2015 DNP - page 16

I am wondering if anyone has heard any updates. Everything I keep seeing online from the AACN is "recommendation", "strongly encouraged", "highly suggested". I have yet to see anything, that... Read More

  1. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    American Association of Colleges of Nursing | Frequently Asked Questions (DNP FAQ from AACN it answers every question that has been posted on here)

    The DNP isn't about getting more clinical hours. The DNP is supposed to make nurses experts in EBP.
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  3. Visit  elkpark} profile page
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    Quote from wtbcrna
    The DNP isn't about getting more clinical hours. The DNP is supposed to make nurses experts in EBP.
    Which is exactly what my MSN program told me my MSN would do for me 15 years ago.
    Ellen NP and PMFB-RN like this.
  4. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    Quote from elkpark
    Which is exactly what my MSN program told me my MSN would do for me 15 years ago.
    Have you read through the entire AACN document on the DNP? An MSN/APN will spend the majority of their time learning how to be APN not an expert in EBP. That doesn't consider the fact that MSN/APN programs are credit over loaded and need to move to a clinical doctorate based on credit hours alone.
  5. Visit  elkpark} profile page
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    Quote from wtbcrna
    Have you read through the entire AACN document on the DNP?
    I have, and I'm not impressed.
    Ellen NP likes this.
  6. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    Quote from elkpark
    I have, and I'm not impressed.
    Then what would you suggest the degree should be for APNs that graduate with semester credit hours that far exceed the number of credit hours it normally takes for a generic Masters (I graduated with 82 semester credit hours for my MSN/CRNA), and how would you decrease the time it takes for research to come into practice (approximately 17yrs right now) without additional education on EBP?
  7. Visit  elkpark} profile page
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    Quote from wtbcrna
    Then what would you suggest the degree should be for APNs that graduate with semester credit hours that far exceed the number of credit hours it normally takes for a generic Masters (I graduated with 82 semester credit hours for my MSN/CRNA), and how would you decrease the time it takes for research to come into practice (approximately 17yrs right now) without additional education on EBP?
    I have no suggestions -- I am of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school of thought on this. Feel free to think badly of me for that. And I doubt that "additional education on EBP" is going to make any significant difference.
  8. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    Quote from elkpark
    I have no suggestions -- I am of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school of thought on this. Feel free to think badly of me for that. And I doubt that "additional education on EBP" is going to make any significant difference.
    So...17 yrs to bring research into practice isn't broke or 82 semester hours to get an MSN that could have earned two generic Masters instead isn't broke? I'm not sure that your definition and my definition of broke are the same thing.
  9. Visit  PMFB-RN} profile page
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    Quote from wtbcrna
    That doesn't consider the fact that MSN/APN programs are credit over loaded and need to move to a clinical doctorate based on credit hours alone.
    *** I believe you about the large number of credit hours for only a masters. However if that is a rational behind the DNP why no simply re-lable the MSN a DNP without adding another year and even more credits to the DNP?
  10. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    Quote from PMFB-RN
    *** I believe you about the large number of credit hours for only a masters. However if that is a rational behind the DNP why no simply re-lable the MSN a DNP without adding another year and even more credits to the DNP?
    There are two problems: 1. The credit hours do not match the degree, and 2. the MSN isn't doing enough to address utilization of EBP.

    Bringing research into practice is huge in academia and the government right now. There are even degrees that focus on this particular phenomenon. What is Translational Science? | Tufts Clinical and Translational Science Institute National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences (NCATS)

    The DNP is one way nursing is addressing this problem.
  11. Visit  PMFB-RN} profile page
    1
    Quote from wtbcrna
    There are two problems: 1. The credit hours do not match the degree, and 2. the MSN isn't doing enough to address utilization of EBP.

    Bringing research into practice is huge in academia and the government right now. There are even degrees that focus on this particular phenomenon. What is Translational Science? | Tufts Clinical and Translational Science Institute National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences (NCATS)

    The DNP is one way nursing is addressing this problem.
    *** If, as you say, it takes 17 years for EBP to reach clinical practice currently, how long would it take if all APRNs had DNPs? Has anyone estimated this? Is there any evidence that the time would be less? Is it required that every single APRN hold a doctorate in order for us to inprove untilization of EBP?
    My obervation is that the bottle neck for faster EBP utilization is mostly administration related, not clinical practitioner related.
    elkpark likes this.
  12. Visit  wtbcrna} profile page
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    Quote from PMFB-RN
    *** If, as you say, it takes 17 years for EBP to reach clinical practice currently, how long would it take if all APRNs had DNPs? Has anyone estimated this? Is there any evidence that the time would be less? Is it required that every single APRN hold a doctorate in order for us to inprove untilization of EBP?
    My obervation is that the bottle neck for faster EBP utilization is mostly administration related, not clinical practitioner related.
    There are administrative bottle necks especially at the bedside nursing level, but at the APN level it is mostly provider driven that determines the use of EBP. As a CRNA I determine the drugs and techniques,usually based on EBP, that I think will benefit my patients the best with their anesthetic.

    It is funny how nurses in general are the only professional group that seems to balk at advancing their education whether it be ADN/BSN or MSN/DNP. Advanced nursing education has been shown to improve patient outcomes.
  13. Visit  elkpark} profile page
    1
    Quote from wtbcrna
    As a CRNA I determine the drugs and techniques,usually based on EBP, that I think will benefit my patients the best with their anesthetic.

    It is funny how nurses in general are the only professional group that seems to balk at advancing their education whether it be ADN/BSN or MSN/DNP. Advanced nursing education has been shown to improve patient outcomes.
    As a staff nurse 20 years ago, I used to base my individual practice on the most current information and evidence I could find. I didn't need an artificially inflated degree to do that, and I don't need one now. The problem isn't the education -- the problem is the individual choices people make about their own practices once they're out of school. As the old saw goes, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. And while there have been some studies suggesting a connection between higher levels of BSN-prepared RNs and better client outcomes (putting aside for the moment the questions about the validity of those studies), I'm not aware of any studies that suggest that DNP-prepared advanced practice nurses are doing any better a job, clinically or otherwise, than the existing MSN-prepared population. (Or maybe I'm just not aware of them, since I don't have a DNP and I'm too dumb to understand research. )
    PMFB-RN likes this.
  14. Visit  prairienp} profile page
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    As astaff nurse 30 years ago I also used the most current information. Additionaleducation (biostats and EBP) allowed me to understand the difference between avalid EBP study and those that were not.
    There are a plethora of studies supporting the BSN with improved incomes(magnet hospitals). The DNP is relatively new and the studies will be coming. Isuspect as with most other professional, when you increase the level ofeducation you get a better product. I do agree garbage in will often result ingarbage out as in any educational pursuit. I do not agree that when you take acapable motivated nurse that the educational level makes no difference, the greaterthe exposure the greater the potential.


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