNP, NNP, CRNA, ect. we are very specialized and do not get all components that would be on the USMLE.
  2. Visit  menetopali profile page
    1
    Quote from forpath
    I am by no means an expert on this particular test, but it was my understanding that the material for the DNP exam was taken from the Step 3 exam, and then altered by the nursing organization administering the exam so that it would be more applicable to what the DNP candidates were taught. So, I'm not sure it was a straight-forward "medical" test the DNP candidates took.

    Perhaps you feel anyone could become a great provider in primary care given enough time. Of course they could. How much time is enough? 1 year? 10 years? I presume many people, including myself, would likely prefer that they see someone who is, for the most part, beyond the steepest part of their learning curve before they entrust their care to them.

    But when you speak of specialties (cardiology, ENT, dermatology, pathology, etc), a residency, and for many of us, a fellowship is the only way to gain a minimal level of competence in that specialty before one has to take care of patients or provide pathologic or radiologic diagnoses. Many specialties cannot be covered in medical school (or DNP school) in sufficient detail and therefore post-graduate training is absolutely "precious".

    I would submit to you that all recent med school and DNP grads are minimally competent to practice medicine and nursing, respectively. The major difference is, MDs/DOs are forced to undergo additional rigorous training (~60-120 hours/week) in residency/fellowship and then take additional board exams before they are allowed to care for their own specialty patients, whereas DNPs can be simply released on the general populace without supervision in a number of states and with minimal supervision in many others. So yes, in the medical model, a residency does make or break a provider in terms of specialties. Anyway you look at it, there is a steep learning curve following graduation for both professionals, the difference is, in the medical model, there is someone who is intensely looking over the shoulder of the medical graduate. The same can simply not be said about the nursing model in a number of settings.

    Don't get me wrong, I also feel very strongly that a 3 year family practice residency is not nearly enough training to take care of the exceedingly broad needs of the patients in their panel. If one honestly feels that they know enough to competently practice psychiatry, pediatrics, OB/Gyn, dermatology, internal medicine (including its subspecialties, like endocrine, cards, etc) and some others after only 3 years of residency, then they are way smarter and more confident in their abilities than I am. And if one thinks they can do it after only 4 years of school (MD/DO or DNP), well, you get my point.
    It is this very steep learning cutrve that physicians are helped through via residencies. unfortunately those with an economic agenda, instead of a patient agenda, block the inclusion of DNPs in residency programs (even though there are many empty slots) and cry "poor" when nursing seeks funding for NP residency programs.
    prairienp likes this.
  3. Visit  forpath profile page
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    Quote from menetopali
    It is this very steep learning cutrve that physicians are helped through via residencies. unfortunately those with an economic agenda, instead of a patient agenda, block the inclusion of DNPs in residency programs (even though there are many empty slots) and cry "poor" when nursing seeks funding for NP residency programs.
    So are you insinuating that DNPs should be admitted into medical residency programs?
  4. Visit  menetopali profile page
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    i'm not insunuating as much as saying outright that DNPs (and frankly all new NPs) should be able to participate in federally funded and closely mentorred experiences after graduation and before flying solo so to speak.
  5. Visit  forpath profile page
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    Quote from menetopali
    i'm not insunuating as much as saying outright that DNPs (and frankly all new NPs) should be able to participate in federally funded and closely mentorred experiences after graduation and before flying solo so to speak.
    For all the reasons I mentioned above, I completely agree with you. Unfortunately, it obviously has to be something the nursing community does on its own, including lobbying congress for additional funds for post-graduate training. There is simply no way a DNP could enter a medical residency.
  6. Visit  prairienp profile page
    0
    Quote from forpath
    So are you insinuating that DNPs should be admitted into medical residency programs?
    I would suggest they should be treated equally with funding. If our tax dollars are used to fund medcial residency, our tax dollars should also be used to fund NP education. Or neither should be funded. Can you imagine the outcry if residency was no longer funded? This was a primary aspect of health care reform in 1994, as you know, nothing has changed.
  7. Visit  forpath profile page
    0
    Quote from prairienp
    I would suggest they should be treated equally with funding. If our tax dollars are used to fund medcial residency, our tax dollars should also be used to fund NP education. Or neither should be funded. Can you imagine the outcry if residency was no longer funded? This was a primary aspect of health care reform in 1994, as you know, nothing has changed.
    Sure, if you can get congress to pay for it. And obviously, from an absolute perspective, you do not need nearly as much money to fund DNP residencies as you do medical ones. I do not think ceasing the federal funding of medical residencies if DNPs can not get funding is a viable option, especially in this economic climate. You would not be able to fund the training of a significant number of medical trainees, and then, talk about a physician shortage!!

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