Are you a nurse practitioner without any nursing experience? - page 2

Looking to find "that" nurse practitioner that I keep hearing about from other professions but have never come across that became a NP without any nursing experience. I have already been enlightened... Read More

  1. by   dubiousraves
    Quote from Jules A
    I like your points but would ask where in the hundreds of NP schools that are admitting and graduating anyone who can pay tuition are the rigorous programs and really how could a mere 500 clinical hours be maximized?
    I agree with you but I am one of those who thinks that all NP programs should be on site and include a more biomedical curriculum as well as a residency. I also think that NP and PA programs should merge into one profession.

    But RN experience does give a new NP confidence because you have already developed your patient communication style, you are familiar with medical equipment and are comfortable touching patients.
  2. by   JellyDonut
    The troubles we are seeing now and will continue to see are these for profit online programs. They do not have standards for entry that are beyond your check clearing. Do not get me wrong, I am sure there are a few experienced nurses who breezed through those programs and adjusted very nicely, but I do not believe that is the norm. Put a nurse without any experience and that is outright frightening.

    The NP system is broke, busted and needs to be fixed as this is or will have an impact on all of us. There needs to be actual qualifiers to enter a program. The curriculum needs to include more science and less nursing fluff (do not get me started on the foolish nursing theories). I am afraid if this ship is not righted then the NPs in the next 10 years are going to make a lot of patients worse off...
  3. by   chiromed0
    Well, I like what I read here for the most part. There are a lot of NP's w/o experience...real experience. However, for most NP programs just some
    on paper experience is what's needed to get in. Those are two very different animals. I just vowed that if I'm changing professions, unlike most of my counterparts that changed also from chiropractic to nursing, I was going to learn from the ground up. Personally, how can I call myself an advanced practice RN if I never practiced as an RN? Exactly! So that's what I did from cleaning poopy and vomit to holding a dying patient to running a code. Having said all that I agree with an earlier post that experience was really only useful in an inpatient setting. Clinically, I could have done without all of that and just gone straight from Chiro to NP, as many have, without a hitch. I just ethically couldn't do it b/c I feel like it cheapens the profession. So yes it can be done, has been done, and is still being done. No, it shouldn't be done. Combining PA's and NP's...interesting...what should we call ourselves? I hate "midlevel" and "assistant"...I don't assist, I practice so I think maybe MP's (Medical Practitioner?) or ABMD (Anything but medical doctor).
  4. by   MasterNursinator
    I know of 2 and they are both fantastic NPs.
  5. by   CoolLikeThat
    And people ask me why I will never let my children be seen by a midlevel.
  6. by   zedillo85
    Quote from CoolLikeThat
    And people ask me why I will never let my children be seen by a midlevel.
    Why not? The outcomes are the same with MD/DO primary care... per some studies.
  7. by   adammRN
    I've read research regarding how provider dependent healthcare is. The healthcare outcome you recieve is completely dependent on where you go, and the providers you have. Think about it. Is any human the same?

    Dr. DoesntCare vs Nurse Heartsinit Practitioner?
  8. by   ksisemo
    Quote from juan de la cruz
    I work with a few direct entry ACNP grads...in the ICU NP role, if you can believe that. I met them after they have been ICU NP's for a few years. They all graduated from a number of well established programs. A few had "pre-med" degrees in the biological sciences and worked in healthcare not in a direct patient care capacity but in research. They are up to par with those who had bedside experience as an RN but I have no idea what they were like when they were fresh out of school as we hired them with NP experience in a similarly-sized academic hospital ICU. Our local ACNP program, however, no longer accepts direct entry candidates.
    Does your program never accept direct entry candidates? Or will they accept them if they get experience elsewhere first (even though they graduated from said program)? Or if they spend some time getting RN experience? Just curious.
  9. by   juan de la cruz
    Quote from ksisemo
    Does your program never accept direct entry candidates? Or will they accept them if they get experience elsewhere first (even though they graduated from said program)? Or if they spend some time getting RN experience? Just curious.
    Without naming the actual institution, the school we are affiliated with is known for their competitive MEPN program. The school's website specifically states that MEPN students are no longer admitted to the NNP, AGACNP and peds ACNP programs. The AGCNS program admits MEPN students with the stipulation that nursing experience is obtained during the program. MEPN admission is still open to FNP, AGNP primary care, WHNP, and PMHNP programs. I am not involved in the administration of the school but I suspect there's a concern that students without relevant acute care experience would not fit in well with the way the acute care tracks are structured. Schools like Columbia, Yale, Penn, Vanderbilt accept direct entry for acute care.
  10. by   ksisemo
    Quote from juan de la cruz
    Without naming the actual institution, the school we are affiliated with is known for their competitive MEPN program. The school's website specifically states that MEPN students are no longer admitted to the NNP, AGACNP and peds ACNP programs. The AGCNS program admits MEPN students with the stipulation that nursing experience is obtained during the program. MEPN admission is still open to FNP, AGNP primary care, WHNP, and PMHNP programs. I am not involved in the administration of the school but I suspect there's a concern that students without relevant acute care experience would not fit in well with the way the acute care tracks are structured. Schools like Columbia, Yale, Penn, Vanderbilt accept direct entry for acute care.
    I understand now. I actually mistook your post to mean that your employer no longer hires students from direct entry programs. Thus the reason I asked those questions!

    Thanks!
  11. by   shibaowner
    I earned my BSN at one of the best nursing schools in the world and then straight into the MSN NP program. Many of the top nursing schools such as Hopkins, UCLA, Yale, etc. do not require RN experience before earning an MSN. I graduated with my MSN in Dec 2016 and had a job offer by Feb 2017. During my MSN studies, I did not see any advantage by students with RN experience, even in physical exam skills. In fact, there are a couple of studies on this. One study found that students with RN experience had worse academic performance and were less likely to graduate from MSN programs. Another found that students with RN experience had poorer clinical skills. I am an Adult and Geriatric Primary Care NP. I would say if you want to be an acute care NP, then the RN experience would be valuable. Personally, I really wanted to do Psych and got a job doing that at a clinic and they are providing me with an intensive 6 month training program. So, don't worry about the lack of RN experience. Good luck!
  12. by   Jules A
    Quote from shibaowner
    I earned my BSN at one of the best nursing schools in the world and then straight into the MSN NP program. Many of the top nursing schools such as Hopkins, UCLA, Yale, etc. do not require RN experience before earning an MSN. I graduated with my MSN in Dec 2016 and had a job offer by Feb 2017. During my MSN studies, I did not see any advantage by students with RN experience, even in physical exam skills. In fact, there are a couple of studies on this. One study found that students with RN experience had worse academic performance and were less likely to graduate from MSN programs. Another found that students with RN experience had poorer clinical skills. I am an Adult and Geriatric Primary Care NP. I would say if you want to be an acute care NP, then the RN experience would be valuable. Personally, I really wanted to do Psych and got a job doing that at a clinic and they are providing me with an intensive 6 month training program. So, don't worry about the lack of RN experience. Good luck!
    Please cite your source that those with actual nursing experience had worse clinical skills.
  13. by   BostonFNP
    Quote from Jules A
    Please cite your source that those with actual nursing experience had worse clinical skills.
    I suspect they are referencing this:

    Rich, E. R. (2005). Does RN experience relate to NP clinical skills?. The Nurse Practitioner, 30(12), 53-56.

    For those without access, the relevant discussion:

    "An unexpected finding was that there was a significant negativecorrelation between years of experience as a RN and NPclinical practice skills as assessed by the NPs’ collaboratingphysicians. Longer experience as a RN was associated withlower rankings of NP skills competency by the physicians."

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